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I am so sorry to hear so many posters feel more feminine these days than they feel comfortable with. That could be a sign of an endocrine problem. I'm sure you can find solutions.
On the subject of adult male suicide in less urban communities, this is nothing new. My mother lost 4 or 5 of her male HS classmates in Texas back in the 60s and 70s. Most common reasons suspected were financial ruin and/or legal problems. AKA pride and ego.
I always thought of problem solving and stoicism as somewhat masculine characteristics. Fall off the horse, brush off and get back on that horse. So I never got men running away from problems, either through ignoring them, or worst case taking themselves out. That is why it is seen as cowardly, because it is running away.
I've known men who refuse to discuss problems, as if they don't exist. Even objective issues like debt or job problems. That is cowardly, what about using your innate strength and problem solving skills to face and deal with these obstacles. It certainly isn't masculine, or even adult, to leave it up to the others to deal with all of it.
It is not just fate or happenstance that thee two topics adjoin each other over there on the right margin:
"Man throws 5 year old down 3 stories at Mall of America, Current Events, 57 replies
Why Masculinity is in Turmoil, Psychology, 58 replies"
After being berated, belittled and bereft of encouragement for their whole lives, some men simply don't know what to do. Those of us who grew up in rural areas with multi-generational families have a pretty good sense of who we are, what we can do and the limits of what we cannot do. We are good citizens. I am the fourth generation in my family to be married for more than 50 years.
I wonder what brought the man who threw the 5 year old to imagine that it as a good idea.
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A clarification about toxic masculinity, what it means and the most appropriate way to apply the term.
Toxic masculinity is not about putting down traits traditionally associated with masculinity, what I call the "social dominance-survival" traits: strength, social and practical thinking skills, courage, competence, vigor, self-reliance, and (secondarily) sex appeal, winning physical (or at least personal) confrontations so forth. In fact, every one of traits primarily associated with "manliness" are found just as readily among females as well. Any differences in male and female courage, strength, self-reliance, etc. that might exist are more stylistic than substantive.
Toxic masculinity is about castigating males who lack one and especially all those traits - not because the boy or man in question deliberately set out to hurt, harm, or demean the dignity of others; but simply because he may anywhere from one to all those traits. Even when people do insist a "real man" has what I call the "the civilized-humane traits" ( consideration for others, civility, openminded-ness, compassion, generosity, helpfulness, trustworthiness, sincerity, and so forth), those traits seem to get only third-billing behind the 'secondary' traits I listed. That is model of "masculinity" is what contributes to the high suicide rate among men brought up in the OP.
Masculinity is only toxic to the matriarchy and socialism.
Once socialism is abandoned, and women no longer can rely on 'all men' supporting them, they will be competing for at least one man who will support them.
The alternative is too unpleasant to dwell upon.
IMO, the concept of 'toxic masculinity' says more about our current clickbait-culture than it says either gender.
But I will say this: If a man can't/won't do basic mechanical/electronic repairs... if he's never shot a gun or driven a stickshift... if he's never ****ed a woman he barely knew, never committed a felony, or been so intoxicated he can't remember it... then I think less of him.
Not saying I hate him or anything. But he ain't up to my standards
There can also be the opposite problem. Now we have the idea that masculinity is toxic.
Some men are naturally very masculine, and others are kind of feminine. Neither should be considered wrong or toxic.
The days when men and women had to fit into stereotyped roles are pretty much over. But most women still prefer traditional female roles and most men prefer traditional male roles. That is just natural.
If you look at the percentage of males vs females in different careers you will see very obvious patterns. And this is NOT because they were forced into traditional careers. Most men do not want to be kindergarten teachers, and most women do not want to be construction workers.
Highlighted in red has always been the case for ever, at least from my perspective. I frankly don't get where the thought comes from that men are less masculine these days. Not sure if everyone defines the term masculinity the same. Coming from the sports industry I know youth participation in sports has been rising steadily for decades, and today's athletes from youth all the way up through pro or even recreational, are stronger, faster, tougher and better then ever.
I wonder what brought the man who threw the 5 year old to imagine that it as a good idea.
Fathers have been throwing their children down the stairs since stairs were invented. You just didn't have your faux outrage nipple tickled by social media about it.
Highlighted in red has always been the case for ever, at least from my perspective. I frankly don't get where the thought comes from that men are less masculine these days. Not sure if everyone defines the term masculinity the same. Coming from the sports industry I know youth participation in sports has been rising steadily for decades, and today's athletes from youth all the way up through pro or even recreational, are stronger, faster, tougher and better then ever.
I don't think men are less masculine. I think there is a trend in liberal/progressive ideology now that prefers feminine traits over masculine traits.
For example, cooperativeness is valued over competitiveness. There is a dislike of the roughness and inequality that results from capitalism. I think we've all heard of schools where the children all get the same prize, to make sure no one feels inferior. Things like that.
There is the snowflake trend, the over-sensitivity and extreme political correctness. Maybe it's mostly in the academic world, so not everyone runs into it.
Maybe it depends on the social group and its political identity. If you were in a group of mostly progressives/liberals I think the men might be more "sensitive." They might be appalled at the thought of killing a deer, and they might be against any war for any reason.
But if were in a group of mostly conservatives, you might see them reacting against the feminization and being overly masculine.
I'm afraid that my thoughts on this are very much colored by my ex and some of his friends, as compared to people I associate with more now.
Ex & co.: Some are ex military, all are men who have struggled to find their places in this world. They are bitter and angry at everyone, especially women. They also stockpile guns, and my ex is probably the most likely person I've ever known that I could imagine snapping and shooting up a bunch of people. I have voice recordings of threats he made against me, and texts. Not that it means anything, but it was not all in my head as a result of the end of a marriage and the discord resulting. When I talked to domestic violence professionals at one point, the concern was that he could become something so common it's got a name: Family Annihilator. Kills the family, then himself. This stuff is real to me. Not some ideology I just spout off about on the internet. He makes much to people about being "alpha" and a manly man, has a lifetime of violence, aggression, and bullying behind him. His proudest moment and a story he loves to tell again and again, was that of the day in high school where he went from being the bullied, to the bully.
Because a real man must be one or the other, and boys will be boys you know.
He cannot trust a woman, as his birth mother "threw him away like trash" (in other words he was adopted) and all women are just betrayals waiting to happen. He exaggerates his self worth to other men but as someone who was close and who has seen through the shell, he's not just "weak" but actually broken inside in many ways. His bluster is a defense. A very obvious one to my eyes. He and his friends like to drink and talk crap about women. Deep, very deep, but revealed to me in ways I won't disclose because it really is too private...part of the poison in him about women, is that he is fiercely jealous of us. Since he craves the love of a mother or woman surrogate, even as he hates them he places them on a pedestal built of unfulfilled needs. And the way he (and by extension all men in his mind) view women as always desirable...and he does not feel desirable to women, himself...so women easily get sex, and men cannot...there is an angry envy that women get to be "sexy" and he doesn't.
He and his friends are also very conservative. They don't leave the house much, and listen to a lot of media and read on the internet, and are full of fear about the outside world. He said once that I should worry, spending time in the city, that our area is too welcoming to Muslims and they will rape and kill a woman like me. He has little concept of what "out there" is actually like at all. Better to assume the worst of others, than to go learn better by interacting with them. He hates everyone who is not just like him, and fears them.
The liberal people I know, on the other hand, are not like the caricatures portrayed in the "omg I'm so offended/triggered" writings and videos I've seen. Sure I know the odd person like that, but not many. Most of the ones I know including those who have actually run in local and state elections, just care about people being able to live and let live. Don't be a jerk to others, be kind. Don't act like the real life version of internet trolls. They aren't crying over everything, they're very happy people.
Guys like my ex seem to think that the concept of masculinity that is under attack, is that they should be accepted acting nasty to other people, and the victims should sit quiet and be victims, not tell them to stop. "Get a thicker skin!" meaning shut up and take it. So I'm sorry to say but guys who talk about "the matriarchy" and "feminization" and how the traditional male ideal is under attack, come off to me like a schoolyard bully who has been caught and put into detention. Or his parents who insist that "boys will be boys" and there was nothing wrong with his actions.
People who have had enough, and are sick of the crap, are telling you it just won't fly anymore, and you're throwing your toys out of the pram because you can't imagine being a "man" without the bully aspect.
No one who has concerns about toxic masculinity is saying that men should be soft. We might be saying that the "predator or prey" bully mindset is neither healthy nor necessary in today's society. Frankly I see a lot of the struggles some men have, are with the dissonance between elements that taught them that, and the desire to engage with people in some areas of life and finding it isn't welcome there. The tools they were given are not making them happy or successful adults.
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