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I currently live in NJ just outside of NYC in a very upscale, but extremely over priced and over taxed area. I like the area I live in a lot, but I hate the fact that is is so expensive and I would like warmer weather. I want to start a family where we can have a better life.
I am considering moving to either Charlotte (Dilworth, Myers park, Ballantyne or South Park area) or the Raliegh area (cary, chapel hill or holly springs).
Finding a job is not a problem (I am well aware of the job market for those that feel inclined to mention it). I want an area that has a lot to do and isn't a sleepy suburb, but I want it to be family friendly with good schools as well.
On one hand I feel Charlotte is more of a city (which I like), but I have heard that Raliegh has better schools. Plus, raliegh has Duke and UNC which helps the culture. I want the southern charm and politeness with out what one might describe as being "country". I want the vibrant atmosphere and culture of a nyc, chicago, dc with the southern charm. I realize this utopia doesnt exist, but which would be closer of the two?
I am 31 and about to start a family. I would like to know a few things from others who have moved and from locals. I appreciate any honest feedback. I apologize for any stereotypes.
1. What area is better for young families?
2. Which area has more educated people?
3. Which area has more to do (i like sports, outdoor activities, movies, concerts etc)?
4. Which area is more expensive?
5. Which area feels less country?
6. Which area within each city would you recommend?
The best advice I can give you is to make a trip to both areas to see which one you like best. That's what my husband and I did. We spent time in Raleigh and Charlotte before deciding that Raleigh suited our needs best. Once you have decided between the two, then you can address many of your questions in more detail.
I want the southern charm and politeness with out what one might describe as being "country". I want the vibrant atmosphere and culture of a nyc, chicago, dc with the southern charm. I realize this utopia doesnt exist, but which would be closer of the two?
Actually, somewhere around Atlanta sounds like the closest thing you'll find to that. Both more "city" and more "country".
I lived in Charlotte for five years and Raleigh for six. I cannot speak to your question about families as I don't have children.
I think it is very safe to assume that there are more educated people in Raleigh.
As for what area has more to do, I would say that unless you are an extreme cultural connoisseur, you will find that Raleigh and Charlotte are close substitutes both offering about the same mix of entertainment options, cultural activities and recreational amenities. If country isn't your bag, points for Raleigh as there are no NASCAR activities here (Charlotte has lots).
The Triangle area might be marginally more expensive to live in than Charlotte at best but it is more likely that the cost of living in both regions is equal.
The case could probably be made that the Triangle is slightly less provincial than Charlotte. It is a point of fact that there is a higher percentage of foreign born residents in the Triangle (although not much higher) and its geographic location makes it slightly more accessible from the northeast.
Certainly, the Charlotte area gets points because a large percentage of its residents are concentrated in a single central city. Regardless, the feel of Charlotte is hardly different than what you will find in Raleigh/Cary, especially if you locate yourself south of Dilworth. It is worth pointing out that Cary is more or less an extension of Raleigh and if you combine the populations of both cities, you end up with 380,000 + 140,000 = 520,000 and this is not much less than the population of Charlotte.
The population of the Triangle is growing faster than that of Charlotte as a point of fact.
Charlotte gets major points for providing lots and lots of fairly affordable condominiums and townhouses located close to the center city that all have a modern or at least non-traditional architectural style. Relatively speaking, there is a dearth of that kind of thing in Raleigh. Plus Charlotte is hands down more pedestrian and transit friendly, especially in the center city and points south. For detached housing, in addition to the neighborhoods you listed, check out the Elizabeth community or Sedgefield. Ballantyne is a bit remote, much less pedestrian and transit friendly, and way more homogeneous.
In the Triangle, I would check out downtown Raleigh or neighborhoods located immediately to the west. If you can afford it, the neighborhoods west of Downtown Raleigh between Wade Ave and Hillsborough Street offer a lot of amenities (pedestrian access to Cameron Village, NCSU, etc.) and good schools. Neighborhoods north of Wade Avenue are nice too (and pricey). Cary is nice also, definitely more homogeneous than central Raleigh, but a lot more pedestrian friendly than north Raleigh.
You might already know this but I'll just mention that while your property taxes are certain to go way down in North Carolina, you'll probably find that state income tax is higher here than it is in NJ.
Last edited by Nelson919; 09-23-2009 at 07:58 PM..
I just heard on the news today that the Triangle is the #3 among the most educated areas of the country. Ranking higher were the Northern Viriginia/DC area & San Jose/Oakland/SanFrancisco.
I lived in Charlotte for five years and Raleigh for six. I cannot speak to your question about families as I don't have children.
I think it is very safe to assume that there are more educated people in Raleigh.
As for what area has more to do, I would say that unless you are an extreme cultural connoisseur, you will find that Raleigh and Charlotte are close substitutes both offering about the same mix of entertainment options, cultural activities and recreational amenities. If country isn't your bag, points for Raleigh as there are no NASCAR activities here (Charlotte has lots).
The Triangle area might be marginally more expensive to live in than Charlotte at best but it is more likely that the cost of living in both regions is equal.
The case could probably be made that the Triangle is slightly less provincial than Charlotte. It is a point of fact that there is a higher percentage of foreign born residents in the Triangle (although not much higher) and its geographic location makes it slightly more accessible from the northeast.
Certainly, the Charlotte area gets points because a large percentage of its residents are concentrated in a single central city. Regardless, the feel of Charlotte is hardly different than what you will find in Raleigh/Cary, especially if you locate yourself south of Dilworth. It is worth pointing out that Cary is more or less an extension of Raleigh and if you combine the populations of both cities, you end up with 380,000 + 140,000 = 520,000 and this is not much less than the population of Charlotte.
The population of the Triangle is growing faster than that of Charlotte as a point of fact.
Charlotte gets major points for providing lots and lots of fairly affordable condominiums and townhouses located close to the center city that all have a modern or at least non-traditional architectural style. Relatively speaking, there is a dearth of that kind of thing in Raleigh. Plus Charlotte is hands down more pedestrian and transit friendly, especially in the center city and points south. For detached housing, in addition to the neighborhoods you listed, check out the Elizabeth community or Sedgefield. Ballantyne is a bit remote, much less pedestrian and transit friendly, and way more homogeneous.
In the Triangle, I would check out downtown Raleigh or neighborhoods located immediately to the west. If you can afford it, the neighborhoods west of Downtown Raleigh between Wade Ave and Hillsborough Street offer a lot of amenities (pedestrian access to Cameron Village, NCSU, etc.) and good schools. Neighborhoods north of Wade Avenue are nice too (and pricey). Cary is nice also, definitely more homogeneous than central Raleigh, but a lot more pedestrian friendly than north Raleigh.
You might already know this but I'll just mention that while your property taxes are certain to go way down in North Carolina, you'll probably find that state income tax is higher here than it is in NJ.
Wow! What a great and balanced post. I am definitely giving you rep points. One thing that struck me as odd is that the OP was comparing what I would consider not so comparable areas between the two Metros. When I see the Charlotte list (save Ballantyne), I immediately think of someone who wants an older, more urban and more established sort of living. Then, I see the list from Raleigh (Triangle) and it doesn't seem like the OP is comparing the most similar areas. I think your post goes a long way toward steering the OP in a direction that will help him make the best decision.
If I was considering Myers Park, Dilworth and South Park in Charlotte, I might look at Hayes Barton, Cameron Park, Glenwood Brooklyn or 5 Points in Raleigh. In broader terms, I'd look at areas from Downtown and its immediate surroundings then I'd move in a general NW direction and fan out toward the Beltline. But, to be comparable, I'd stay mainly inside the beltline or just a bit outside of it. I would highly recommend any of those areas but I would probably steer clear of Country Club Hills. It might be too clique-ish and blue blood for a newcomer to stomach. I only say this because I have heard stories from others who say that they'd never buy there again for that reason.
If I were looking at Ballantyne, I'd probably look at some of the higher end sections of Cary or, perhaps, the Wakefield area in extreme North Raleigh. Chapel Hill is an option that is going to be much different from anything you'll find in Charlotte because it's literally a college town. Its identity is wrapped around UNC. The OP might find that either a positive or a negative. It all depends on him.
Regarding some of the specific metrics in broad brush terms, here's my take on it:
Raleigh will offer you a more educated population with better school district performance, lower crime rates and activities built around the universities and those things that a state capital can offer (state museums, symphony, performing arts, etc.). It will offer you NHL Hockey, minor league baseball, college football and the best college basketball culture in the country. Raleigh provides a substantial and mature parks and recreations department including a substantial network of greenways and city parks. Raleigh offers you a smaller but rapidly growing DT scene including a growing number of restaurants, nightclubs and festivals. It will offer all this at a slightly more expensive price point than Charlotte.
From what I know, Charlotte will offer you a bigger central city core, the NFL & NBA, its city symphony and performing arts center and museums. It offers more upscale shopping (especially specialty stores like Tiffany) that aren't in Raleigh or the Triangle area. You will have more choices in older, established neighborhoods near the city core. But...it comes with higher crime rates, a lower performing school district and a less educated population. Now, this doesn't mean that Charlotte is a horrible place, I am just comparing your criteria from city to city. Raleigh just happens to be the safest larger city in NC in one of the most educated areas in the nation.
Thank you everyone for all of the well thought out and honest answers. I will try to offer up more info in response.
One poster mentioned Atlanta as a possibility. I have been to Atlanta. I do feel like it has a cosmopolitan feel in downtown and buckhead. That being said, the traffic was comparable to NYC/NNJ area and I found Raliegh and Charlotte to be much cleaner and aesthetically pleasing. I forgot to mention that I have been to both Charlotte (once) and the triangle area (twice). I would probably consider Atlanta (as the third option), but my better half hated it. I should probably take her opinion into consideration.
Even though I have been to both places, I haven't been enough to pick between the two. In Charlotte I spent some time in uptown (it was raining all the days which made seeing it hard), on lake norman and in dilworth south to ballantyne.
In Raliegh, I have been to UNC Chapel Hill, Duke (and surrrounding areas briefly), Holly Springs shortly and to The Barn Steakhouse (very good by the way).
I feel I need to clarify where I want to live within one of these areas. I do want to live in a very family friendly area (parks, good schools, safe), but I would like it to be in an area that doesnt shut down at 8pm. Somewhere that either has a slightly urban feel to it, but two blocks away is suburban (but not retirement or nothing around you suburban). If the town doesnt have an urban feel I would want it to be close enough to the city for a short drive. Someone else mentioned places and spoke of public transportation and pedestrian friendliness. Those things would be important to me. I would like some level of walkability (whether that be to uptown charlotte, or to the local town center).
I chose ballantyne, Myers Park, Dilworth and South Park in Charlotte because I have been told that those are the more popular areas for young families with good schools and lots of amenities. I realize that they are different (b is like pleasantvile and dilworth feels like a more suburban hoboken).
In Raliegh I only know of the college areas and holly springs (and not much). What are considered the best areas for young families in the triangle area that are considered hip/trendy and upscale? I hope that didnt come off as elitist.....as that is not my intention. My home price range would be 450-750 though id prefer to stay on the lower end of that (cheaper housing is one of the reasons I am moving haha).
I want the area that has the most to do yet is still family friendly. In nyc/nnj you meet tons of highly motivated and educated people and I love that. I want to live where I become friends with people who will want to go to the game, but can also have an intelligent discussion about business, politics, movies or books.
I realize I am all over the place so forgive me. I am trying to figure out whether the triangle of charlotte is better for me and what areas specifically would be best. I appreciate the feedback to date and any new information that you all give me.
What are considered the best areas for young families in the triangle area that are considered hip/trendy and upscale? I hope that didnt come off as elitist.....as that is not my intention. My home price range would be 450-750 though id prefer to stay on the lower end of that (cheaper housing is one of the reasons I am moving haha).
"Family-friendly" and "hip" don't go hand in hand here much. The "hip" places are near downtown and tend to be young demographics or some of the many new condo buildings going up (though you might look into some of them: West on North, for example?). Otherwise, the Triangle area (side note--you refer to "Raleigh" and then mention UNC, Duke, etc, which are not in Raleigh, but are in 'The Triangle', the metro area) is known for being very suburban: Cary, most of Raleigh north of the Beltline, and all of the southern Wake County suburbs are one cul-de-sac after another. They fit the "family friendly" description to a T, but are nowhere near any "nightlife".
Your budget won't be a problem here. But satisfying both of your "criteria" probably will be.
Thanks Francois for the reply. I dont need NYC or DC levels of nightlife, but I would like the ability to go out for some drinks. I am getting older so I dont want to go "party" every weekend, but I want it to be available for the moments when I want to. I do need some good restaurants and maybe a lounge or sports bar or two. Is this not available in the triangle area? I meant the triangle area but kept saying Raliegh....sorry.
What about golf courses and lakes? I am a huge college sports fan so that helps as well. Charlotte seems to have more to do and has a little bit of city and Raliegh has the universities and more family friendly neighborhoods.
Thanks Francois for the reply. I dont need NYC or DC levels of nightlife, but I would like the ability to go out for some drinks. I am getting older so I dont want to go "party" every weekend, but I want it to be available for the moments when I want to. I do need some good restaurants and maybe a lounge or sports bar or two. Is this not available in the triangle area? I meant the triangle area but kept saying Raliegh....sorry.
What about golf courses and lakes? I am a huge college sports fan so that helps as well. Charlotte seems to have more to do and has a little bit of city and Raliegh has the universities and more family friendly neighborhoods.
Hi Kurt,
Special note: Raleigh is spelled with the e before the i. I know that flies in the face of the i before e rule. But, then again, perhaps that's why that rule is going away?
You might want to check out the North Hills area of Raleigh on your next visit. It's emerging as the "midtown" area of the city and might be what you seek. Homes in the area are certainly in your price point and you can walk to a growing walkable community of resources.
Cameron Village is another good option. On its south side, Cameron Park is my favorite Raleigh neighborhood.... but it's pricey. It's one mile west of DT and is walking distance to 6 blocks of shopping at Cameron Village Shopping Center, NC State University, the Glenwood South entertainment district (for those times when you do want to party), a huge city park (Pullen Park) and other community resources that make it truly a special community. Many professors call Cameron Park home, so you will also be intellectually stimulated. Homes in that neighborhood were typically built in the early 20th century and they can get quite pricey: especially if they are fully renovated and updated. On the North side of Cameron Village, there's a neighborhood of midcentury ranches that will be on the lower end of your price point. They are also walkable to the shopping center but are just a bit further to walk to the other areas that are more convenient to Cameron Park.
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