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Texas Horse Lady--so the buyer would have a case against the agent for non-disclosure? We replaced the pipes at our cost within a week of our agent telling us about the problem. Where would that leave us legally as the sellers? Does the agent have any responsibility to us for telling us not to disclose something that was a costly issue to us later?
When you were notified that you had an option - one of which was paying $20 a month... for what and how long? What was the other option?
I would guess it contained a provision that if the property sold, the line had to be immediately replaced.
And then you sold the house and did the replacement. It's your property, I bet if you had called the water company to confirm, they would have told you the new buyer couldn't turn on the water until the line was replaced. You did the right thing, eventually.
However, also in Texas, the listing agent is required to disclose any problems with the house that they might know about. So the buyer might have a case against the listing agent.
Yes, this is a case for a real estate attorney.
OP... Right here is your answer. The agent may have screwed up by advising you what not to disclose.
That's asking for trouble as an agent. Can you prove it though ?
Texas Horse Lady--so the buyer would have a case against the agent for non-disclosure? We replaced the pipes at our cost within a week of our agent telling us about the problem. Where would that leave us legally as the sellers? Does the agent have any responsibility to us for telling us not to disclose something that was a costly issue to us later?
Do you really have damages ?
Would you not have had to replace the pipes even if you disclosed ?
Bbronston--the notice said that the sewer lines were not compatible (or something similar) with the city's system, but replacement was not required. The homeowner could choose to replace or pay the $20/month. I recall no further communication about a replacement deadline or a requirement to replace the pipes in the case of new ownership. I'm not saying that there wasn't a communication, I'm saying that we were not aware of such and would surely have checked if our agent hadn't told that it wasn't an issue. No, we did not disclose the $20/month on her advice--she said since it would be the new owner's decision to pay monthly or replace the lines, it didn't involve us.
I don't know what effect knowing that the pipes would have to be replaced would have had on the sale, but disclosure of the issue at the beginning would have saved everyone a lot of frustration, and maybe some cost for us, too. Yes, we're upset about the cost--if it was $34 or even $340, it wouldn't be that big of a deal. She should have taken responsibility for at least part of the cost because she knew the situation and mislead us.
At the very least, if she had admitted she was wrong, we wouldn't feel like we were blamed for the mistake (or whatever it was). As it is, when she found out that the whole thing WAS an issue, she distanced herself from us as quickly as she could and placed the blame squarely on us. We were left to deal with the buyers--who thought we deceived them intentionally--ourselves. She never admitted to making a mistake, never apologized, and never contacted us again. A little unprofessional, I think.
Well, you can't disclose something you don't know. Even if your agent had said just write in that you are paying a surcharge on the sewer (and I would argue that she should not have told you what to disclose or not disclose), it would not have made any difference based on what you've stated. The issue would have come up either way. I think the questions are: did you verify with the city that the new owner could not pay the surcharge or did you just take the buyer's word for it? If I were your agent, I would have verified that first. Assuming it had to be done, is there any language in the contract that deals with this kind of circumstance? The contract is the road map for most issues. Finally, assuming that you didn't want to do things their way and you were willing to lose the buyer, where would you have been? You'd still have to disclose to the next buyer and you'd more than likely still end up either paying for it, taking less, or possibly both. I understand your frustration. I am dealing with two annoyingly unprofessional agents right now and it stinks. All you can do is roll with the punches and make it work as best you can.
Bbronston--thank you so much for your thoughts! To be clear, this all happened AFTER closing. We were in our new house, and had been out of our old house for a couple of days already. The buyers of our old house were having some remodeling done and had not moved in, but were having the utilities turned on. When this happened, our agent called us sounding frantic, and said that the buyer’s agent was so upset that “you”(my husband and me) had not disclosed the sewer issue. We told her that we had discussed it with her when I was completing the disclosure and that she told us then it did not have to be disclosed. She said, “Well, you knew about it and didn’t disclose it, so you are responsible for replacing it unless you want to get sued.” She suggested we get three estimates, gave us the buyer’s contact information and told us to call them when we had arranged for the work to be done, then said she had to call the buyer’s agent back and hung up.
She didn’t say anything about her or the other agent verifying the information, nothing about the contract and what it may or may not state about the situation, and nothing about her part in the whole mess. We didn’t even think to ask these questions. We certainly didn’t want any legal issues, and, wanting to do the right thing, arranged to have the work done. Yes, we may have had to get it done anyway, but after being advised in the beginning by an agent who is supposed to be helping us that we weren’t responsible for the sewer situation, it comes as a big shock to be told that we are responsible after everything is signed and done. Being basically abandoned after she told us was just an added bonus.
Last edited by GlamMa'am; 07-08-2013 at 07:47 PM..
Reason: Delete font type and size information
Bbronston--thank you so much for your thoughts! To be clear, this all happened AFTER closing. We were in our new house, and had been out of our old house for a couple of days already. The buyers of our old house were having some remodeling done and had not moved in, but were having the utilities turned on. When this happened, our agent called us sounding frantic, and said that the buyer’s agent was so upset that “you”(my husband and me) had not disclosed the sewer issue. We told her that we had discussed it with her when I was completing the disclosure and that she told us then it did not have to be disclosed. She said, “Well, you knew about it and didn’t disclose it, so you are responsible for replacing it unless you want to get sued.” She suggested we get three estimates, gave us the buyer’s contact information and told us to call them when we had arranged for the work to be done, then said she had to call the buyer’s agent back and hung up.
She didn’t say anything about her or the other agent verifying the information, nothing about the contract and what it may or may not state about the situation, and nothing about her part in the whole mess. We didn’t even think to ask these questions. We certainly didn’t want any legal issues, and, wanting to do the right thing, arranged to have the work done. Yes, we may have had to get it done anyway, but after being advised in the beginning by an agent who is supposed to be helping us that we weren’t responsible for the sewer situation, it comes as a big shock to be told that we are responsible after everything is signed and done. Being basically abandoned after she told us was just an added bonus.
Glam - First - File a complaint with the State about your realtor intentionally misleading you and then not informing the sellers of a material fact of which she was aware. She could & should lose her license over this. There are enough terrible agents in Texas, you should go ahead and see to it that she gets reprimanded.
Also, is she an agent or a Broker? If she is just an agent, then its time to go up the chain and talk to her broker in charge. Call him/her and set up a face to face meeting. She deprived you of negotiating power in this sale and that was her fault. You are damaged to the tune of $3400. Dont let it go even if it does not represent a huge sum of money to you....The broker in charge will probably reprimand her too, and force her to compensate you for her mistake.
You may or may not have a hard time getting at least some compensation from her or her broker for this. This type of thing is precisely why so many agents have such a bad reputation...they screw their own clients and want nothing to do with them when the information that they gave causes them a loss. The fault rests squarely on her. I know it, you know it, and I can pretty much assure you that if you take this to a court-room a jury will agree with you.
Before taking it to the courtroom though, you should go up the chain and see if you get any traction with her broker.
It is a shame that you had a greedy dishonest agent...be sure you rate her an F on your transaction if you can. Put information out on Facebook and other social media sites (all true - do not lie) that shames her, and be sure to tag her in the posts....There are lots of steps that you can take that will make her life a living hell that she may just compensate you to go away.
Dont let it drop, or else she will just do it to someone else. Yes you should have disclosed it, but you trusted a professional, and were lied to so she could make an easy sale. She should be shamed, disciplined, and forced to pay your damages.
Both are at fault so if you go after her you will also be incl. in a lawsuit or whatever you will do.
It is sellers sole responsibility to fill out the property disclosures and yesterday we got he forms in Florida and again I stretched to all agents in our office to have seller fill them out and to disclose it all...more is better then less, and to have it in sellers own handwriting if possible.
In the end can you proof you disclosed it other than with words? If not it will be hard to proof since you didn't put it in the property disclosures...the realtor can turn around and sue you as we'll, so think before you act.
You benefited from not disclosing and it was wrong and therefore again we tell all the time DISCLOSE! It will make you sleep better after the closing!
If the buyer wouldn't have said anything you would have been ok with not disclosing so to me it is kind of hypocrite to blame the realtor solely since you are the one who knew and filled out and signed and dated the form and were fine with not disclosing!
I want to agree with bentlebee to some extent, but also recognize that marksmu is an attorney and in the state where the incident has occurred.
Agent: error of commission?
Seller: error of omission?
Someone will come out of pocket to satisfy a claim, and the small amount of $3400 is too low to kick in E&O. It should be less than the deductible. Unless attorney costs get involved.
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