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That moment of realization is called "surrender" and it requires "courage... both on the list.
Some folks are stuck in lower states of consciousness and some folks claim that some of those do it on purpose, kind of like a fear of success... fear of the scary and vast "unknown".
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unsettomati
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Forgiving is not about those who are being forgiven.
That moment of realization is called "surrender" and it requires "courage... both on the list.
Some folks are stuck in lower states of consciousness and some folks claim that some of those do it on purpose, kind of like a fear of success... fear of the scary and vast "unknown".
If the person who hurt you is gone out of your life, and you are still holding onto the hurt, then that makes that person still in your life continuing to hurt you.
Best thing to not let that person have power to hurt you anymore - let them go. find a way even though it may be hard, but let - it - go… let it go.
you might have to write them a letter, then ceremoniously rip it up and throw it into the fireplace, or over a lake or ocean, or some ceremony like that…
Why do some people think nothing of lying and cheating people. That's because they know that they will be forgiven.
This is an excellent point. I am a therapist and have never been a fan of the "you must forgive to be healthy" mantra. No, you need to process what has happened to you and move on. The best we can do is get to a place of apathy. "X did Y to me but I'm not giving it my energy and am moving FWD w my life, without X in it."
The saddest part of the "must forgive" attitude is the shame attached to all who DO NOT or CANNOT forgive. Too many people judge others in this respect when we can never have any idea how a certain act affects anyone because we are not that person. Just because one person can forgive their father for sexual abuse, for example, does NOT mean everyone can. We all have different brain structures, come w different struggles and experiences which the "forgive movement" does not take into account.
I'm personally estranged from an entire side of my family. This was a conscious decision after many years of lies and manipulations and i do not regret my decision. What I DO regret is listening to EVERY ONE around me telling me I had to stay in touch because "they're your family. .. she's your mother." Playing on my guilt this way was very effective as my family had been doing it for years. No one knows what I endured, yet I get labeled "they're he bad one" because of course, what kind of person does not talk to her mother? And yet do we ever lecture people to forgive those who raped their children? Who killed their siblings?
Forgiveness should not be treated as a "one size fits all" solution. Not much in (mental) health care is.
I once dated a great guy who got clean and sober in a 12-step program that he worked diligently. He took the making amends to people he had harmed very seriously and he repaired his relationships with family and many friends. He said he found the order to follow through with forgiveness to those who had harmed him a lot harder.
He said, "They tell me to pray for them. Well, all I can come up with is to pray that they get what they deserve. I don't think that's so bad though. I genuinely mean the higher powers can decide what they deserve. If I see them getting all good things, I'll take it that maybe I was wrong about them. But if I see them getting bad things, I'll assume it's their karma. I DO pray for them."
This is an excellent point. I am a therapist and have never been a fan of the "you must forgive to be healthy" mantra. No, you need to process what has happened to you and move on. The best we can do is get to a place of apathy. "X did Y to me but I'm not giving it my energy and am moving FWD w my life, without X in it."
The saddest part of the "must forgive" attitude is the shame attached to all who DO NOT or CANNOT forgive. Too many people judge others in this respect when we can never have any idea how a certain act affects anyone because we are not that person. Just because one person can forgive their father for sexual abuse, for example, does NOT mean everyone can. We all have different brain structures, come w different struggles and experiences which the "forgive movement" does not take into account.
I'm personally estranged from an entire side of my family. This was a conscious decision after many years of lies and manipulations and i do not regret my decision. What I DO regret is listening to EVERY ONE around me telling me I had to stay in touch because "they're your family. .. she's your mother." Playing on my guilt this way was very effective as my family had been doing it for years. No one knows what I endured, yet I get labeled "they're he bad one" because of course, what kind of person does not talk to her mother? And yet do we ever lecture people to forgive those who raped their children? Who killed their siblings?
Forgiveness should not be treated as a "one size fits all" solution. Not much in (mental) health care is.
There is no shame at all, I can't even imagine what book you read that told you to feel shame for not bein able to forgive.
Again I feel I have to reiterate, forgive in the way we are talking about it does NOT involved talking to the offending person, telling them you are forgiving them and most especially not allowing them back into your life. It is an internal process, and it remains internal. You can forgive someone while also never speaking to the person again.
Those family members you mention, they are simply toxic people, they are not part of any movement we are discussing. This is more a spiritual movement and again, involves internal actions, not external.
This is an excellent point. I am a therapist and have never been a fan of the "you must forgive to be healthy" mantra. No, you need to process what has happened to you and move on. The best we can do is get to a place of apathy. "X did Y to me but I'm not giving it my energy and am moving FWD w my life, without X in it."
The saddest part of the "must forgive" attitude is the shame attached to all who DO NOT or CANNOT forgive. Too many people judge others in this respect when we can never have any idea how a certain act affects anyone because we are not that person. Just because one person can forgive their father for sexual abuse, for example, does NOT mean everyone can. We all have different brain structures, come w different struggles and experiences which the "forgive movement" does not take into account.
I'm personally estranged from an entire side of my family. This was a conscious decision after many years of lies and manipulations and i do not regret my decision. What I DO regret is listening to EVERY ONE around me telling me I had to stay in touch because "they're your family. .. she's your mother." Playing on my guilt this way was very effective as my family had been doing it for years. No one knows what I endured, yet I get labeled "they're he bad one" because of course, what kind of person does not talk to her mother? And yet do we ever lecture people to forgive those who raped their children? Who killed their siblings?
Forgiveness should not be treated as a "one size fits all" solution. Not much in (mental) health care is.
Yes i agree you have to process it, and forgiveness is not forced, its a conscious decision to let it go what hurt you. I agree with you that the person should not be guilt-tripped into it. What you said is true about not giving it my energy and moving on with my life. Yes!
guilt and shaming is a no. i totally agree with you there.
This is an excellent point. I am a therapist and have never been a fan of the "you must forgive to be healthy" mantra. No, you need to process what has happened to you and move on. The best we can do is get to a place of apathy. "X did Y to me but I'm not giving it my energy and am moving FWD w my life, without X in it."
The saddest part of the "must forgive" attitude is the shame attached to all who DO NOT or CANNOT forgive. Too many people judge others in this respect when we can never have any idea how a certain act affects anyone because we are not that person. Just because one person can forgive their father for sexual abuse, for example, does NOT mean everyone can. We all have different brain structures, come w different struggles and experiences which the "forgive movement" does not take into account.
I'm personally estranged from an entire side of my family. This was a conscious decision after many years of lies and manipulations and i do not regret my decision. What I DO regret is listening to EVERY ONE around me telling me I had to stay in touch because "they're your family. .. she's your mother." Playing on my guilt this way was very effective as my family had been doing it for years. No one knows what I endured, yet I get labeled "they're he bad one" because of course, what kind of person does not talk to her mother? And yet do we ever lecture people to forgive those who raped their children? Who killed their siblings?
Forgiveness should not be treated as a "one size fits all" solution. Not much in (mental) health care is.
Some folks don't get your "shame" comment, but I do. I really, really do. I was "spiritually bullied" by fellow churchmates, because of my "unforgiveness" for an exceptionally evil sibling's acts, ony to buy into the bs and hold out an olive branch. The results were heartbreaking and ended up putting a bigger wall between my mother and I and a FINAL wall between that sibling and I. Yes, I was shamed into "forgiving lest I not be forgiven".
Fortunately, I ended up going into the nursing profession, where I realized that I had a PASSION for abnormal mental health. It was then and only then that I was able to truly forgive my family members, because i realized that they were truly mentally ill. Well damn, that solved THAT!
I do not have a relationship with my mother. She is a mean, nasty alcoholic, who I had forgiven over and over again. I no longer have any forgiveness in my heart for her.
So, IMO this forgiveness movement also requires some boundaries, if not, the toxic person will continue to crap all over you, again and again, as they hold the power over you... due to your forgiving heart.
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