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I wasn't only talking about the teachers unions there. Michigan is more unionized than any state in the country, so I think there is a corilation there. How many manufactoring jobs has michigan lost? I'd say a lot of those jobs were lost in part due to unreasonable union demands that the companies could not meet.
I'm with you, Waterboy526. The average teacher in Detroit makes $47 / hour. That's in one of the worst school districts in the country. Look at the auto industry--the unions drove costs sky high to the point where we could not compete. My parents are fortunate enough to own two homes-one in MI and one is SW FL. The home in MI is probably worth twice what the home in FL is worth, but the MI taxes are 7 times higher. It would make me sick to have to send all that money to Detroit for their pathetic schools. Might as well flush it down the drain.
As far as teachers' pay in this area, it is low. However, if it were too low their would be a shortage and wages would increase. I haven't heard about any huge teacher shortage in Wake Co., so I'm guessing wages are appropriate.
Here's a link that breaks down average hourly wages for teachers. Raleigh is second to the bottom and the only area on the list where teachers made less than white collar non-sales positions. Civic Report 50 | table 1A
This is the South and that's how things are done here.
Those that feel NY or somewhere else is financially better for their situation should think hard before coming here.
If you think WCPSS pays badly, I used to live in New Orleans. Teachers there were making Walmart wages when I left in 1989.
Saturnfan, No offense intended, but you use the."this is the South" to explain many short comings in your area. Fact is, the Triangle is one of the most robost economic places to reside in all the USA. In fact, I think as of right now, this area has one of the best overall economic outlooks in the entire US. Technically it is the "South" as you state but you're still comparing apples to oranges here. This is not Southern Alabama here. Many here do not believe that teacher's salaries have followed suit with the rest of the growth and good economic times.
As for a teacher shortage? Sure they can always find a warm body to fill a position, but there actually has been a shortage of highly qualified educators in this area for quite some time. This is why they have recruiters. Something unheard of in most areas. I believe the wages have fallen behind the curve to attract highly qualified applicants in abundance. That being said, they might escape it for the time being, as we are heading into tough economic times. I'm sure their application pool is and will increase as time passes.
Saturnfan, No offense intended, but you use the."this is the South" to explain many short comings in your area. Fact is, the Triangle is one of the most robost economic places to reside in all the USA. In fact, I think as of right now, this area has one of the best overall economic outlooks in the entire US. Technically it is the "South" as you state but you're still comparing apples to oranges here. This is not Southern Alabama here. Many here do not believe that teacher's salaries have followed suit with the rest of the growth and good economic times.
As for a teacher shortage? Sure they can always find a warm body to fill a position, but there actually has been a shortage of highly qualified educators in this area for quite some time. This is why they have recruiters. Something unheard of in most areas. I believe the wages have fallen behind the curve to attract highly qualified applicants in abundance. That being said, they might escape it for the time being, as we are heading into tough economic times. I'm sure their application pool is and will increase as time passes.
I doubt increasing wages would increase the ratio of highly quilified educators to warm bodies, especially given the school system's inability to distinguish between the two.
As far as the existence of recruiters, I find it hard to believe that most school districts the size of WCPSS (the largest school district in NC and the 19th largest in the country) don't have recruiters.
This is the South and that's how things are done here.
Those that feel NY or somewhere else is financially better for their situation should think hard before coming here.
If you think WCPSS pays badly, I used to live in New Orleans. Teachers there were making Walmart wages when I left in 1989.
Wow........... a little defensive. I was making a point about how the teaching profession is not given it's respect. I was not dissing "the South"... obviously I like it if I am considering moving.
I have to say that I think it all comes down to "you get what you pay for". We pay huge taxes where I live but the public education is fantastic. If NC compensated their teachers better, they could get higher quality teachers. I see a similar situation in NYC. They are having trouble recruiting new police officers (because the pay is horrible). Do you think they would raise the pay? No - can't do that. So, they lower their criteria and they are now hiring people with misdemeanor records. Isn't that just a great solution?
I have to say that I think it all comes down to "you get what you pay for". We pay huge taxes where I live but the public education is fantastic. If NC compensated their teachers better, they could get higher quality teachers. I see a similar situation in NYC. They are having trouble recruiting new police officers (because the pay is horrible). Do you think they would raise the pay? No - can't do that. So, they lower their criteria and they are now hiring people with misdemeanor records. Isn't that just a great solution?
Are the people of Detroit getting what they pay for out of their $47/hour teachers? I doubt it. The schools in West Cary are uniformly excellent and their teachers make no more than the teachers in the poorly performing Wake County schools. I highly doubt that increasing wages would attract better teachers and improve schools. I live in a school district that spends about $7k/student and it in my opinion is as good as the schools I grew up in in CT that currently spend about $15k/student--I guess I'm just getting a really good deal!
Are the people of Detroit getting what they pay for out of their $47/hour teachers? I doubt it. The schools in West Cary are uniformly excellent and their teachers make no more than the teachers in the poorly performing Wake County schools. I highly doubt that increasing wages would attract better teachers and improve schools. I live in a school district that spends about $7k/student and it in my opinion is as good as the schools I grew up in in CT that currently spend about $15k/student--I guess I'm just getting a really good deal!
Couldn't agree more. Look at some cities on that list that are highly paid. A lot of those places are the WORST school districts in the country. They are not getting out of their students what they pay their teachers.
Couldn't agree more. Look at some cities on that list that are highly paid. A lot of those places are the WORST school districts in the country. They are not getting out of their students what they pay their teachers.
Those "worst" school districts are often the ones with the highest concentration of high-needs students (low-income, at risk, special education, english language learners, etc.). Most teachers will agree that teaching these populations is more challenging than teaching students with supportive parents who make sure their kids are on grade level and handle their issues themselves without relying entirely on the school system to handle it for them. You need to pay those teachers well to make the job worth it -- worth the drive into a neighborhood where crime may be common; worth it to have to fight kids every day to give them an education they don't want; worth it to act as teacher, police officer, nurse, parent, friend and counselor to kids who for whatever reason aren't getting that support elsewhere.
Those "worst" school districts are often the ones with the highest concentration of high-needs students (low-income, at risk, special education, english language learners, etc.). Most teachers will agree that teaching these populations is more challenging than teaching students with supportive parents who make sure their kids are on grade level and handle their issues themselves without relying entirely on the school system to handle it for them. You need to pay those teachers well to make the job worth it -- worth the drive into a neighborhood where crime may be common; worth it to have to fight kids every day to give them an education they don't want; worth it to act as teacher, police officer, nurse, parent, friend and counselor to kids who for whatever reason aren't getting that support elsewhere.
You're right they should make $100k a year to do that. I think all Police officers and fire fighters should also make $100k a year for doing the exact same things you mentioned and more, but it just can't happen unfortunetly.
Our kids did great at WCPSS. A very good value for the taxes charged.
Fiscal responsibility is a good thing, but I do agree that teachers are undercompensated for the enormous responsibility they carry on their shoulders.
Teaching was never the road to riches.
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