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Old 11-17-2013, 05:40 PM
 
Location: Utica, NY
1,911 posts, read 2,796,372 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imcurious View Post
I do think that their disregard for the effects on others could be considered selfish. If they end their lives in a violent way, they have to have considered that someone will find them - in that way, you could say they are selfish or perhaps "passive-aggressive." Some may do it as a way to punish - to say "F You" to the world and whomever finds them. That's not "nice."
I suffer from depression for several reasons and have had suicidal thoughts. I find your last 2 sentences extremely offensive. You do not get it at all. But most people can't (in your defense).

People in such pain are not capable of thinking of others in that regard.
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Old 11-17-2013, 05:46 PM
 
Location: earth?
7,288 posts, read 11,982,481 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by non-creep View Post
I suffer from depression for several reasons and have had suicidal thoughts. I find your last 2 sentences extremely offensive. You do not get it at all. But most people can't (in your defense).

People in such pain are not capable of thinking of others in that regard.
Many human beings have had bouts of depression and suicidal ideation.

When you are thinking about suicide and you think of your plan, and especially if you write a note, you KNOW someone is going to find you, and YOU DON'T CARE how it affects them, or worse, perhaps you unconsciously want to punish them. I am sorry the truth offends you.
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Old 11-17-2013, 05:50 PM
 
Location: Utica, NY
1,911 posts, read 2,796,372 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vesperbelle View Post
No not selfish, they need help. They are mentally ill and need help/treatment/support/love. They can't even find the answers to help themselves how can they be expected to think of how others might feel. When someone has been feeling so low for so long and that tunnel that they're in keeps getting deeper and darker making the light they once saw eventually shut off...causing them to do what they feel will release them from their pain. Their hands are tied as they are a slave to their mental disease. Those poor souls are in a place that is so beyond anything any one of us can ever imagine and their deep despair feels like a thousand knives cutting at them. They beg to be released from their mental torture. They sit in solitude wrestling with their emotions. Hands tied, eyes wet with tears. They beg for it to cease.

How can this be selfish?

My friend hung herself when she was very young. Everyone knew she was cutting herself, her family, her friends. Why couldn't anyone stop her or help her? I was only 16 years old. I tried to help, I couldn't find the right words or the right things to do, just wasn't able to change her course.
There was most likely nothing you could have done anyway. Someone in that much pain just wants out and they'll be determined to find a way out. Often people plot and plan their own suicides for years, but don't tell anyone or even give too many clues away. Those that do try to cry for help first are often dismissed, mistreated by family and friends and the system in general which is still nowhere near advanced enough to treat illnesses like depression to the point where at least sufferers can have some semblance of a life and manage their symptoms.

Some people just cannot have any kind of life that doesn't involve years of pain, suffering and turmoil. Many families are actually selfish for expecting the sufferer to carry on while not really stepping in to help that person. They won't listen and their only advice is to take this pill or go see a therapist.

Getting treatment in this country is very expensive too as most insurance companies don't cover much in the way of mental health. Some people have crappy insurance or no insurance at all. What are these people to do? The old "check yourself into the hospital" advice is a crock. Been there done that. They didn't do anything for me except keep me overnight as give me a $900 bill. That's the reality.

I'm so sorry about your friend but you seem to have a good understanding of what it's like to get to that point. You are a better person for it.
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Old 11-17-2013, 05:53 PM
 
Location: Utica, NY
1,911 posts, read 2,796,372 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imcurious View Post
Many human beings have had bouts of depression and suicidal ideation.

When you are thinking about suicide and you think of your plan, and especially if you write a note, you KNOW someone is going to find you, and YOU DON'T CARE how it affects them, or worse, perhaps you unconsciously want to punish them. I am sorry the truth offends you.
That's quite a set of assumptions there. You claim that lots of people commit suicide to punish others which just shows your ignorance on the subject. If you don't know what you're talking about, why bother, unless it's just to wind people up?

Truth doesn't offend me but what you wrote is not the truth but rather ignorance. Sorry if that offends you.
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Old 11-17-2013, 05:58 PM
 
14,788 posts, read 15,462,213 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imcurious View Post
I do think that their disregard for the effects on others could be considered selfish. If they end their lives in a violent way, they have to have considered that someone will find them - in that way, you could say they are selfish or perhaps "passive-aggressive." Some may do it as a way to punish - to say "F You" to the world and whomever finds them. That's not "nice."
What are you basing this statement on?
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Old 11-17-2013, 06:01 PM
 
Location: Not where I want to be
4,830 posts, read 8,037,365 times
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My older sister committed suicide a few years ago. She was 54 at the time and jumped off the roof of her apartment building. She was mentally ill --- tormented her entire life by the physical, emotional, and sexual abuse she suffered by our father. She was on medication and was seeing a therapist but she just couldn't take it anymore and ended her suffering.

Do I think she was selfish? Absolutely not
Do I think she was self-absorbed? Absolutely not.

She was one of the most loving, caring, and generous people you would ever meet and was able to take care of everyone else but (unfortunately) not herself.

I only hope she is finally feeling safe and in peace.

Last edited by Amisi; 11-17-2013 at 06:43 PM..
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Old 11-17-2013, 06:02 PM
 
Location: earth?
7,288 posts, read 11,982,481 times
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For all of the supporters of suicide without consequences or consideration of the effects on others, I am going to bow out of this conversation - if you are so vested in your right to do whatever you want without considering the impact on others - nothing I can say is going to change that.

I am just offering an opinion.

I wish you luck and I hope you get the help you need and that your emotional and spiritual wounds will be healed.
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Old 11-17-2013, 07:04 PM
 
Location: Canada
6,467 posts, read 5,437,166 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lilyflower3191981 View Post

Do you believe people who committed suicide are selfish?
No, they are sick, depressed, desperate and have just given up on ever having a chance of happiness and a good life.

They don't even consider themselves being selfish, they just want to be done with the life they are living.
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Old 11-17-2013, 07:44 PM
 
Location: Somewhere
8,070 posts, read 6,105,939 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imcurious View Post
I wish you luck and I hope you get the help you need and that your emotional and spiritual wounds will be healed.
It's an opinion, it doesn't necessarily mean we have spiritual wounds. I haven't been affected by suicide but I don't judge those who choose that path. It's their life and for some people life can be quite difficult
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Old 11-17-2013, 09:03 PM
 
Location: Not where I want to be
4,830 posts, read 8,037,365 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imcurious View Post
I do think that their disregard for the effects on others could be considered selfish. If they end their lives in a violent way, they have to have considered that someone will find them - in that way, you could say they are selfish or perhaps "passive-aggressive." Some may do it as a way to punish - to say "F You" to the world and whomever finds them. That's not "nice."

Not true. When my sister jumped off her building, she had no forward thoughts of who was going to find her or anything else. She was at her absolute end and could take no more suffering. I don't even think she knew what she was doing. She opened her window, went out on the fire escape, climbed up to the roof, ran across it and jumped off.

My sister would never, ever have wanted to upset anyone or punish anyone or say "f you" to the world. That wasn't how she was. She was a tormented soul and she was only trying to end her suffering.
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