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Sorry, I have trouble with the "responsible gun owner" argument and then people sticking up for the irresponsible gun owner. No guns means no guns. How do you not know where your gun is?
And I am a firm believer in the second amendment, but we can't keep making the argument that guns are safe because of responsible gun owners, and then find out that he "forgot" where it was. There is nothing responsible in not knowing where your gun is AT ALL TIMES.
I was thinking "a rule is a rule" until I read the last line of the article:
"Some in the community wonder how a senior with just days left of school can be expelled when two years ago, the school's assistant principal accidentally brought a loaded gun to school in her car and was only suspended for three days."
Unloaded weapon gets expelled but a loaded weapon gets three days suspension?
Part of being a responsible gun owner is being responsible for your gun at all times and not "forgetting about it". I know it's a hard to way to learn a lesson but I think the rule should stick and is a good one.
Could you please cite an example in NC of someone getting the death penalty for the situation you describe??
It's an analogy (I thought that was obvious). The death penalty in this case refers to him not graduating/being suspended for a year. If he had a loaded gun in his car and he intended to use it, the school would have served him with the same penalty as they did with him forgetting he had a unloaded shotgun locked in his car that he did not intend to use.
Criminal law is all about intent (which it should be), whereas zero tolerance policies punish good people with no intent to do any harm the same as bad people with intent to do harm.
Zero Tolerance policies is a kin to gun free zones. Neither of them work as intended.
Part of being a responsible gun owner is being responsible for your gun at all times and not "forgetting about it". I know it's a hard to way to learn a lesson but I think the rule should stick and is a good one.
I understand what you're saying, but that logic is based on a zero tolerance policy.
If he left a loaded gun on the front seat of an unlocked car I would agree with you, but he left an unloaded shotgun locked in his vehicle not in plan site. IMO (and we can agree to disagree) those are two totally different situations, but are treated exactly the same do to zero tolerance policies. I believe he was being responsible in securing his shotgun, although stupid that he didn't take into account the school systems zero tolerance policy.
They're taking an honors student and making him not only unable to graduate high school on time, but also a felon. Common sense has completely left the building.
It's an analogy (I thought that was obvious). If he had a loaded gun in his car and he intended to use it, the school would have served him with the same penalty as they did with him forgetting he had a unloaded shotgun locked in his car that he did not intend to use.
Um, wow. Ok, let me regain my composure here.
If he had a loaded gun in his car and there was even a hint of belief that he intended to use it, the school would have notified the authorities, they would have swooped in, put him on his face on the ground, arrested the bejeepers out of him, tried him, and if there was proof, the guy would have been put away for a long time.
The only thing that would have been the same would be that people like you would still be making crazy analogies that didn't make sense, but somehow let you feel like you've proved your point...
Sorry, but you are just plain wrong. As I said, I agree that common sense should rule here, but that applies to those of us in the discussion too. To say that someone could bring a loaded gun to a school, display intent to use it, and that they'd only get a 365 day suspension is just silly. (I'm sure many wish that was the only consequence, but again, common sense dictates otherwise...)
Criminal law is all about intent (which it should be)
Not entirely. Yes, mens rea is an element of much of English and U.S. criminal law, but we also have criminal liabilty in situations of strict liability ("zero tolerance") and negligence.
What seems to be being mixed together here are really two separate questions: (1) was an offense committed, and (2) if so what should the punishment for that offense be? I think it is a mistake to back into an answer on the first question based on what the answer to the second question might be.
(b) It shall be a Class I felony for any person knowingly to possess or carry, whether openly or concealed, any gun, rifle, pistol, or other firearm of any kind on educational property or to a curricular or extracurricular activity sponsored by a school. Unless the conduct is covered under some other provision of law providing greater punishment, any person who willfully discharges a firearm of any kind on educational property is guilty of a Class F felony. However, this subsection does not apply to a BB gun, stun gun, air rifle, or air pistol.
Students are made aware of the law and policy from day one. Is anyone suggesting that lack of knowledge of the law, forgetting the law, or forgetting that you have broken the law excuses someone? Or if you are suggesting that the law and policy be rewritten, will you share how the text would read?
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