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Why not the Grace Park area? There are still some empty spots I believe. Morrisville-Carpenter Rd and Davis Dr. Also, its very close to some large RTP companies so you may get steady lunch traffic.
The former Loop was a great place to visit and if it didn't do well I don't know if a non-chain restaurant/bar would do there. I like MacGregor Village, but isn't that where the MacGregor Draft House is? Pretty big competition.
I like MacGregor Village, but I think the Ale house would be tough competition. I think there is also a pool hall there and maybe 2-3 other decent places to eat?
If you want a location where people can walk to from a half dozen neighborhoods, West Park Place might be worth looking at again.
I used to go to The Loop all of the time, despite the limited menu, blah decor, and food that was somewhat pricy for counter service because of the location. It was a great centrally located place to meet friends. We stopped going when the food quality started to decline, they stopped delivering food to tables, and certain options, like fresh fruit were eliminated.
The neighborhoods to the West of 55 can walk/bike there, the ones to the East of 55 can walk there now with the tunnel under 55. I know many people North of the intersection (Reserve, Highcroft Village) that would like a shorter drive than Davis or Beaver Creek to go out to dinner or lunch on weekends (or working from home).
Taking to people who passed by Kroger to go to HT, some mentioned sales, some mentioned just liking HT better, and many mentioned customer service issues. I asked someone who worked at the old Kroger why they did not do well, and they said it was the elimination of the left turn off high house into the center. I doubt one extra left turn would make the difference between staying open and closing, but maybe it did. Now that there is more development to the West of 55 it might help(I always forget the name of the road that High House turns into when it crosses 55 - the one that will have a 540 interchange soon about a mile from the shopping center).
It seems like there are a lot of shopping centers along High House that are laid out awkwardly for entry/parking (my personal vote for the worse one is the north east corner of high house and cary parkway). Maybe it is a matter of trying to fit too many store and parking spaces in too small a space.
I heard the kids dance studio that opened up next to the old Loop location is doing ok. Have you talked to other businesses there like the dunkin donuts? Awhile back I heard Kroger was going to be subdivided into offices. I guess that fell through. Too bad. It would have been a great thing for the surrounding stores.
I think if you opened a family friendly place in that location it might do well. I don't know what kind of traffic it takes to support a restaurant, but a lot of people would have to pass by that location to go somewhere else to eat.
I'm in one of the west of 55 developments and I moved to the area just after Kroger closed. I was so disappointed, as it was the closest non-Harris Teeter store to my area, before the Food Lion opened in Morrisville. HT is fine, but it's really expensive for everyday items. There's a lot to like about Kroger.
I was just discovering The Loop when it closed, which is too bad. It was the greatest thing in the world, but it was OK and the kids liked it. It was an easy, family restaurant and that means a lot around here. They also distributed lots of coupons.
We frequently went to the Great Clips there, but now we have our own Great Clips at the Cary Park Towne Center.
We did go to Blockbuster there every now and then, but that will soon be gone as well. I'm not crazy about Red Box and I haven't seen a lot of NetFlix to interest us, so we're sad about the whole Blockbuster business.
We've only gone the HT shopping center across the street when we've had birthday parties at the Jump Zone.
The bottom line is that we'd love to see that corner come to life. Sure, it's awkward, but a lot of places are around here. If you build something worth visiting, though, I think people will come.
I've lived down the street from the High House/55 corner for the last 11 years. Honestly, it is REALLY tough location for access. There is limited access on both High House and 55, and nothing is worse than an empty anchor.
Unless the rent was REALLY reasonable -- and the landlord gave you 6 months for free on top of it -- I'm not sure I'd want to sink a lot of money in that location.
I do agree with the poster that mentioned Grace Park. That development is starting to fill up (as is the Bloom/Food Lion plaza across the street), and it features lots of other traffic-intensive businesses.
After having survived owning two restaurants in Florida, I admire your bravery and optimism and wish you good luck in your venture!
Just realized I had my East and West reversed. Sorry. The people to the East of 55 are directly adjacent, and the ones to the West can walk under the tunnel or along the sidewalk to get there. What is that path called that goes under the tunnel? It is the one that connects to the Tobacco Trail (I think it is already connected) on one far end and the White Oak Trail on the other. Does it even have a name?
I agree with you NoneofThis, I think there is a significant pent up demand in WPP area for a "neighborhood bar/grill/whatever". I don't think a true "bar" would fit in the area. The bulk of the business would be families.
Personally, whether Kroger was there or not made no difference at all in my choice to go to the Loop (or not). I'm sure a large anchor would help a lot with traffic in general, but if the place is good, word will travel fast in the local area. (If they do end up subdividing the old Kroger into offices at some point that might be a huge bonus, maybe even better than an anchor store.)
I think a new place to eat there would get a lot of traffic initially from the surrounding neighborhoods, the locals will know it is there, and clearly it is very easy to get to if you live right there. Depends if the place is a good enough fit with the area to keep people coming back, and if the local population is large enough to generate a comfortable amount of business until you can create a draw for people from other areas too. Maybe this place would encourage other stores to open in the plaza part of the development.
I am curious though, is it unusual that I don't care what else is in a shopping center when I choose a place to eat? We go to Rudino's on 55 all of the time and that is the most dead plaza I have ever seen. i don't know if there is one other open business there, but that doesn't matter to us at all b/c we like Rudinos . And we choose that location over the one on High House (in the mostly/or/fully occupied plaza) b/c we all like the atmosphere at the one on 55 better.
I have to think that with all of the new houses that have gone up, and the expanded walking/biking paths, and the 540 exit opening that the retail options will improve in that area sooner rather than later.
How well do you know the area? Are you currently resident here? It seems to me that you are picking random locations which will never sustain the type of business who have outlined purely for the reason other posters have mentioned insufficient foot traffic. For such a big investment I would have thoiught you would be sitting in your car observing the number of people using McGreggor and West Park Place and you would quickly realise that they are unsuitable for your business. Others have mention Grace Park in Morrisville that is a great location for RTP traffic as well as plenty of local residents in Cary and Morrisville. Yes there is competition there already which will maj=ke it easier for you to attract customers quicker than having to generate a the demand yourselves.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BabyBoomers
Good spot for a restaurant/bar? Better than MacGregor Village -- US 64 & 1? Thx.
Here's the dilemma, @ MacG the "store" is bigger, better designed (balcony/dancefloor), and lower rent than WPP. The daytime foot traffic is not existent, but at night it gets busy with the other rest/bars. One of my thoughts on the foot traffic is, it'll help but honestly you go to restaurants from word-of-mouth more than seeing it. I like that MacG is off main roads conpared to WPP, possible Raleigh guests. WPP will get more walk-ins based on other stores in the shop center, but it would be local only (not that that's bad). They both have advan/disadvantages. We're looking to be a family-friendly b/l/d place, but at night definitely a bar/club that serves food as well.
The decor will be retro from 60-80s, we'll have bands, trivia, movies, and few twists and turns with audience participation to win fabulous prizes, and a few other "draws" to bring in the crowds. The food will be standard "pub grub" times 100, not just boring burgers and wings (zzzzz). We really want lots of variety, and a rotating monthly menu featured every month. Basically you can come everyday for a year and not have the same meal twice. The food makes the difference.
We're moving in June and will have a decision made in a couple months but are looking at options now. So if you don't mind, allow me another location.
How about the Shoppes @ 54? Corner of CH Road and NW Maynard.
Last edited by BabyBoomers; 02-09-2011 at 06:00 AM..
Again, not the best from a visibility standpoint, that immediate area is underdeveloped and you dont have much else around to help you with traffic.
I hear what youre saying about the traffic thing, but in my experience places with neat ideas like the ones youre talking about always seem to fold because, in the beginning, the owners went cheap on location and didnt take enough of a risk with upfront $ to ensure the long term success of the shop. Its always a "man this place is awesome, why isnt it more busy? because no one knows it exists."
Even with advertising...unless its in a place im familiar with, i will probably ignore it. The location you described, interestingly enough, I would go to MORE than the others because I would say "thats right near Lowe's, not far, I'll check it out."
Can you get enough dedicated parking at Shoppes @ 54?
That'd be my first question. Otherwise, you'd have people parking their trailers full of lumber in front of your restaurant if the Lowes got crowded.
Then again, I've always figured that they needed to lease some of that space out because man... they've got a ton of parking out there.
I would go to a place in that area. We frequent that plaza. Plenty of people around there, and of course, with the type of establishment the OP is referring to, after about 10pm, there's nothing open over there, so no competing traffic.
Also, the greenway just connected up over on Maynard, so people could take bikes up and stop for lunch, that sorta thing.
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. And we choose that location over the one on High House (in the mostly/or/fully occupied plaza) b/c we all like the atmosphere at the one on 55 better.
