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Originally Posted by Fran66 View Post
I agree with you completely, Sydlee. And if our friends dumped us when we made bad decisions or behaved badly, none of us would have any friends. All of us have done at least one thing that's not honorable or wise.
Not true. I've never done something that is "not honorable or wise".
We're not talking about wisdom that comes with age, like picking up a bad habit of smoking or buying too many clothes or credit card debt or whatnot either. We're talking about a CORE VALUE. So adding "wise" to the list is obfuscating the issue, IMO.
Core values. Like stealing. Human abuse. Animal abuse. Getting paid but not doing your work. Intentional injury. Fraud. etc etc.
I would also put having kids you can't take care of in that category AND repeated abortions but that would eliminate a large portion of the population as not honorable or wise. Ditto having the taxpayer pay for your life.
I would also put having kids you can't take care of in that category AND repeated abortions but that would eliminate a large portion of the population as not honorable or wise. Ditto having the taxpayer pay for your life.
So.... because more women have repeated abortions than have affairs they get a pass from you on their skankalicious ways. Welfare scroungers get a pass because they are... ... 1% of the population? I think I'm seeing the pattern here. Newsflash: any child is a child "you can't take care of" in post recession America... unless you are in the top 10%. The number of women who have had repeated abortions is actually NOT very high and the real welfare scam is the able bodied people filing for permanent disability.
Based on my 6 month experience I would not recommend this to anyone.
Based on years of experience (not consecutive) I would recommend this to everyone! Been off the market over 8 years now with someone I wouldn't have met any other way. So the online thing isn't for you. Fine. Not everything is for everybody. But... just asking... the IRL approach you espouse... how's that working for ya?
Based on years of experience (not consecutive) I would recommend this to everyone! Been off the market over 8 years now with someone I wouldn't have met any other way. So the online thing isn't for you. Fine. Not everything is for everybody. But... just asking... the IRL approach you espouse... how's that working for ya?
None of your business.
But I'd take my chances in real life any day over the overall cesspool of OLD.
I have heard it works for some people and for most others especially men, not so much. And it took you "years." I'll pass.
Met my ex wife that way and it turned out to be the biggest mistake of my life. Went back after the divorce for 6 months and asked myself why I went back. It was a horrible experience for me.
But I'd take my chances in real life any day over the overall cesspool of OLD.
I have heard it works for some people and for most others especially men, not so much. And it took you "years." I'll pass.
Met my ex wife that way and it turned out to be the biggest mistake of my life. Went back after the divorce for 6 months and asked myself why I went back. It was a horrible experience for me.
It was a rhetorical question, John. The point remains, however. And I'm glad we're clear. OLD does not work for John13. Others should definitely give it a try because it does work. 20% of new marriages are because of OLD. And no one ever said OLD would be quick and painless.
It was a rhetorical question, John. The point remains, however. And I'm glad we're clear. OLD does not work for John13. Others should definitely give it a try because it does work. 20% of new marriages are because of OLD. And no one ever said OLD would be quick and painless.
H
I guess you are determined to get the last word in.
No, it's not just "John13" as you put it. It doesn't work for most people. Some like yourself, yes.
Out of those 20% marriages you mention (if true) about half will end up in a painful divorce, just like mine did. For those that want marriage that means one has a far greater chance by not using it. Instead concentrate IRL or maybe another way online instead of dating sites which are a cesspool for the most part.
It's not worth it folks and is indeed highly overrated.
Not true. I've never done something that is "not honorable or wise".
We're not talking about wisdom that comes with age, like picking up a bad habit of smoking or buying too many clothes or credit card debt or whatnot either. We're talking about a CORE VALUE. So adding "wise" to the list is obfuscating the issue, IMO.
Core values. Like stealing. Human abuse. Animal abuse. Getting paid but not doing your work. Intentional injury. Fraud. etc etc.
I would also put having kids you can't take care of in that category AND repeated abortions but that would eliminate a large portion of the population as not honorable or wise. Ditto having the taxpayer pay for your life.
If you're human and you've lived long enough, you've made mistakes, quite possibly actions that were "not honorable or wise." No one is immune to making mistakes, including big "core value" ones. You are human, after all.
As kids, my friends and I all thought as you do. Oh no, we would *never* do that. No way, no how. And you know what? Life happens -- and not usually in the way you thought it would. Sometimes really, really crappy stuff happens. Sometimes it's your fault, sometimes it isn't, but in each case, life hits you hard and often, and sometimes you struggle every day just to know which way is up. It's all you can do to get up every morning, go to work, pay the bills on time, take care of your family, and stay "normal."
No one is perfect. When we are at our most vulnerable, we sometimes make bad choices -- even ones that might violate the very "core values" we always said we would never violate. Growing up and dealing with real life over the course of years has a way of testing you in ways you could never imagine.
A person who says "Oh, I would never, ever, in a million years do that!" makes me wonder, makes me think: We'll see. Only time will tell.
I feel bad for such a person, because when they do make a mistake, they'll have to deal not only with judgmental friends who abandon them as a result (assuming they've surrounded themselves with similar-minded people), but they'll also have to deal with their own personal shame and self-flagellation (unless they delude themselves into believing they did nothing wrong in order to uphold this image of themselves that they would never, ever violate their "core values"). They will feel so alone and abandoned.
I do hope that person will have at least one understanding friend to help him/her pick up the pieces when all is said and done. No one has to condone the action in question, but it would be good to help up a fellow human being who has stumbled and fallen.
I agree with you completely, Sydlee. And if our friends dumped us when we made bad decisions or behaved badly, none of us would have any friends. All of us have done at least one thing that's not honorable or wise.
+1.
Quote:
Originally Posted by runswithscissors
Not true. I've never done something that is "not honorable or wise".
We're not talking about wisdom that comes with age, like picking up a bad habit of smoking or buying too many clothes or credit card debt or whatnot either. We're talking about a CORE VALUE. So adding "wise" to the list is obfuscating the issue, IMO.
Core values. Like stealing. Human abuse. Animal abuse. Getting paid but not doing your work. Intentional injury. Fraud. etc etc.
I would also put having kids you can't take care of in that category AND repeated abortions but that would eliminate a large portion of the population as not honorable or wise. Ditto having the taxpayer pay for your life.
I think you are assuming your version of honorable or wise is automatically the correct definition because otherwise, you too will fall in the category of everyone else who has done something that isn't honorable or wise.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sydlee
If you're human and you've lived long enough, you've made mistakes, quite possibly actions that were "not honorable or wise." No one is immune to making mistakes, including big "core value" ones. You are human, after all.
As kids, my friends and I all thought as you do. Oh no, we would *never* do that. No way, no how. And you know what? Life happens -- and not usually in the way you thought it would. Sometimes really, really crappy stuff happens. Sometimes it's your fault, sometimes it isn't, but in each case, life hits you hard and often, and sometimes you struggle every day just to know which way is up. It's all you can do to get up every morning, go to work, pay the bills on time, take care of your family, and stay "normal."
No one is perfect. When we are at our most vulnerable, we sometimes make bad choices -- even ones that might violate the very "core values" we always said we would never violate. Growing up and dealing with real life over the course of years has a way of testing you in ways you could never imagine.
A person who says "Oh, I would never, ever, in a million years do that!" makes me wonder, makes me think: We'll see. Only time will tell.
I feel bad for such a person, because when they do make a mistake, they'll have to deal not only with judgmental friends who abandon them as a result (assuming they've surrounded themselves with similar-minded people), but they'll also have to deal with their own personal shame and self-flagellation (unless they delude themselves into believing they did nothing wrong in order to uphold this image of themselves that they would never, ever violate their "core values"). They will feel so alone and abandoned.
I do hope that person will have at least one understanding friend to help him/her pick up the pieces when all is said and done. No one has to condone the action in question, but it would be good to help up a fellow human being who has stumbled and fallen.
People who have a "friend" who would abandon them when they do something the friend disagrees with morally never really had a friend in the first place. They were actually keeping company with a fundamentalist preacher disguised as a friend.
+1. I think you are assuming your version of honorable or wise is automatically the correct definition because otherwise, you too will fall in the category of everyone else who has done something that isn't honorable or wise.
People who have a "friend" who would abandon them when they do something the friend disagrees with morally never really had a friend in the first place. They were actually keeping company with a fundamentalist preacher disguised as a friend.
Horrible comparison especially since I am an atheist.
Most everyone has deal breakers but my guess is you don't have any. This would be one of mine. Hurting other human beings, which in this case is contributing to a very bad lie, is something I would not tolerate. I just don't know how someone could do something like that. In almost all cases it is very easy for a women to get a sex partner and this person has to hook up with someone who has a family. It's amazing to me you and a few others see nothing wrong with this. It would be hard for me to look at them. And I won't anymore.
There are plenty of willing not committed people out there to have sex with. In my view being friends with someone like is likely a future setup to stab you in the back in one way or another.
It's not 'preaching" just to drop the friend and let her go do her thing.
My, now ex, was cheating, lying, lied to me about school, lied to me about money I gave her, lied to me about putting our son in harms way of a person who had already touched him inappropriately once (yes, I talked with the police, long story) which I had told her he could never be around again.
If those things were going on with the kids then I believe you are even MORE at fault to any exposure that your children went through due to your wife's poor choices. The fact that you chose to lie, sneak around, possibly leaving them alone with their mom while you banged your latest squeeze under those conditions shows you were not the greatest parent, either. And I am sorry, all I see is crappy justification for crappy choices. you should have divorced and gotten your kids away from your wife, not had an affair! Sheesh! Way to put the kids first.
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It was a horrible experience for me.
All of us have done at least one thing that's not honorable or wise.
