Street Fund Tax in PDX...! (Portland: home, safe neighborhoods, salary)

[urbanlife78]

Originally Posted by Squidlo

I like Portland just fine. I think most of us have some sort of emotional attachment to Portland. What I do not like is irresponsible government. If you look at Portland's spending on projects it shows the priority of the city leaders. It was not infrastructure maintenance. Asking for new sources of revenue for roads when there is a system in place smacks of "well, we spent the money we had for roads on something else". I had an uncle like that. Nobody likes him either.

Has that system in place gone up to cover the rising cost of road maintenance? Seeing we want to see the city spend responsibly, what projects are they spending on that is taking away the allocated money that should be going to road maintenance, and has the cost of road maintenance increased in the city?

[urbanlife78]

Originally Posted by PDXNative2Houston

What this forum needs is people who view PDX objectively. The good, the bad and the ugly. Not cheerleaders nor naysayers.

Well then feel free to be that "objective" view if you think that is what you are doing.

[Squidlo]

Originally Posted by pdxMIKEpdx

I wonder what the saturation point as far as local taxes and "fees" go for the "normal" Portland resident is?
Do our city government leaders know, or will they just keep asking for more and more until a big revolt starts?

When will people start howling enough is enough?

And I wonder why people complain about "high" property taxes, but still don't realize that a full one third portion of those taxes is self imposed.

This is a crazy city sometimes.

It almost looks like voting for tax increases is like buying on credit. Everything is great until you get the bill.

Like another poster, I suspect that the average voter doesn't see the big picture. Politicians sell ideas to people, not the cost. Perhaps people may begin to see the connection when the bill hurts enough. An income tax skirts some of this by taxing unequally for something. Think of it like this: Charge admission to public spaces. If I go to a park in the city I pay admission of 25 dollars. My neighbor pays 6 dollars some people pay nothing. How is that fair? The folks who pay little to nothing think its great. As a politician in Portland, I have a formula for funding that is nearly guaranteed. Personally, I favor use taxes and consumptive taxes. I agree there is a certain general obligation by all to fund the basics like roads and parks. If a majority of voters never really feel the sting of the bill, why would they ever stop voting for every well crafted pork barrel that rolls out of city hall?

[bler144]

Originally Posted by Squidlo

Personally, I favor use taxes and consumptive taxes. I agree there is a certain general obligation by all to fund the basics like roads and parks.

Part of the issue is that there's not universal agreement on what "basics" are because values aren't wholly shared. For some people the security of Section 8 housing is a 'basic' and for others it isn't.

Even within parks some are wholly tax funded (city parks), and others are a mix of tax funding and consumptive use fees (metro parks). Roads are funded with a mix of income tax and gas tax.

I appreciate the desire to simplify the problem, but ultimately it remains a complex calculus in my opinion.

[Squidlo]

Originally Posted by urbanlife78

Has that system in place gone up to cover the rising cost of road maintenance? Seeing we want to see the city spend responsibly, what projects are they spending on that is taking away the allocated money that should be going to road maintenance, and has the cost of road maintenance increased in the city?

Improve the current revenue path before starting a new one? Why, suddenly do we need more different revenue? Explain it to me so I can understand.

I support fixing the roads. If the gas tax needs to rise so be it.

[urbanlife78]

Originally Posted by Squidlo

Improve the current revenue path before starting a new one? Why, suddenly do we need more different revenue? Explain it to me so I can understand.

I support fixing the roads. If the gas tax needs to rise so be it.

The gas tax probably needs to be raised, but here is the problem with raising the gas tax, only those that drive pay for the road maintenance.

How often do you hear just on this site that those that bike don't pay their fair share? This road tax would go to everyone in Portland regardless of their mode of transportation. I thought you guys would be in favor of taxing us who ride bikes?

[Squidlo]

Originally Posted by urbanlife78

The gas tax probably needs to be raised, but here is the problem with raising the gas tax, only those that drive pay for the road maintenance.

How often do you hear just on this site that those that bike don't pay their fair share? This road tax would go to everyone in Portland regardless of their mode of transportation. I thought you guys would be in favor of taxing us who ride bikes?

Nope, as long as no road money is spent on bike only roadway.

[urbanlife78]

Originally Posted by Squidlo

Nope, as long as no road money is spent on bike only roadway.

I can ride my bike on roads, when there isn't a bike lane, that means I can take up a car lane if need be. That must be a better option for you.

[Squidlo]

Originally Posted by bler144

Part of the issue is that there's not universal agreement on what "basics" are because values aren't wholly shared. For some people the security of Section 8 housing is a 'basic' and for others it isn't.

Even within parks some are wholly tax funded (city parks), and others are a mix of tax funding and consumptive use fees (metro parks). Roads are funded with a mix of income tax and gas tax.

I appreciate the desire to simplify the problem, but ultimately it remains a complex calculus in my opinion.

I am in the business of breaking down complex problems. Define a gap, break it into parts, address the largest problem first. If something is too complex for anyone to understand the opportunity for mishandling grows. Bottom line does it need to be so complex?

Does anyone have any idea of the amount of cronyism in Portland? How do you know if tax dollars are going to line someones pockets when we overpay for something? If you think of the local government as a benevolent being with just your interests at heart you might want to do some research or take the blue pill.

[take57]

Originally Posted by urbanlife78

The gas tax probably needs to be raised, but here is the problem with raising the gas tax, only those that drive pay for the road maintenance.

How often do you hear just on this site that those that bike don't pay their fair share? This road tax would go to everyone in Portland regardless of their mode of transportation. I thought you guys would be in favor of taxing us who ride bikes?

I'm guessing regardless of what the Bicycle Transportation Alliance and or Leah Treat might lead you to believe about their political influence, in actual numbers the amount of revenue generated by taxing bicycles would amount to a rounding error in the total budget. I'd be willing to let it slide.