Portlanders-what do you think of your leadership letting violent criminals riot, loot and destroy? (appointed, live)

[SusVelo]

Originally Posted by fruityfred11

1. There have been nightly riots since May 29.

Protest != Riots.

2. The DHS does not cause people to riot. That is absurd. If people choose to riot, that is on them and their own lack of principles. If robbery or rape (or rioting) became legal tomorrow, I wouldn't choose to partake in it. The DHS is enforcing the laws, as someone has to be.

Give me a break, the DHS didn't need to be here and were clearly sent here as a desperation political move to incite people. Your robbery or rape thing is pure lunacy and makes no point at all.

3. We have seen evidence that hundreds if not thousands of individuals have partaken in rioting in Portland since this all started. That is beyond a significant number. And if that means that 75% of the people who have been protesting have actually been peaceful, even better! Those 75% should be angry about the rioting as well. This "peaceful majority" should loathe the fact that their cause has been co-opted by terrorists. Why would they want to associate with that in any way, shape or form?

And I've seen evidence "rioting" didn't happen until aggressive police action was taken. Terrorist, really? Embellishment isn't going to help the core of your arguments. The peaceful majority do maintain a pretty good amount of control considering it's a gathering of immense proportions with a great deal of stress and police/federal antagonizing of the situation.

4. Portland Police Bureau deserves blame when excessive force occurs or due process is violated. So far I see a very scant percentage of examples of either of those things happening, especially when stacked against the numerous examples of rioters causing destruction and assaulting cops going unpunished and basically having their way night after night. Furthermore, the attempt by the city to scapegoat the police for their own malfeasance is simply sickening and I'm glad that Trump called them out on it. And I am no fan of Trump.

Things were calming down and progress was being made until the political stunt by Trump. Sure you're not a fan of trump, so many people claim that and when they say that I immediately know they're an embarrassed Trump voter.

This look like the resume of a DHS leader to you? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chad_Wolf
What a joke.

Ask yourself why, two months after George Floyd's death, Portland and to a lesser extent Seattle are the only cities to still be having these regular issues with riots night after night. A negligent local government that tolerates and in some cases even seemingly promotes this culture of violent outbursts, and then fails to take any accountability whatsoever until they literally come to their front door (as they did in Seattle with Jenny Durkan's house). The law abiding citizens around here shouldn't tolerate it and if you truly cared at all then you wouldn't either.

Some places have a high first amendment culture, I'm sorry that you don't appreciate that particular amendment. I'm sure you have your own favorites.

[fruityfred11]

Originally Posted by simply1

Protest != Riots.

Yes, there have been riots declared for 50+ consecutive days. What rock have you been living under? And why are you so eager to conflate destruction and boorish/illegal behavior with rightful protesting? Is it that you simply do not support those who are actually peacefully voicing their right to protest? Are you trying to smear them?

Give me a break, the DHS didn't need to be here and were clearly sent here as a desperation political move to incite people. Your robbery or rape thing is pure lunacy and makes no point at all.

Yes they did, and no, their presence in Portland certainly has not caused anyone to riot. No one is "incited" to the point of assaulting a cop, looting a jewelry store, or setting a federal building on fire. I'm sorry my point seemed to fly right over your sand-buried head. Now stop excusing illegal behavior.

And I've seen evidence "rioting" didn't happen until aggressive police action was taken. Terrorist, really? Embellishment isn't going to help the core of your arguments. The peaceful majority do maintain a pretty good amount of control considering it's a gathering of immense proportions with a great deal of stress and police/federal antagonizing of the situation.

By all means, provide said evidence. We'll wait.....

terrorist is defined as

the unlawful use of violence and intimidation, especially against civilians, in the pursuit of political aims.

Fits the bill I would say. People are using violence and intimidation to seek out their politic goals (in this case anarchy). If you have anything to counter that then by all means. Again, we'll wait....

Things were calming down and progress was being made until the political stunt by Trump. Sure you're not a fan of trump, so many people claim that and when they say that I immediately know they're an embarrassed Trump voter.

No they weren't, that is demonstrably false as shown by the nightly riots in Portland up until that point and the continued looting, vandalism, and arson occurring in the month of July when the federal government finally decided to intervene. And I won't touch the Trump nonsense since that is obviously a pathetic deflection attempt from someone who has no logical counters and is instead resorting to political hackery.

This look like the resume of a DHS leader to you? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chad_Wolf
What a joke.

Seems like he's at least interested in enforcing some of the federal laws. You know, the ones like federal buildings being targeted by riots.

Some places have a high first amendment culture, I'm sorry that you don't appreciate that particular amendment. I'm sure you have your own favorites.

Cool, show me where it says in the 1st Amendment you can assault people, vandalize property, set things on fire, and loot?

You're apparently a major sycophant for the radical left.

[SusVelo]

Originally Posted by fruityfred11

Yes, there have been riots declared for 50+ consecutive days. What rock have you been living under? And why are you so eager to conflate destruction and boorish/illegal behavior with rightful protesting? Is it that you simply do not support those who are actually peacefully voicing their right to protest? Are you trying to smear them?

Do you have a source for riots being declared every single day? Even then, color me shocked the police get to define when a riot is occurring and then start blasting people.

Yes they did, and no, their presence in Portland certainly has not caused anyone to riot. No one is "incited" to the point of assaulting a cop, looting a jewelry store, or setting a federal building on fire. I'm sorry my point seemed to fly right over your sand-buried head. Now stop excusing illegal behavior.


By all means, provide said evidence. We'll wait.....

slap phone to break window, declare riot!!!!!!
https://twitter.com/KBOO/status/1282954116424073217

terrorist is defined as



Fits the bill I would say. People are using violence and intimidation to seek out their politic goals (in this case anarchy). If you have anything to counter that then by all means. Again, we'll wait....

Against civilians? Did you miss that part of your own definition? It's almost like you could call whoever you want a terrorist. I mean you get decide on level of violence, you get to decide level of intimidation. Oh wait, you don't get to decide, silly you.

No they weren't, that is demonstrably false as shown by the nightly riots in Portland up until that point and the continued looting, vandalism, and arson occurring in the month of July when the federal government finally decided to intervene. And I won't touch the Trump nonsense since that is obviously a pathetic deflection attempt from someone who has no logical counters and is instead resorting to political hackery.

You keep referencing nightly riots. Tell me what time do the riots start, right when any protestors show up? When police start getting physical? Take a stab at it, since you're like involved in any way other than whatever ****ty filtered news source you have.

Seems like he's at least interested in enforcing some of the federal laws. You know, the ones like federal buildings being targeted by riots.

Hey that's great, can't wait for the left to use this created Gestapo. I'm sure then you'll be against an overly powerful federal government, quaking in your militia boots. lol.

Cool, show me where it says in the 1st Amendment you can assault people, vandalize property, set things on fire, and loot?

You're apparently a major sycophant for the radical left.

Why would I need to show you that, when the protests aren't that and the majority certainly aren't doing that.

[mmh1030]

Originally Posted by simply1

Do you believe the protests were riots that entire time? Do you believe it’s been made better or worse by federal agencies under the direction of a dhs puppet? How many people are protesting versus looting? Does the PPB deserve any blame at all?

I work a block from ground zero. I walk the area every day to survey the fresh damage, and have from day 1. Some days it is minor, other days it is more extensive. The crowds were getting smaller and smaller before DHS showed up, but there was still fresh damage daily. The crowds have obviously grown a lot since DHS arrived, but the daily damage isn't much worse, so more peaceful protesters seem to be out now.

I don't survey how many people are causing damage compared to total protest size - i just see the results in the mornings, and occasionally catch a glimpse of the crowd at night when i leave work late.

How many people are protesting peacefully v. committing vandalism is (unfortunately) not really material to the reputational damage caused by night after night of violent imagery on the national news - this will not be quickly lost. If you are one of the peaceful protesters and see someone committing vandalism, you should speak up and ask them to stop. It would help your cause - the damage makes the whole movement look less favorable.

Re blame, police aren't breaking the windows at Jimmy Johns or painting graffiti on Case Study Coffee. If you are asking whether i think that property damage to these and other businesses is justified because of other bad actions of the police, my answer is no - anger toward the police is not properly directed at storefronts in the vicinity.

The protests have a worthy underlying cause. Nightly vandalism does not help the cause. And things like the number of peaceful protesters v. vandals doesn't matter to many people - all they see is the mess that downtown has become.

[doc1]

Originally Posted by simply1

Just what we needed, another concerned right winger thread.

Fair enough.

What do the concerned left wingers think of their political leader's handling of the looting, arson and violence?

You've posted here multiple times without expressing you opinion of the subject matter in the OP other than attacking the poster.

I've got a feeling that's all you'll contribute on this one.

[Bamaman1]

My question is what does a community or state have to do to recall politicians that do not follow the rule of law?

What laws are they personally breaking?

How do you kick them out of office?

[Jimrob1]

I see on the news that the mayor of Portland has been teargassed.

[atlguy44]

The leadership was in the thick of things and got gassed. I'm guessing that says a lot. Stayed in that area late last year. The homelessness and general lack of a solution to fix the issue was apparent. Closer to the Amtrak station was even worse.

[ColoradoOnMyMind]

Portland is unwell, leadership is feckless. Time for the citizens to demand action against the mob.

[JumpingRoo]

Originally Posted by simply1

Just what we needed, another concerned right winger thread.

You sum up perfectly the far left white kids that make up Portland. Everyone is laughing at the situation in Portland caused by privileged white kids except you. Poor kids trying to feel oppressed as they live in one of the least diverse cities.

Keep deflecting and projecting, it's comical.