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1)Fred looked at me once and asked if I were going to play.
2)They finally asked me if I wanted to play something."
3)They said "Go ahead," and I said "No,
Dude, they asked you three (3) times if you wanted to play! How many times do you want them to ask you ? After the first time you should have jumped up, and said "Sure, love to." "Damn straight", or something to that effect. This isn't your first rodeo. You know how they work. You snooze, you lose. Those windows of opportunity don't stay open forever.
On the #2 above why do you say "They finally asked me..."? When that was the second time they asked you.
If you really want to play in front of people you simply must grow thicker skin, and speak up. Otherwise people think you don't care, and they lose interest. Or maybe develop a new hobby instead. This business of blaming others for your shortcomings is complete bs.
And by the way, I think most of the other musicians I know would have been just as angry as I was. Do they ALL need therapy??
Musicians DO need an audience, that is for sure so that they can get their art known. I wonder if there is anything you can do to market yourself like networking. Sometimes, you do have to be even more assertive just to get an audience.
I think you are confused about what being assertive means. And I don't think you need therapy. For this issue there's nothing wrong with you that an assertiveness training class wouldn't remediate.
Don't settle for self-help and reading. This is a skill that needs to be practiced with other people under the supervision of an instructor who can point out when you are being assertive and when you are being aggressive.
If you are searchingly honest with yourself you may realize that a lot of your anger is self-directed. You haven't learned how to express your wants/needs in a way that people can hear you and respond well. This is a growing-up problem and many of us have struggled along this path.
It's a sure set up for depression in later life so do yourself a favor and learn a new skill.
I have no idea?? How in the world could YOU possibly know anything about his mental state? I have known him and some of his relatives for years, I know some of the medical facts. HOW THE HECK could someone on a web forum know what I know about someone?
This is a perfect example of how blaming the victim is absolutely reflexive for some people here.
It's not worth it. People are going to think what they think, and if it happens to be what you don't like (e.g. what is not accurate), then there's not much you can say to change their minds.
I myself see that a little more assertiveness might've worked...only might've. Maybe it would've made things worse for you, who knows. I myself do not have an assertive history and I'm introverted, often mistaken as "shy", and I've had people treat me all kinds of ways, including weird. And I understand that being assertive is not always going to make things better immediately. For instance, one person was being a weirdo with me, I called him out (simply asking him why he is acting that way with me), and he blew up on me and was shouting all kinds of threats. Now, this is just an example.
I've been to open mic nights and yes, what you described is not typical of the open-mic nights I have attended. People have played their songs and then sat down. Sometimes, there were long intervals. Another thing is that people had sign up sheets at open mic nights with schedules. It was a little more organized than where you were hoping to play at. It sounds like it was a free-for-all where you were... with hardly an audience.
It's not worth it. People are going to think what they think, and if it happens to be what you don't like (e.g. what is not accurate), then there's not much you can say to change their minds.
I myself see that a little more assertiveness might've worked...only might've. Maybe it would've made things worse for you, who knows. I myself do not have an assertive history and I'm introverted, often mistaken as "shy", and I've had people treat me all kinds of ways, including weird. And I understand that being assertive is not always going to make things better immediately. For instance, one person was being a weirdo with me, I called him out (simply asking him why he is acting that way with me), and he blew up on me and was shouting all kinds of threats. Now, this is just an example.
I've been to open mic nights and yes, what you described is not typical of the open-mic nights I have attended. People have played their songs and then sat down. Sometimes, there were long intervals. Another thing is that people had sign up sheets at open mic nights with schedules. It was a little more organized than where you were hoping to play at. It sounds like it was a free-for-all where you were... with hardly an audience.
Yes I have been to other open mics that are run correctly, and this one usually is. This one became informal last night, because only 3 of us showed up. They did not see it as a regular open mic.
What got me angry was seeing that they did not seem to remember I was there. I don't like being treated like I am invisible.
I do recognize, however, that introverts often do want to be ignored and left alone. I am somewhere between introvert and extrovert, depending on the social context. They might have perceived me as an introvert who wanted to be left alone.
But I doubt it. I was the one who suggested we go ahead and have the open mic anyway. I asked Ted to play -- he was not there to play, he works in the library and was just setting things up. He borrowed Ned's guitar and was playing. I said it sounded good, and I suggested he play something.
I was the only person trying to get anything going. But after I got it going, they completely forgot about me.
They handed Ned's guitar back and forth and took turns playing songs.
I was NOT asked to play 3 times.
One time Fred asked me, but I could not stop Ned and Ted, and I tried to signal that to Fred, hoping he would stop them.
The next time I was asked, Fred had is coat on and was ready to end the open mic, while Ned was still playing. Fred was not as aware as most people might have been. He should have asked Ned to stop and give me a chance. Maybe he didn't think of it, or maybe he didn't want to be assertive.
Ned was really who I was angry at. I don't know Ned personally, but had seen him often at this open mic and also our monthly jam session. ALWAYS the same 2 songs!
But last night, as we were just hanging and waiting, Ned and I had a long conversation, about all kinds of things. It was not a bad conversation, and I did manage to get my ideas in here and there. But mostly he wanted to express himself, and brag about himself. He did not once ask me anything about myself.
So I could see right away what type of guy Ned is. Very self-centered and proud of himself. I have known plenty of others like that. After they retire, they want to make sure everyone knows they did something important.
Ned mentioned he had worked in IT and I said "Oh, me too!" Then he proceeded to explain his whole career and did not once ask me what I did in IT. Not the slightest bit curious.
So I know why it all happened. For men like Ned, women don't have interesting careers, they aren't good musicians and they don't write good songs. Ned types don't have the slightest interest in finding anything out about a women. Women are in the world to be supportive and encouraging.
This is a male-female problem, and also an assertive-nonassertive problem. It goes on ALL THE TIME. None of the participants were crazy or needing therapy. It just is what happens.
And it was interesting to me, because it made me aware of how I feel about this. I pay more attention to these things now than I used to. In the past I might have thought it was somehow my own fault.
I think you are confused about what being assertive means. And I don't think you need therapy. For this issue there's nothing wrong with you that an assertiveness training class wouldn't remediate.
Don't settle for self-help and reading. This is a skill that needs to be practiced with other people under the supervision of an instructor who can point out when you are being assertive and when you are being aggressive.
If you are searchingly honest with yourself you may realize that a lot of your anger is self-directed. You haven't learned how to express your wants/needs in a way that people can hear you and respond well. This is a growing-up problem and many of us have struggled along this path.
It's a sure set up for depression in later life so do yourself a favor and learn a new skill.
I am already later in life and not the least bit depressed. Maybe do the world a favor and stop diagnosing people.
I am sort of glad I let them know I was not thrilled with how they acted. There was no other way I could have done it. If I tried to explain it to them, I would have said things I shouldn't say.
I hope that after I left they looked at each other and thought "Boy are we dopes. We never gave that lady a chance to play."
I would have bet money that you were a guy. That is why I talked to you the way I did in that other post, sorry .
Now about your handle. Did you hear a lot of that kind of thing as you were growing up? "You are good for nothing, and won't amount to much?" I added the second half since I heard both of them over the early years. They kind of went together. If that is how you see yourself, then it's a stretch to think that you deserve better in life.
The old adage of "Words can never hurt me" is not true. They can shape our very existence. What you were called is NOT who you are.
I am already later in life and not the least bit depressed. Maybe do the world a favor and stop diagnosing people.
Wow, just wow! Lodestar is one of the nicest people you could meet. There was no call to be mean to her. Be thankful that people are taking the time to try to help you out. Do you want help, or not? If you keep running people off there won't be anybody left. Is that what you want? Then you will blame everybody else except yourself for your predicament. And the cycle will repeat ad nauseam.
Wow, just wow! Lodestar is one of the nicest people you could meet. There was no call to be mean to her. Be thankful that people are taking the time to try to help you out. Do you want help, or not? If you keep running people off there won't be anybody left. Is that what you want? Then you will blame everybody else except yourself for your predicament. And the cycle will repeat ad nauseam.
This is definitely NOT a predicament. And I said at the beginning I know people here will diagnose me and say I need help or my life will be ruined.
Then why did you write down three separate times you were asked in your OP? You very clearly did say so. It's a little late to change your mind now that it's down in black, and white. Unless you listed the same thing twice. But that is not how it came out.
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? After the first time you should have jumped up, and said "Sure, love to." "Damn straight", or something to that effect. This isn't your first rodeo. You know how they work. You snooze, you lose. Those windows of opportunity don't stay open forever.
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