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Note that I said "much" not "most." You have to look at voting patterns in Orange County on tax issues. Outside of Chapel Hill and Hillsborough, support tends to be weaker for tax increases - typically with a solid margin against passage in rural areas. Margins in the non-rural areas tend to be more evenly split - either mildly for or mildly against. It will be interesting to see the results of the sales and use tax referendum this November 8.
I agree with you on this one-- just look at the ED tax that got voted down last year (one of the factors in the firing of Orange's ED director, I'm sure).
Orange is going to make a go next year, and hopefully they'll do a good job of educating the whole county of how the transit will benefit them. For example, Hillsborough won't be on light rail, but will get better regional bus service to CH and Durham. That service could be especially beneficial to older folks trying to make doctor's appointments at Duke or Carolina, or it could give new commuting options to the many commuters that live in rural Orange.
For whatever it's worth, I would just point out to anyone who lives in Raleigh and is interested in and concerned about issues like these, such as improving the bus system and other forms of public transportation, that Raleigh has a transportation bond referendum on the ballot in this Tuesday's elections. So that's an opportunity to cast your vote and make your voice heard one way or the other about these interesting and complex public policy issues.
Keep in mind that these bonds mean higher taxes later on. Bonds must be paid back 1 way or another. The transit systems will not clear any profit, I have heard of few that do. Most all run at a deficit & that means the taxpayers pay the difference.
Keep in mind that these bonds mean higher taxes later on. Bonds must be paid back 1 way or another. The transit systems will not clear any profit, I have heard of few that do. Most all run at a deficit & that means the taxpayers pay the difference.
The system of roads, streets, and highways doesn't turn a direct financial profit, either, and it runs on a deficit that costs enormous amounts of money to improve and maintain on an annual basis. But as a community we decide that they're worthy of some (lots) of our tax dollars because of the larger good that's provided—both tangibly and intangibly, and both directly and indirectly—by good transportation. Public transportation expenditures are in the same category.
That's not to say that every single public transportation project is a good investment for taxpayers. Some may be unwise, and others may be flat-out boondoggles. And as a taxpayer, too, I don't want to pay more in taxes than necessary, and I don't want to have to pay more than my share. And it's even more important to me that the tax money I do spend is used wisely and efficiently, and that tax-dependent government agencies are as accountable and transparent as possible. But in my opinion (and evidently the opinion of the majority of Raleigh citizens who came out to vote on Tuesday), improving public transportation in the city and the region is important and valuable enough that it is deserving of a certain amount of my (our) tax dollars. But you clearly disagree, and that's okay. I respect your point of view, even though I may not share it.
That's not to say that every single public transportation project is a good investment for taxpayers. Some may be unwise, and others may be flat-out boondoggles. And as a taxpayer, too, I don't want to pay more in taxes than necessary, and I don't want to have to pay more than my share. And it's even more important to me that the tax money I do spend is used wisely and efficiently, and that tax-dependent government agencies are as accountable and transparent as possible. But in my opinion (and evidently the opinion of the majority of Raleigh citizens who came out to vote on Tuesday), improving public transportation in the city and the region is important and valuable enough that it is deserving of a certain amount of my (our) tax dollars. But you clearly disagree, and that's okay. I respect your point of view, even though I may not share it.
The most important part of the post is of the residents who came out to vote. Voter turnout is so pitiful in these elections, no one can say it represents what the majority of people really think or want.
But then if you did not vote, you have no right to complain I always say.
I have no problem with some public transit. I have been w/out a working car at times, living in Durham & having to find rides to temp jobs in RTP, also had friends in that situation.
My position is that we already have roads all over the Triangle to anywhere you could want to go. I think we are too spread out for trains to be practical & the land for them is expensive, so is construction of rails, purchase of trains, maintaining the system, etc. I think we could add buses for a lot less $ & do the job OK.
Again, for what it's worth, I would just point out again to anyone who lives in Durham County and is interested in and concerned about issues like these, such as improving the bus system, continuing a move towards light rail, and other forms of public transportation, that tomorrow (Tuesday, November 8) is election day again, and Durham County has a transportation sales tax referendum on the ballot. So that's another opportunity to cast your vote and make your voice heard one way or the other about these interesting and complex public policy issues.
It's gonna be so fun to subsidize this with our tax money, I can hardly wait!
We are going to be paying forever for this light rail so folks who think they are too good to ride the bus can pretend to be in a big city.
It is indeed a expensive fantasy!
Derision aside, what we're doing -- once Orange and hopefully Wake come on board -- is building options to make light rail corridors denser, so as to take on much more population than they could otherwise.
1.2 million new people will move here in the next 20 years. All you C-D'ers who moved to Fuquay-Varina and Apex and Mebane and Clayton to get what one former poster here called "high quality of life, low cost of life" -- do you want your home communities turning into the next Long Islands? Isn't that pricing-out why you left your homes to begin with?
Transit is critical to allowing us to grow in a way that makes sense. We are one of the most far-flung metro areas/CMSAs in the US. And that will hurt our economic competitiveness.
Look at Charlotte and the successes on the South Blvd. corridor, which is hard to recognize versus 10 years ago.
And yes, I use transit today by choice, along with walking to work and, in some cases, driving in when I need to. And I don't mind paying taxes for the privilege, but it's not just about benefitting me as a rider -- it's about benefitting the community.
A person with no car pays no gas taxes but still pays for roads through other sources like general taxation. It's because they benefit from roads as a public good. Transit is a public good, too, helping to transport low-wage carless workers (who might otherwise be unemployed and a drag on the safety net), riders of choice, and changing development patterns to make cities denser and to keep suburbs from overflowing and spreading out to greenfield.
Derision aside, what we're doing -- once Orange and hopefully Wake come on board -- is building options to make light rail corridors denser, so as to take on much more population than they could otherwise.
1.2 million new people will move here in the next 20 years. All you C-D'ers who moved to Fuquay-Varina and Apex and Mebane and Clayton to get what one former poster here called "high quality of life, low cost of life" -- do you want your home communities turning into the next Long Islands? Isn't that pricing-out why you left your homes to begin with?
Transit is critical to allowing us to grow in a way that makes sense. We are one of the most far-flung metro areas/CMSAs in the US. And that will hurt our economic competitiveness.
Look at Charlotte and the successes on the South Blvd. corridor, which is hard to recognize versus 10 years ago.
And yes, I use transit today by choice, along with walking to work and, in some cases, driving in when I need to. And I don't mind paying taxes for the privilege, but it's not just about benefitting me as a rider -- it's about benefitting the community.
A person with no car pays no gas taxes but still pays for roads through other sources like general taxation. It's because they benefit from roads as a public good. Transit is a public good, too, helping to transport low-wage carless workers (who might otherwise be unemployed and a drag on the safety net), riders of choice, and changing development patterns to make cities denser and to keep suburbs from overflowing and spreading out to greenfield.
Well put.
In particular I'll be interested to see how this improves bus service over time. Currently if I wanted to use the bus to get to work, it would take two hours as opposed to a 30 minute drive. That is simply unacceptable considering I live in Cary and work in downtown Durham. We're not talking about going from Chatham County or something. I've lived in areas with a tiny fraction of the population we have here that had better bus service. I would really like to see this improve so I could start using public transportation for my commute.
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