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FWIW I think he sounds like he has Aspergers. Especially the obsessive thoughts and fixations on particular subjects. Seems his current fixation is on parties. I'm not sure what from the posts is making people on this forum say he has bipolar disorder or depression rather than Aspergers.
OP I think it's very important to get him back in treatment. I'd recommend going to a LCSW yourself for guidance on how to deal with this difficult situation.
Thanks so much for your feedback. I really appreciate it. I also believe he has the correct diagnoses. I agree that it's important to get him back into treatment, but how can he be forced to go? That is what is so hard for us. The therapist we were going to is only about 15 min from his college and my husband and I were paying for it. He only had to show up. I think he probably heard things he did not want to hear and he did not like it. There is an area youth paster who is closer to his age and currently deals with teenage Asperger adults. This youth pastor is a bit known for being a "cool young, hip guy" and my son said before he would "think" about talking to him. He is no counselor, but may be able to provide some direction.
Thanks for your reply. I sincerely appreciate it. I can see where some of the symptoms mentioned may be similar to bipolor or depressive symptoms. He was actually tested at a very well respected facility by more than one doctor who specializes in various mental health issues with young adults. Can I ask what about him does not sound at all like Aspergers? I'm just curious as you are in the profession.
Other symptoms from throughout his life include:very delayed speech, speech therapy, tourettes symptoms which consisted of repetitive mild throat clearing, some tactile issues in early elementary such as sucking on the color of his shirt, becoming fixated on things in middle-high school including movies, cultures, health, music. He is self taught at guitar and can learn songs fairly quick. He's charming at first, then when people get to know him his quirkiness turns them off. He does not understand literal versus figurative. His idea of funny jokes are not so funny. On the bright side, he's a handsome young man and loves to dress well. He looks and appears very "normal" per se, but once others get to know him, they tend to drift away. He seems to pick up on things fairly quick, then when it becomes difficult, he drops it (except for guitar). He also cannot take "clues" from people. People don't mind listening to him play a song on the guitar at a family gathering, but when he begins to follow people around all night playing songs when people want to visit with others, it becomes an irritant. I know I threw a lot of things out there, but wanted to provide just a bit more background on him.
Thanks you once again. Your insight is appreciated.
If those doctors say he has Aspergers I'd trust them far more than some Internet person with a "degree". He sounds like he has Aspergers Syndrome.
Thanks so much for your feedback. I really appreciate it. I also believe he has the correct diagnoses. I agree that it's important to get him back into treatment, but how can he be forced to go? That is what is so hard for us. The therapist we were going to is only about 15 min from his college and my husband and I were paying for it. He only had to show up. I think he probably heard things he did not want to hear and he did not like it. There is an area youth paster who is closer to his age and currently deals with teenage Asperger adults. This youth pastor is a bit known for being a "cool young, hip guy" and my son said before he would "think" about talking to him. He is no counselor, but may be able to provide some direction.
Thank you again for taking the time to reply.
I think an LCSW will have ideas of what you could do. I think you have good reason yourself to seek therapy from a LCSW and they will help you. You don't have to be mentally ill to benefit from therapy.
As an adult he can't be forced to go, but perhaps there is a way you can provide incentive for him to go. It could involve the kind of tough love such as on the show Intervention where family gives an addict an ultimatum. I think you should seek professional guidance as to what you should do however rather than just listening to some fool like me who doesn't really know what he's talking about.
I was diagnosed with Autism Spectrum Disorder (Asperger's) last year, and if your son has it chances are the last thing he wanted to do was hurt you. My mother and I never got along very well, because we never took the time to try to understand each other. She was so busy concentrating on my lack of respect for social conventions that she came off as an unhappy woman who liked to nag people. I ignored her as much as I could, and eventually she didn't push the issue and we started to get along a little. We never had a really close relationship, though. She didn't understand me or want to take the time to. That didn't change until she was on her deathbed. I wish we would have had some kind of intervention sooner, really, because I missed a lot by not getting to know her. I was more or less just a child, though, so I couldn't really process what needed to be done for us to get along. I just knew that it wasn't happening. Mom would often embarrass me, and I thought she did it on purpose, so I avoided her. Looking, back, though, I realize I was way too sensitive and very afraid of social situations. It's likely that she didn't even realize that she was doing it. We missed so many years. I wish she would have just taken the initiative, paid attention, and trusted her instinct that something just "wasn't right" with me. We probably could have avoided a lot of heartache and power struggles had I gotten my diagnosis sooner.
I have OCD, various tics, and mild social anxiety. It really hurts to try to socialize if you don't know the rules. I often just stayed away from people to avoid all of the awkwardness and teasing. That can really weigh on a person's self-esteem. I was also too eager to please my peers as a child. I would have probably done the house party thing in a heartbeat if I would have thought our house was big enough and my parents would have let me get away with it, the folly of youth! As it stood, though, I forged a very close relationship with my parents, because I felt like they were the only ones who understood me and were willing to help me. Mom later found out she was dying and betrayed my trust, but that's another story. Dad and I continue to get along well, and he thinks he may have Asperger's.
A little off topic, but he does not sound like an Asperger's person at all to me-it sounds a lot more more like bipolar or depressive symptoms but I really can't tell you anything for sure, of course. I have undergrad and graduate psychological training, and although I certainly don't know everything, I'd get a second opinion on that diagnosis if I were you. Asperger's is greatly overdiagnosed now. In order for your son to function as well as possible, a proper diagnosis (if he even has one at all) is essential.
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Originally Posted by CA4Now
I'd have to agree. He seems to have symptoms of Bipolar II disorder.
Asperger's disorder is not in the DSM-V. It's now considered part of Autism Spectrum Disorder.
I agree w these statements but this is besides the point.
I dont say this lightly, but i greatly feel that you are enabling him. I dont hear any consequences for his behaviors but in place. I'm sure you know that with "children on the spectrum" the behavioral modeling and consequences are extremely important (more so the consequences as they are less likely to pick up on the modeling.)
In my experience, parents of children w developmental disabilities almost always too lenient in one or two areas because they feel guilty. I know you think you are helping but you are not. This is harmful to your son.
(e.g., he should know that it is a rule to clean up after himself/party and he should know that it is "socially appropriate" to give or make small items for people on Christmas or a birthday, etc.)
He needs to be taught to respect you and your rules when he is in your home.
As for the hygiene and partying, these are things i would not worry as much about as some of it may be age appropriate.
Although since he got the AS dx at the same time as some of these behaviors, you may want to have a talk with him to see if he is using his AS as an excuse for poor behavior. He does not seem motivated for individual therapy at this time. Family therapy may you communicate with him better. I'm sure he's not motivated for that either, but it may be more productive in setting rules, getting your emotions across and for the support and guidance that YOU need.
FWIW I think he sounds like he has Aspergers. Especially the obsessive thoughts and fixations on particular subjects. Seems his current fixation is on parties. I'm not sure what from the posts is making people on this forum say he has bipolar disorder or depression rather than Aspergers.
OP I think it's very important to get him back in treatment. I'd recommend going to a LCSW yourself for guidance on how to deal with this difficult situation.
FYI- FWIW, i think the reason people are pointing to mood disorders as opposed to AS:
1. His lack of self care
2. Heightened need/want to party and socialize
3. Losing focus academically in favor of partying (and/or self medicating w alcohol)
4. You are "walking on egg shells" implying that he is moody and fussy
Again, "fixated on parties" seems more age appropriate in anything, and more of a mood disorder if something.
No one can diagnose him on a message board anyways and it almost doesn't matter what it is called. The maladaptive behaviors just needs to be targeted and changed.
I would not force therapy upon him unless it is family therapy to improve your JOINT communication. In general, therapy should never be seen as a punishment.
If those doctors say he has Aspergers I'd trust them far more than some Internet person with a "degree". He sounds like he has Aspergers Syndrome.
I totally agree with this and others who have insight on this. In previous posts that pointed out bipolar disorder there were maybe 2 or 3 things that were similar to bipolar symptoms but all the others were way different. I have years of experience with one of my step children in bipolar disorder and the first and most glaring thing is that he was diagnosed very early in his life, about 6 years old. The second thing is he doesn't fixate on one thing. His thinking is all over the place because his mind is going in all different direction at once. And lastly, he was extremely social and made friends quite easily while having an enormously likable personality.
However, I do have to tell you that there is a fine line between enabling and helping. It is hard. We stopped enabling years ago and we went through a very traumatic time. But it made things much better. Our son had to make the decision to accept staying on medication or get no more assistance from us. Some people with this disorder sink into the abyss of no return and professionals and institutionalization are the only answer. Some are able to accept medication and counseling and improve their lives to the point of livable success.
Since you seem to be at your wit's end by posting here, you need to heed the unprofessional advice and seek professional counseling for all involved and 3rd and 4th opinions and referrals from experts who are not on this forum. Good luck and peaceful resolution to you.
So, it sounds like the OP provides full support to the son. She has not said what repercussions were involved in his having a big party when the OP was away on vacation. What precisely was done? Did the kid end up cleaning the house and making repairs? Did he pay for a cleaning crew to come in? Did he get his Netflix account suspended or his telephone not paid for? Whose car does he drive and who buys the gas?
See where I'm going here? Adults understand there are consequences to one's actions - has he ever been taught that lesson?
So, it sounds like the OP provides full support to the son. She has not said what repercussions were involved in his having a big party when the OP was away on vacation. What precisely was done? Did the kid end up cleaning the house and making repairs? Did he pay for a cleaning crew to come in? Did he get his Netflix account suspended or his telephone not paid for? Whose car does he drive and who buys the gas?
See where I'm going here? Adults understand there are consequences to one's actions - has he ever been taught that lesson?
If he were a "normal" adult without a mental disability, believe me, he would have really had it and there would have been hard consequences. His mind works differently. It's hard to explain unless you have raised someone who has a mental illness. His older sister graduated with 2 degrees and is very intelligent. She has the mental ability to read cues, understand right/wrong, and is a good judge of character. Son just wants to be liked by his peers and be accepted. He is now getting this in college (something he did not have in high school) and seems to be grasping to as many friends as he can (even though they may not be the best influences).
We found out about the party the day after it happened when we were out of state. We called his dad who lives about 10 minutes away and we all agreed that he needed to spend the remainder of his college break at his dads instead of home alone. We were furious and told our son to pack up his things (that he brought home for college break) & give his house key to his dad as we did not want him/trust him back in the house alone.
He did try cleaning up the best he could with such short time. The vacuum was out, pretty much an entire roll of paper towels were used, and at least half a dozen wet swiffer wipes from trying to get some of the floors cleaned were used. Again we were out of state and just wanted him out. I'm sure he would have "tried" to clean more if he had time.
He did not pay for a cleaning crew and upon return from vacation we pretty much cleaned the house thoroughly from top to bottom as what he did clean was not how we would. His cleaning was more of a bandaid quick job, instead of a good job.
This semester he has been cut off financially from me. His dad agreed when he entered college that he would pay for his cell phone until he graduates so he has a few months left. Our son pays for his own gas, some car repairs, and the majority of his car insurance (he receives a small stipend from his dad). His car is a hand-me-down but is in good condition but there is no payments there. Son also pays for his own college books, meals, or groceries (he is not on a meal plan). He also has Netflix, but pays for this himself as well.
As for any further repercussions from the party, we just arrived back 4 days ago and he was moved back to college by that time. Not quite sure what we are going to do. As of now, he no longer has a house key (not that he would even come home probably until spring break). His college is not even a half hour away though so we are trying to think not just emotionally, but logically too. Son's brain is wired differently and he thinks differently. Not quite sure how to get across to him sometimes, hence why I am here seeking advice from anyone who may have gone though anything similar. I do not want to be manipulated by him, but also want to ensure any repercussions are felt by him - that whatever we do can get the point across (which hopefully is possible for someone with AS).
Thanks for taking time to read my posts and provide your insight. It is appreciated.
Aspergers or not, it sounds to me like he's using you. You state that youd do anything for him and he knows this; hes using it to his advantage. "Why should I bother? Mom's going to come in and save the day for me" is his attitude. And he knows that if you stop all he has to do is either cry a little bit or wait and it wont be long before you cant take it anymore and you fix everything for him, thus proving him right.
Stop treating him like hes special. Treat him like hes no different than anyone else. He isnt your baby anymore, hes 25.
As the saying goes, he's made his bed now let him lie in it.
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