Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Those of us who others are dismissing, downplaying, insulting and calling us conspiracy theorists, simple because we don't take things we are given at face value. We look deeper into the data and look well beyond the hyped media headlines. We had major questions about the tests themselves and people thought we were crazy because we dared to question them. Remember the chants "We must listen to the science". Then as it turns out, we find out the tests are being set to a super sensitive level, which ends up making it not at all an apples to apples comparison, yet the media still hypes what they do. We are told we have to listen to and trust what the government says we need to do. Then we find out Cooper is cooking the books on a regular basis.
There are those who want to believe what they want to believe and who they want to believe, and then there are those of us who trust nothing as provided to us and will take the time to deep dive the info to get to the true reality.
As much there may be masks=fear, I'm seeing questioning or critiquing closures, mandates, and data automatically equated with muh rights duma$$ery/selfishness/death cults/general ignorance/money grubbing etc etc etc.
Thanks! I assumed that was where you were going with your post, but wanted to confirm.
With all due respect, your post highlights what I am talking about when it comes to people only wanting to think what they want to think. You made it a Box A or Box B thing, but never gave reality a chance. You hint at making fun of what you think other people think. m378 posted factual information that yes, many people are indeed in fear. We never said 100% live in fear, but a lot of people do. Please open your mind to understand and accept what is beyond your normal, your world, your life.
My man....
1. This point goes back to the umpteen different threads on this topic, where the line in the sand was basically "You are for life back to normal, or you live in fear, there is no third rail". That is by definition Box A or Box B, no room for nuance. I have lived on the third rail the entire duration of this mess. Taken the precautions I need to (masks, avoiding close talkers/telling them to back the F up, and have continued to wash my hands as I always did), conducted my business as needed (and wanted) and left the nutjobs at the two fringes to **** into the wind. You wanna lock yourself away in a closet for a year or two....knock yourself out meng. You want to go to a packed indoor rally and say this ain't real, and if it is, it's god's will....have fun m'lady. I'll be over here doing what I need to do to live my life.
2. "Never gave reality a chance"? What on Flat Earth are you talking about? I both believe I should continue to practice the 3 Ws and that the mandates are beyond what the situation seems to indicate is needed. What reality should I give a chance exactly?
3. "Hint at making fun of what you think other people think?" Welcome to the party pal. I have no issue having an open discussion around diversity of thought (regardless of what a certain poster may think). But if that "thought" doesn't come from a logic/fact based position, you're damn right I'll make fun of it. I'm sorry (actually no I am not), to steal Isaac Asimov's line, "my ignorance is as good as your knowledge" isn't a theory I subscribe to. I think two informed people can have diverging opinions on a issue (say tax policy) and neither are stupid; they just see two different ways to skin a cat. However if one of those people reach their position solely because "Grover Nordquist said so", then yes, one of them is in fact a brainless lemming.
This is America, you are free to value the source of information and the backing of your position as you choose and as a result, believe whatever you want. But there is literally zero expectation that I have to listen to it. That isn't how this works. I am well within my bounds to literally throw some jackass on ignore and move the F on. And almost any point that includes Facebook is a non starter for me. If that's mean, oh well. If that's sad, ok. If that's "wow GVoR, you're cutting out a crap ton of people" so be it. Place is a brain rotting cesspool that has given almost limitless megaphone power to people that society would have rightfully not known about a generation ago, or worse, people cosplaying as something they aren't.
Now, before you or anyone else goes "see, you live in an echo chamber". I actually don't. I am completely open to discussion of "issues" with people who rightfully may come to completely different conclusions to complex situations than I reach. Agree to disagree is a completely normal result of a discussion. I have no time for passive aggressive trolls who throw BS out as sourcing of a claim and cull them from my view without prejudice. If that gets their knickers in a bunch......oh well.
4.In case it wasn't clear, I wasn't even talking about m378 with anything I was stating. m378 and JaPaKoMom were having a dialogue. She brought up, accurately based on conversations here going back months, the "all or nothing" regarding the fear label being thrown around, and I jumped in to agree with that idea being bunk - that a person can both do what they need to do to protect themselves while not, at the same time, live in fear.
1. This point goes back to the umpteen different threads on this topic, where the line in the sand was basically "You are for life back to normal, or you live in fear, there is no third rail". That is by definition Box A or Box B, no room for nuance. I have lived on the third rail the entire duration of this mess. Taken the precautions I need to (masks, avoiding close talkers/telling them to back the F up, and have continued to wash my hands as I always did), conducted my business as needed (and wanted) and left the nutjobs at the two fringes to **** into the wind. You wanna lock yourself away in a closet for a year or two....knock yourself out meng. You want to go to a packed indoor rally and say this ain't real, and if it is, it's god's will....have fun m'lady. I'll be over here doing what I need to do to live my life.
2. "Never gave reality a chance"? What on Flat Earth are you talking about? I both believe I should continue to practice the 3 Ws and that the mandates are beyond what the situation seems to indicate is needed. What reality should I give a chance exactly?
3. "Hint at making fun of what you think other people think?" Welcome to the party pal. I have no issue having an open discussion around diversity of thought (regardless of what a certain poster may think). But if that "thought" doesn't come from a logic/fact based position, you're damn right I'll make fun of it. I'm sorry (actually no I am not), to steal Isaac Asimov's line, "my ignorance is as good as your knowledge" isn't a theory I subscribe to. I think two informed people can have diverging opinions on a issue (say tax policy) and neither are stupid; they just see two different ways to skin a cat. However if one of those people reach their position solely because "Grover Nordquist said so", then yes, one of them is in fact a brainless lemming.
This is America, you are free to value the source of information and the backing of your position as you choose and as a result, believe whatever you want. But there is literally zero expectation that I have to listen to it. That isn't how this works. I am well within my bounds to literally throw some jackass on ignore and move the F on. And almost any point that includes Facebook is a non starter for me. If that's mean, oh well. If that's sad, ok. If that's "wow GVoR, you're cutting out a crap ton of people" so be it. Place is a brain rotting cesspool that has given almost limitless megaphone power to people that society would have rightfully not known about a generation ago, or worse, people cosplaying as something they aren't.
Now, before you or anyone else goes "see, you live in an echo chamber". I actually don't. I am completely open to discussion of "issues" with people who rightfully may come to completely different conclusions to complex situations than I reach. Agree to disagree is a completely normal result of a discussion. I have no time for passive aggressive trolls who throw BS out as sourcing of a claim and cull them from my view without prejudice. If that gets their knickers in a bunch......oh well.
4.In case it wasn't clear, I wasn't even talking about m378 with anything I was stating. m378 and JaPaKoMom were having a dialogue. She brought up, accurately based on conversations here going back months, the "all or nothing" regarding the fear label being thrown around, and I jumped in to agree with that idea being bunk - that a person can both do what they need to do to protect themselves while not, at the same time, live in fear.
In this case, I'm speaking specifically to what you posted in the bold part below. I have seen this same type of statement from so many. Many people will assume those of us who question things as presented to us at first by "science" and "government" and want to do more deep dive research and investigation before just accepting it as all true are labeled as you just labeled in your post below. Many people will label us or think of us that way if we start suggesting maybe we should have handled it differently. You are making a Box A or Box B with your post.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GVoR
As I said to you in another thread, nuance is dead. Box A or Box B, no room for detail because detail is hard mmmmmkkkkkkaayyy.
I wear a mask; but continue to shop as needed, go out for food as needed, go and hang out with buddies as needed, sit in a car dealership and buy my wife a new to her truck as needed.....
But I live in "fear" because I am mask wearing and not plopping my ass down in a crowded bar.
Its all about hating virtues seen as weak. Nothing more. Concern, weak. Empathy, weak. Consideration, weak. Compromise, weak. Some people would rather play chicken with Mother Nature as a show of strength and anyone who doesn't go full Evel Knievel is a fearful weakling.
And there ain't nothing worse than being weak.
Edit: The other thing that comes to mind, not at all saying this is the case with you, is that people will dismiss any info that does not come from their own pre-approved biased source. So much so, that if a study from the most trusted science organization in the world is linked from an unapproved website, then people will throw out the study completely. If that same study comes from their pre-approved biased source, it's all of a sudden good. The point is that many people are so dead set locked into the way they think, they are not nearly as open to anything they don't agree with, as much as they think they are.
In this case, I'm speaking specifically to what you posted in the bold part below. I have seen this same type of statement from so many. Many people will assume those of us who question things as presented to us at first by "science" and "government" and want to do more deep dive research and investigation before just accepting it as all true are labeled as you just labeled in your post below. Many people will label us or think of us that way if we start suggesting maybe we should have handled it differently. You are making a Box A or Box B with your post.
HAHAHA! What!!!
That bolded part had literally nothing to do with you or m378 or Bo or Way2Land or CVAlicia. You all have, in some form or fashion (less so you) put up data and driven a conversation (more so you) about what the data is actually showing vis a vis the current Government actions (Local, State or Fed) and that is completely within the bounds of what we should be doing.
I have even got into the "questioning" with you guys. Science had never seen this virus before, our experts were learning on the fly. Missteps are part of learning. All normal. All expected. Grow and learn. Why are states that had it way worse than us getting back to normal and us, a state that never really got it bad, slow walking it? Fair questions and concerns.
If you think I was talking about YOU in the bolded....wow. What a leap my dude. There is a broader context to the gist of what I was saying that I simply think you don't have. Or maybe you lurked here for months, know all the back story to us getting to this point (conversationally) and just chose to apply it to yourself. I don't know.
To be clear. There are 100% conspiracy theorists within our little group here. I would, based on what each poster has shared, not put you, m378, Bo, Way2Land or CVAlicia (just to name the "Data Questioning" posters) into that bucket.
To those of you who keep harping on people's perceived "fear," keep in mind there is more than one kind of broad fear going around right now that is causing these feelings of anxiety and dread to compound quite a bit. It's not just about getting sick with the coronavirus. If only our current situation were that simple.
As I said to you in another thread, nuance is dead. Box A or Box B, no room for detail because detail is hard mmmmmkkkkkkaayyy.
I wear a mask; but continue to shop as needed, go out for food as needed, go and hang out with buddies as needed, sit in a car dealership and buy my wife a new to her truck as needed.....
But I live in "fear" because I am mask wearing and not plopping my ass down in a crowded bar.
Its all about hating virtues seen as weak. Nothing more. Concern, weak. Empathy, weak. Consideration, weak. Compromise, weak. Some people would rather play chicken with Mother Nature as a show of strength and anyone who doesn't go full Evel Knievel is a fearful weakling.
And there ain't nothing worse than being weak.
you assign this distinction, this demarcation line. I don't think anyone believes taking reasonable and effective precautions while carrying on puts you in the "fear" category.
you assign this distinction, this demarcation line. I don't think anyone believes taking reasonable and effective precautions while carrying on puts you in the "fear" category.
Just to confirm I wasn't crazy, I searched "fear" and a poster's screen name in this forum (as they were actually the one I had in mind when I made that post).
I won't name the poster, because I'm not really trying to shame them/put them on blast, rather confirm I am not insane.
The search results for that poster (who was one among many) is literally a greatest hits of this demarcation line as you put it.
If there have been conversations in the past, where the point of demarcation is basically "if you wear a mask, you live in fear. Let us non fearful people get back to living and you guys can stay scared." that in fact is exactly what I (and I think JaPaKoMom) were talking about.
This type of discussion occurred throughout May and June, again based on search results.
ETA - this is why I thought it was so funny that Thankful4 took that point as directed at him. I literally had a single poster in mind, and it wasn't Thankful4.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
