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Wow !!! Clearly that would be a violation of the Civil Rights Act and the HOA could be sued in Federal Court and would lose. All it would have taken would have been a letter by an attorney to get such wording deleted. As previously stated, the HOA rules cannot supersede federal/state/county/city regulations.
I have seen the same wording in old neighborhood covenants here, without any HOA. Who would enforce that? No one would be able to get an attorney to try.
Wow !!! Clearly that would be a violation of the Civil Rights Act and the HOA could be sued in Federal Court and would lose. All it would have taken would have been a letter by an attorney to get such wording deleted. As previously stated, the HOA rules cannot supersede federal/state/county/city regulations.
Exactly... I just wish HOA's wouldn't put the burden of proof on the property owner when the HOA doesn't know the applicable laws such as changes to Landscape and Fire Protection ordinance, etc.
In short... just because the HOA has a written rule, policy or procedure doesn't mean it is enforceable or they will not be held liable for damages...
There was a story in an upscale community where a lawyer felt he was being harassed by the HOA board.
Right or wrong, the lawyer made fighting the board his own personal crusade and it all started over a motorcycle he owned... the conflict bankrupted the HOA and no one was willing to be an officer of director...
I helped a friend years ago when she was harassed about planting a drought tolerant landscape... as part of her interior remodeling permit... approved by the city and the HOA... the water district required she install drought tolerant landscape and reduce the footprint of her lawn... the water district is part of the city.
I helped her answer every letter and write the responses... the process went on for nine months and she accrued fines for not replacing the lawn that had been removed.
In the end... she won. She didn't have to replace anything or pay any fines.
The HOA actually adopted the water conservation measures... it just took them about 6 months to do it and then she was still being hounded because the fine was prior to the new rule adoption.
I just have to ask myself why?
Last edited by Ultrarunner; 01-14-2013 at 12:24 PM..
Without an HOA, worst case scenario is I have a crappy neighbor who drives down property values and I can't resell for as much. I guess, technically, it could drive values down so much that I am underwater and house goes short sale/foreclosure.
With an HOA, worst case scenario is special assessments/rate increases/OR a crappy neighbor making my life a living hell, and the house gets foreclosed on by the HOA.
So basically, with or without, the worst case scenario ends with losing the house because of things beyond our control.
I don't honestly believe there will be any problems with the HOA, I am just so nervous that something could happen. I think it is the damn media hype, all those stories about people planting the wrong color flowers, or building a tree house for their kids, or letting their toddler draw on the driveway with chalk, and the HOA being obnoxious about it. You don't hear stories about neighbors driving down property values as much.
This is exactly what happened to my brother. He was was told he was not "allowed" to have anything other than white Christmas lights outside, only "approved" door hangings, nothing on his front lawn and only certain color flowers/plants depending on the season. They also gave him a hard time because his Christmas tree and garlands with colored lights could be seen from the street. His kids were not to use chalk on the driveway and they could not even have a playhouse or leave any toys in their backyard, and were not allowed even a kiddie pool, and there was not a community pool nor did they take care of any maintenance aside from snow removal. Needless to say, he moved out after only a few years. Luckily, this was not in his original agreement so he did not abide by any of it, so they could not do anything legally about it, but the harrassment was over the top, so he left.
I think if you spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on a home, you should be able to decorate anyway you wish. You paid for it, not the association.
I would never buy a home in one either. My house, my choices.
Anytime one buys into an HOA community they should read the CC&R's and the Rules (which explain and clarify the CC&R's)
If they can't agree with the covenants, then don't buy there.
If they buy into an HOA community and the board members (who are neighbors that are willing to volunteer their time to their community), are not doing the job properly, then volunteer to be a member of the board and work to make changes for the better.
The HOA is made up of each homeowner in the community, and each should be willing to do their part for the community. Leaving it up to the neighbors to volunteer to do all the work required of the board of directors, and then calling them Nazi's because of not agreeing with the job they are doing, is not the proper way to go about it.
HOAs are just another way to create a means to enforce another layer of government upon others. Make no mistake about it, a HOA is nothing more than a quasi government with the ability to tell others what they can do, when and how they can do it, all under the guise of the greater good.
Federal laws and regulations aren't good enough so we have state laws and regulations which aren't good enough so we have country and city ordinances which aren't goods enough so lets have a HOA where at the street level those who can't live with others without wanting to control things a bit more can have it their way.
Now, the few can say what everyone else does. I say the few because in a typical HOA, how many are truly active vs passive? You see, the HOA counts on this aspect of human nature. Typically, a home owner owns a home to get away from the restrictions of apartment living or renting a house. Here comes the HOA and you are back to square one.
Instead of talking to a neighbor who is doing something that bothers you (it might not bother anyone else) the HOA does it for you. It is a fact that most people will vote in a HOA for things in a default situation. In other words, it doesn't bother them but what the heck, check off yes. Now everyone is affected.
Why not just run for public office and if the matter is that serious, push to impose those views on everyone. Why not indeed. Probably because they'd be run out of town.
You can always tell a HOA neighborhood as you drive through. Everything looks the same. The world would implode if someone painted their mailbox a different color. The idea of not looking at it probably never occurred.
A great many HOAs provide amenities in a neighborhood that are highly desirable to many residents. Tot lots. Playgrounds. Swimming pools. Tennis. Greenways. Clubhouses. Landscaping of common areas.
Golf courses. Basketball courts. Volleyball courts. Dog parks. Lakes and ponds.
I'm not a huge fan, having never lived in one, but it is unbelievable the extent that some people will go to spread ignorance and fear and loathing via BS.
If I were buying I would want a home in a nice area with no HOA. Here in slower/lower Delaware the HOAs seem to be in newer developments. There are plenty of homes in nice suburban areas , They have the right to enter your home?? How about if your dog bite them??
A great many HOAs provide amenities in a neighborhood that are highly desirable to many residents. Tot lots. Playgrounds. Swimming pools. Tennis. Green-belts. Clubhouses. Landscaping of common areas.
Golf courses. Basketball courts. Volleyball courts. Dog parks. Lakes and ponds.
I'm not a huge fan, having never lived in one, but it is unbelievable the extent that some people will go to spread ignorance and fear and loathing via BS.
I think it is good to hear other's experiences... both positive and not.
If you desire the amenities a particular HOA provides... it could be a perfect match.
Things like extra security, pools, parks, greenbelts to exterior maintenance.
I would never tell anyone not to worry about it.
Recently, I was going through the refi process on my home. I also have rentals and one is in a HOA. This HOA home has nothing to do with my refi as in it was free and clear and provided income.
I was very surprised when the underwriter wanted more information on the HOA and the equivalent of a financial statement. When I asked... I was told as an owner of a property in a HOA I am on the hook for underfunded/deferred maintenance and liability issues... I think I mentioned just prior to my buying the HOA was in a multi-year lawsuit with the result of special assessments and hiked fees.
Evidently, my lender was concerned enough to request specific information about a property that I happened to own simply because it is in a HOA
I think it is good to hear other's experiences... both positive and not.
If you desire the amenities a particular HOA provides... it could be a perfect match.
Things like extra security, pools, parks, greenbelts to exterior maintenance.
I would never tell anyone not to worry about it.
Recently, I was going through the refi process on my home. I also have rentals and one is in a HOA. This HOA home has nothing to do with my refi as in it was free and clear and provided income.
I was very surprised when the underwriter wanted more information on the HOA and the equivalent of a financial statement. When I asked... I was told as an owner of a property in a HOA I am on the hook for underfunded/deferred maintenance and liability issues... I think I mentioned just prior to my buying the HOA was in a multi-year lawsuit with the result of special assessments and hiked fees.
Evidently, my lender was concerned enough to request specific information about a property that I happened to own simply because it is in a HOA
"I think it is good to hear other's experiences... both positive and not."
I have to say, I agree with you. That is why I quoted a post that was only a screed, with no reference to any experiences whatsoever ...both postive or not.
I see that your post includes a reference to a personal experience. And it is interesting.
I have chosen proactively to live in a neighborhood without an HOA, for my own reasons, and I am comfortable with that decision. Yet, I feel no need to come into a forum and spread gratuitous goofiness.
...Instead of talking to a neighbor who is doing something that bothers you (it might not bother anyone else) the HOA does it for you...
When one neighbor goes to another and complains about what bothers them, it usually starts an ongoing conflict.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mack Knife
It is a fact that most people will vote in a HOA for things in a default situation. In other words, it doesn't bother them but what the heck, check off yes. Now everyone is affected.
From my experience as a board member for the past 6 years it is extremely difficult to get people to participate, to come to meetings, or to vote. In a community with 150 homes when we send out ballots for the annual election of board members, that require 10% of the members to constitute a quorum, we usually get no more than 20 ballots returned, including the board members ballots.
Changes in a covenant will require around 75% of members to vote. That is virtually impossible to achieve. When we needed to get that many votes once, we had to send out several letters explaining the reasons and the savings to the community, then we had to go door to door asking people to vote (not how to vote) but just asking them read the information and vote.
I was also on the board of our master community, with 2000 homes. At an annual meeting there is never more than 50-60 people. For the board member election, there would be no more than 300 votes mailed in.
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