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Old 03-05-2018, 02:53 PM
 
Location: minnesota
15,803 posts, read 6,261,660 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Serious Conversation View Post
There's a difference between "drinking too much" and a raging alcoholic in the sense people think of it.

I drink fairly heavily. I need to cut back, but I'm not a raging alcoholic in the common understanding. I show up to work every day. I have a pretty decent job. I look perfectly fine. My health is fine. I plan on cutting it out until Friday to see how I feel. I usually have at least 2-3 beers every couple of days unless I'm sick.

I'm a six pack a night guy 2-3 times per week during the week, and sometimes more, sometimes less on the weekends. I went to Asheville over the weekend, and got pretty hammered Saturday night after the basketball games, and just Uber'd back to the hotel. I slept terribly Saturday night. I haven't done anything like that in months. I'm usually the daytime guy at a brewery, drinking two or three, and almost always out of bars by 8. I no longer drink liquor, and usually only drink wine at a dinner.

When I was in college, I was much closer to that sloppy alcoholic definition. I'd have long breaks between classes sometimes and go get wasted on cheap liquor or Natural Light at the nearby dive bars, then come back for an evening class pretty well goosed. Several of my professors brought my drinking up to me. It was a noticeable problem.

I think those outward indicators can be deceiving. I had a bad enough problem I was close to suicide. I never got a DWI (drank at home), never missed work (bought "only" a pint a night and was a workaholic too), didn't get in fights with my family (started drinking toward the end of the night after everyone was already off doing their own thing).

It gradually came on to me when I started abusing alcohol in my 30s. The one big thing I notice about before problem and after problem was the way it affected me once I started drinking. Before problem I would drink and at a certain point I would start to get sick and want to stop. After problem the first drink switched on something in my brain and I just wanted to keep drinking more and more. I had a little control over it in that as long as I didn't have 3 I could override that urge to keep going. That meant I could drink and look normal in social situations but I usually waited until I got home and would finish off the drunk. If I had 3 I was drinking everything in sight with no breaks. This thing is progressive. If I had kept going I'm sure I would have lost the right of refusal even against having the first one.

So, I think you should ask yourself if you want the second one more than the first. that seems to me to be a good indicator what way a person is heading.
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Old 03-05-2018, 02:58 PM
 
6,282 posts, read 4,166,669 times
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Just because you are functional doesn't mean you aren't an alcoholic, there are functional alcoholics and non functional. Sounds like you are self medicating using alcohol and trying to justify it.
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Old 03-06-2018, 03:20 PM
 
Location: Northern Maine
5,466 posts, read 3,048,968 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Marcinkiewicz View Post
AA is a joke.

https://www.theatlantic.com/health/a...-steps/284616/

'“Peer reviewed studies peg the success rate of AA somewhere between five and 10 percent,” writes Dodes. “About one of every 15 people who enter these programs is able to become and stay sober.”'
Less than 10% in AA even try the steps.
How can it work when its not tried.?
Makes ya wonder about those " studies " with their scientific pretensions. They don't even use common sense.

AA isn't tried and found wanting,
Its found difficult and not tried.
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Old 03-09-2018, 10:54 AM
 
Location: 'greater' Buffalo, NY
5,376 posts, read 3,857,933 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonesg View Post
Less than 10% in AA even try the steps.
Evidence? How could it even be said that you're in AA if you're not participating in the steps?
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Old 03-09-2018, 03:09 PM
 
Location: Northern Maine
5,466 posts, read 3,048,968 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Marcinkiewicz View Post
Evidence? How could it even be said that you're in AA if you're not participating in the steps?
You will often hear "I'm in the program".
Its an alcoholic lie, they are usually attending meetings , the steps are the program and they aren't doing them...
so they aren't "in the program".
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Old 03-10-2018, 03:59 AM
 
Location: SoCal
14,530 posts, read 20,054,132 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by movintime View Post
Ok, I drink too much, sleep too little, stress too much & remain chronically depressed.

Yes this is my life & real as for now. Are these factors intertwined or just loosely related? ANyone here have a Phd in Psych? I hesitate talking to counselors w/ MSW's or lower degrees as they're certainly not trained in this. A Psych D is most likely best but a good old-school PhD knows their stuff v well I'm sure.
I minored in psych at a good university although my main degree is in engineering.

Those factors are as you said intertwined. They are not just loosely related. I'll tell you right now that you self admitted you have a problem so we don't even need a diagnosis. Anybody who says they have depression and anxiety almost always has it. It's pretty close to a no brainer.

Your symptoms of depression and anxiety may be organic or behavioral in nature but the alcohol (and possibly drugs like marijuana) are either causing the symptoms or exacerbating them.

It is a basic tenet of psychology that any patient who is experiencing psychiatric symptoms (depression, anxiety) must terminate use of all psychoactive drugs such as alcohol or pot. You have to stay off the substances until the symptoms go away, and then you have to consider that maybe the symptoms are caused by substance abuse. If that is the case then the only way you can fix the problem is to quit abusing substances.


Quote:
Originally Posted by movintime View Post
Believe or not but booze actually reduces my need to eat, as in suppressant, & saves me cals that way. But I know opponents here will advise vs that - yet as far as having to bloat or other issues & maybe as a relaxant - it can't be beat.

Wine primarily, & Scotch or Vodka help out. I know this is roughshod typing to clarify a point but so be it, as it is grassroots look at the reality of how I feel daily. So be it, if those vs this behavior challenge - on assertion - that it is vile or not so politically correct to their sovereign eyes - & thus does not appeal to their higher haughty ideals.
You have pretty strange ideas on how to control appetite. People usually refer to that as the cure being worse than the disease.

And of course alcohol relaxes you. It's a depressant. It slows down the parts of your brain that are active when you are tense or anxious. You are self medicating yourself. Reality check: this feels like it works but it doesn't really work. You are just kicking the can down the road. When you finally catch up to the can your problem is just worse. (Our Congress does that all the time, and yes things just keep getting worse.

The rest of your post is just blah blah. If you want to get better you have to terminate use of alcohol and any other psychoactive substances.

It would be a good idea to have an honest talk with your doctor. Even better, I advise that you find a good clinical psychologist (Psy.D.) and partake in counseling until your depression and anxiety problems are solved.

And trust me on this one: alcohol won't fix that. All alcohol will do is give you an illusion you are better for a time, but in truth the more alcohol you take and the longer you take it the worse your problems will get. ... Until you seek counseling.
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Old 03-10-2018, 04:20 AM
 
Location: SoCal
14,530 posts, read 20,054,132 times
Reputation: 10539
Quote:
Originally Posted by matisse12 View Post
For sleep, just take one 75mg Amitriptyline and add one Advil PM if the first Amitriptyline is not effective enough.

Get an Amitriptyline prescription from your primary physician.

(or get Amitriptyline in a lower dose, if preferred)

Try not to mix it with alcohol.

Sleep is very restorative.
Please do not prescribe drugs until you get your M.D. degree.

Amitriptylene is a tri-cyclic anti-depressant and is pretty much considered obsolete. Yes it does have soporific side-effects.

I like that part, "try not to mix it with alcohol." The OP states he/she has a problem with alcohol. "Try" is equivalent to wishing, it ain't gonna happen. If you are excessively drinking you are going to mix whatever you are taking with alcohol, that's a given.

Advil PM is hardly better than a placebo. Don't bring a knife to a gun fight.

Yes sleep is restorative, but chemically induced sleep isn't. We have the best ever example of that: Michael Jackson.

Inability to sleep can be caused by organic problems but probably most people who have trouble sleeping get that way by trying to treat sleep problems with drugs. The only thing that leads to is drug problems and dependency on the drugs you are taking.

We are talking about lifestyle choices here. If you pick the path that involves excessive use of alcohol and/or drugs you made the wrong choice and you pay for it with inability to sleep among other things.

Most people who have sleeping problems should just quit taking all psychoactive drugs. That would probably fix most people. The rest should see a doctor and get a diagnosis on what the organic problem is, and treat it if possible.

Doctors shouldn't give patients pills to help them sleep. AFAIK there isn't any prescription on the market that doesn't have a warning something like, "do not prescribe for a period exceeding 6 weeks" or something like that. The drug manufacturers know that their drugs are not a permanent fix. The FDA makes them put that warning on the data sheet because they want everybody to understand that fact.

Yet doctors just continue prescribing sleeping aids for years and years. That's treating the symptom, not treating the cause. Go that route and all you'll end up is a life long dependency on the drugs.

There aren't any easy solutions in real life. Only the hard solution works. That would be the lifestyle choice where you either limit your alcohol to minimal use, or if you can't hold it to minimal you have to quit it for good. Double meaning there. For good = make you better. For good = forever.

Fact is we'd all be better off if none of us consumed alcohol. Other fact is that alcohol in reasonable amounts can be fun. Last fact is that too many people get the idea that if a little booze is a little fun then a lot of booze is a lot of fun. That's when you know you are an alcoholic or at least alcohol dependent.


There is a test you can take to determine if you are alcohol dependent. It's easy and it's a do it yourself test too. Just quit drinking entirely for one month. If you can't do it then you are at best alcohol dependent, at worst you are an alcoholic.

By the way, if you drink for hours at a time then save yourself the effort. You're an alcoholic.
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Old 03-31-2018, 04:06 PM
 
291 posts, read 375,630 times
Reputation: 584
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoMoreSnowForMe View Post
AA is too all or nothing, in my experience. Relapse is really common, but it's not safe to mention in AA that you have relapsed. There is a huge shaming where you have to change your sober date, where sponsors will keep their sponsees from you - it really is like being outcast in shame, like you'd expect from a religious group like the Amish or something (sorry if this example is incorrect).

Plus, I can't stand the whole "I am not worthy" garbage, that is religion-based.

Relapse is not accepted. If you don't like anything, you are in denial. And, everyone who is "counseling" you is someone who is messed up. Someone who has an addictive personality, etc. Most of whom have cross-addictions, like sex addiction, so you can end up in a room full of "sober" sex addicts who will take advantage of your weakness.

It's a room full of sober sick people. I learned I'd rather not hang out with sober sick people. I'd rather look for healthy people to be my friends, and get a counselor who has credentials.

I expected staunch AA defenders to show up and argue with my post. I won't argue my points any further. I just wanted to let the OP know that there are alternatives, in case AA was a turnoff, like it was for me. I don't believe that just because someone has ever abused alcohol, that it is a forever problem. You won't find anyone in AA who won't freak out if you voice that possibility. All or nothing forever doesn't sit right with everyone.

Wow, not my experience. I have been to hundreds of meetings and I have never experienced shaming of someone that has relapsed. To me they are the bravest people in the room, getting up and choosing to fight again. While it doesn't work for everyone, I'd rather be around "sober sick people" than just about any other kind.
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Old 04-01-2018, 01:41 AM
 
Location: Northern Maine
5,466 posts, read 3,048,968 times
Reputation: 8011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wanderlove View Post
Wow, not my experience. I have been to hundreds of meetings and I have never experienced shaming of someone that has relapsed. To me they are the bravest people in the room, getting up and choosing to fight again. While it doesn't work for everyone, I'd rather be around "sober sick people" than just about any other kind.
It definitely doesn't work for those who need it.

It only works for those who want it.
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Old 04-01-2018, 09:09 AM
 
6,224 posts, read 6,573,175 times
Reputation: 4489
Hi all & an Update:

1st, TY all for your help. I'm just going to say back in '91-'97 I quit for 6yrs. Was into hardcore bodybuilding, etc. But as I aged in to 40-50s I said, WTH why not -- as the Chippendale look can't be had anyway as a calling card to pickup girls, yes? -- thus to hell w the body looking hot for ladies, no? LOL

So, back to the soup again, I went, hahaa. So, last wk on Wed. I stopped again. But.. this time I'm going back into my "narcissism", hehee, thus-- aka "let's try being pretty again", HAHAHAA, but I'm not joking as if I get self-absorbed (by watching old youtubes of all the Bodybuilders & their heyday back in early 90s) I'll jump back on the mindset.

Now, tho this is "shotgun psychology" to you folks w/ any real training, this OCD approach really can work for 'lunatics', haha, as I.

My gym rat buddies from back in da day may well now have heart, kidney, liver, etc. damage -- as I avoided steroids but most I knew did not.

Ok, could ramble for hrs re this all, but suffice saying I will use you folks to keep me accounatble to the 'No Booze policy' I'm instituting.

Also, my guitar & listening music etc. days gets me almost as high/drunk as the real substances. Also, I've never been a pot guy ever -- but again tons of buddies were that for sure -- but no longer do I live back east & so no contact w/ any really.

Ok, ciao & TY again for all these replies...
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