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Thanks for letting me pick your brains. Again as a first time buyer I am just trying to learn the ropes here & make the best decision. We are in NY-Eastern LI.
We are about to sign a contract on a home. It was disclosed that an extension did not have a c/o and the sellers have gotten an expeditor to obtain it. Our attorney said this sounds like they are "playing games." I don't know if that is necessarily true but he advised us to ask about a survey. If there is no survey, the extension is not legal, he said. Well, we know there is no permit bc they are trying to get the c/o through the expeditor, however the property taxes include the extension so it is on the town's tax roll. We haven't heard back about the existence of a survey yet.
1. I am trying to understand why the sellers might have sought a survey if they have had the house for several decades. If they don't have one, is this indeed a "red flag?"
2. The extension was done about 30-40 years ago & is not to today's standards but has held up well according to our inspector. We want the c/o bc our own plans for construction will reveal the details of the extension. Given this, it seems we should wait to sign the contract until there is a c/o in place, correct? Also, I'm not sure they would go through the trouble of obtaining the c/o without a contract in place.
3. How long might it take to get a c/o from an expeditor? We wanted to start the closing process asap.
4. The sellers seem to have been forthright & negotiations were smooth with normal give & take. I don't know why the atty thinks they are playing games-any thoughts on this? Our agent is pretty calm and actually did give us a warning about odd behavior from another seller we almost dealt with-so I think her judgement is sound. I just want to know should we be overly concerned? We were initially under the impression that it was no big deal for them to get the c/o once the contract was signed & before closing but the atty has made us start to think otherwise.
I hope this isn't information overload & please let me know if any of this seems like a non-issue. If this is all part of the normal process, I would like to know. Thanks so much.
I'm from LI and I know things are different there so you might want to post on the LI forum also.
That said, I'm not sure how hiring an expeditor is playing games. An expeditor is usually someone who has an "in" with the town, know the people in the building department, maybe even worked there once, and can get the CO pushed thru because they understand how the system works. If your sellers want to go that route, more power to them. To me it says they are serious about legalizing this addition, because they realize it will be an issue no matter who buys the house.
I'm not sure what the survey has to do with this. You can have a survey and still have an illegal, non-CO'ed extension. Just becuase a survey exists doesn't make the structure legal.
The contract probably has verbiage that all permits and COs should be in place for the sale to go forward. It is your attorney's responsibility to make sure that language is in there. We didn't have a CO for something when we sold our house, and it wasn't like we were going to get away with not getting it just because we had a signed contract.
As far as that goes....once the process to legalize the addition is started, you are probably not going to close till the CO is issued because your lender won't allow it.
Having run into survey issues in the past, I put a survey contingency in my last three offers. All three surveys came back bad. 1. .59 acre instead of.73. With easements and zoning not possible to construct a garage. 2. Listed at 2.17... survey came back 1.49 seller would not reduce price 3. 1.17 came back 1.17.. however the property was originally 3 lots, and the seller sold one lot . Not a smart move as it makes the larger lot at .87 with existing house non-conforming to zoning -0- side setback! So instead of gut renovating existing home, would have to tear down and rebuild. However, due to ledge and easements I could only build a very small house with detached garage which is not what I want as my final residence. We worked really hard with this property....the seller and I knew each other, I spent 15 years on the zoning appeals board......everyone involved worked really hard to make the deal....but it was just impossible.
In my state disclosure package for sellers it specifically asks if any work requiring permits had been done and if yes, were permits pulled.
There could be many reasons why they did what they did. Typically, it is to avoid paying for permits.. which is the long run is a wasted effort and to avoid the tax man. Seeing that the tax man already knows.......I'd head to zoning and see if the property conforms to your particular zoning requirements.
Thanks everyone. I didn't consider the contract being a protective factor for the CO. The atty called me today & actually mentioned just that exactly. Still don't understand the issue of the survey as well, esp. if we know there is no CO. Good point about why they never got the CO if they were paying taxes. Probably just hoping to avoid it if they could-which they did for about 30 years
All signs point to a normal transaction-I don't necessarily think there are any games going on as well. Thanks again.
Sometime last year, a Hamptons restauranteur talked in the NY Times about using an expeditor to get needed permits because his town's process was so slow.
I am presently waiting for my seller to get a CO on a finished basement and bath. In my municipality in western Long Island, the folks are so friendly and accommodating at the fairly small building dept. that I have stopped there twice to check on the progress. I've gleaned some helpful information on timing and other aspects that I've been able to pass along to my attorney and I was able to have the real estate agents goose the sellers to make sure that their plumber had delivered his report as part of the approvals. The sellers have been following through on their own and no expeditor has been needed.
I'm not saying your experience would be the same, but it might be worth taking a ride out there and paying a personal visit to the building dept. It could help to put your mind at ease. I've always found it useful to talk to the people who are making the decisions. Ask them about the process in general and they might just drop some valuable hints on how your own permits are going. Good luck.
I'm not saying your experience would be the same, but it might be worth taking a ride out there and paying a personal visit to the building dept. It could help to put your mind at ease. I've always found it useful to talk to the people who are making the decisions. Ask them about the process in general and they might just drop some valuable hints on how your own permits are going. Good luck.
Excellent point. I will put that on my to do list!
Excellent point. I will put that on my to do list!
I'm not saying you'll do otherwise, but I have also found it useful to smile and be pleasant when I go in to see the folks at the building department. I try to be self-effacing, apologize for intruding and show that I respect what town workers do. I doubt they get many compliments and they probably have to deal with plenty of people who are annoyed with permit delays. I always try to let them know that I appreciate how helpful they've been. My building dept. is small enough so they'll remember me when it's time to see which permit gets approved first.
You know the old saying about "catching more flies with honey . . . "
I'm not saying you'll do otherwise, but I have also found it useful to smile and be pleasant when I go in to see the folks at the building department. I try to be self-effacing, apologize for intruding and show that I respect what town workers do. I doubt they get many compliments and they probably have to deal with plenty of people who are annoyed with permit delays. I always try to let them know that I appreciate how helpful they've been. My building dept. is small enough so they'll remember me when it's time to see which permit gets approved first.
You know the old saying about "catching more flies with honey . . . "
Nah, You were right the first time I would probably do otherwise...Just Kidding! I get what you are saying and it's a good point.
I wanted to redo an old street sign in a business I bought. I went to the town and was told the sign no longer met town sign requirements and I could not change it.
I mentioned this to a fellow business owner. He said call So and So Electrical Company and ask for Harry. I did. Harry came to my business. I showed Harry what I wanted to do. He said hire me to do the job at $xxx.xx (a fair price actually). I said the town says no. He said hire me. I did. Harry walked the permit through and I had a new sign.
I wanted to redo an old street sign in a business I bought. I went to the town and was told the sign no longer met town sign requirements and I could not change it.
I mentioned this to a fellow business owner. He said call So and So Electrical Company and ask for Harry. I did. Harry came to my business. I showed Harry what I wanted to do. He said hire me to do the job at $xxx.xx (a fair price actually). I said the town says no. He said hire me. I did. Harry walked the permit through and I had a new sign.
So was Harry my sign expeditor..........LOL
Some towns give you a list of "authorized" contractors and inspectors. (Sometimes, the authorization means that the contractors have sold the most tickets to fundraisers held by the political party in power.) It makes a difference.
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I get what you are saying and it's a good point.
contractors and inspectors. (Sometimes, the authorization means that the contractors have sold the most tickets to fundraisers held by the political party in power.) It makes a difference.
