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Two wrongs don’t make it right. Govt should have kept its greedy paws out of the RE market and allowed others to buy homes at reasonable prices after the crash.
Well we will agree to disagree on that. There was and is plenty of opportunities to buy foreclosed homes. Those people were victimized. It was all a ponzi scheme but with mortgages. I think the Wall Street forms should have paid the bill though. But it was government who allowed them free reign to do it.
Well we will agree to disagree on that. There was and is plenty of opportunities to buy foreclosed homes. Those people were victimized. It was all a ponzi scheme but with mortgages. I think the Wall Street forms should have paid the bill though. But it was government who allowed them free reign to do it.
many could well afford their homes too but just chose to walk away and they were never victims ....personally everyone needs their own financial education and ignorance is no excuse for poor financial behavior so i see few real victims . i think those of us here who take an interest in our financial lives know what we should be spending on a house regardless of what anyone tells us .
many could well afford their homes too but just chose to walk away and they were never victims ....personally everyone needs their own financial education and ignorance is no excuse for poor financial behavior so i see few real victims . i think those of us here who take an interest in our financial lives know what we should be spending on a house regardless of what anyone tells us .
Let’s just agree to disagree. It’s off-topic in any case.
The only thing I would add to the positive side of home ownership that hasn't already been stated is that for some of us, specifically ME, living in an apartment building would be torture. I can't stand other people around me. Making noise. Slamming doors. Walking overhead. Blasting televisions. Blasting 'music'. I need a sense of isolation to feel secure. I do not feel secure in a building with other people. I feel at the mercy of other people's habits. Yuck. And the kind of apartment I could afford would be just as I have described. My house is old and in disrepair, but it is mine (not the bank's). I can do whatever the hell I want and not disturb anyone. I can blast my own music and nobody will be bothered.
(I'm gonna be a real hit in the nursing home.)
However, those who point out that in some markets it is smarter to rent do have a valid point. A house is a pain in the butt and a money pit. But for myself, I'd rather pitch a tent in the woods than live in an apartment building.
ABSOLUTELY.
And, you're stuck living with other folks' cooking odors, arguments, domestic disturbances, cigarette smoke, litter, and worst of all, "bugs". In most cases, you're parking a good walk from the building, have to fight your fellow tenants during snow removal, get more car door dings, and argue over unassigned parking spots. Why anyone would want to rent when they could own their own place, especially if they can have a driveway and/or garage, is beyond me.
But the biggest thing for me has been stated previously: I can't imagine living somewhere without dogs, they give life much more pleasure, providing companionship and security. Try renting property with anything larger then a Pekinese. Two things in life I am absolutely convinced of: That I don't want to be a landlord (for residential property, anyway), and I don't want to live under a landlord's thumb. Having to put up with municipal codes is bad enough (and one reason I want to move to a more rural location), but throwing another layer on top with a landlord and other tenants? You've gotta be kidding, I'd rather work six days a week if I had to. If you can't meet the price of admission to the current housing market, put a mobile home on a small lot somewhere, or even build an earth-bag, dugout, or other type of "earth ship" house - as foglover said, I'd rather own my own tent than rent an apartment. Being a single guy, all I really need is a "barndominium" (Google it), on ten acres and I'd be thrilled.
And, you're stuck living with other folks' cooking odors, arguments, domestic disturbances, cigarette smoke, litter, and worst of all, "bugs". In most cases, you're parking a good walk from the building, have to fight your fellow tenants during snow removal, get more car door dings, and argue over unassigned parking spots. Why anyone would want to rent when they could own their own place, especially if they can have a driveway and/or garage, is beyond me.
But the biggest thing for me has been stated previously: I can't imagine living somewhere without dogs, they give life much more pleasure, providing companionship and security. Try renting property with anything larger then a Pekinese. Two things in life I am absolutely convinced of: That I don't want to be a landlord (for residential property, anyway), and I don't want to live under a landlord's thumb. Having to put up with municipal codes is bad enough (and one reason I want to move to a more rural location), but throwing another layer on top with a landlord and other tenants? You've gotta be kidding, I'd rather work six days a week if I had to. If you can't meet the price of admission to the current housing market, put a mobile home on a small lot somewhere, or even build an earth-bag, dugout, or other type of "earth ship" house - as foglover said, I'd rather own my own tent than rent an apartment. Being a single guy, all I really need is a "barndominium" (Google it), on ten acres and I'd be thrilled.
And, you're stuck living with other folks' cooking odors, arguments, domestic disturbances, cigarette smoke, litter, and worst of all, "bugs". In most cases, you're parking a good walk from the building, have to fight your fellow tenants during snow removal, get more car door dings, and argue over unassigned parking spots. Why anyone would want to rent when they could own their own place, especially if they can have a driveway and/or garage, is beyond me.
But the biggest thing for me has been stated previously: I can't imagine living somewhere without dogs, they give life much more pleasure, providing companionship and security. Try renting property with anything larger then a Pekinese. Two things in life I am absolutely convinced of: That I don't want to be a landlord (for residential property, anyway), and I don't want to live under a landlord's thumb. Having to put up with municipal codes is bad enough (and one reason I want to move to a more rural location), but throwing another layer on top with a landlord and other tenants? You've gotta be kidding, I'd rather work six days a week if I had to. If you can't meet the price of admission to the current housing market, put a mobile home on a small lot somewhere, or even build an earth-bag, dugout, or other type of "earth ship" house - as foglover said, I'd rather own my own tent than rent an apartment. Being a single guy, all I really need is a "barndominium" (Google it), on ten acres and I'd be thrilled.
you can still have a lot of these issues owning ... not everything people buy are unattached homes or don't have hoa or condo rules ....co-op or condo ownership in hi-rises are no different then renting in many respects. millions own apartments in these kinds of buildings.
in fact i prefer hoa life after having a neighbor next door to where my house was repair cars in his driveway every saturday and sunday banging away at 7am .at least the hoa has rules and can enforce bad neighborly actions .
And, you're stuck living with other folks' cooking odors, arguments, domestic disturbances, cigarette smoke, litter, and worst of all, "bugs". In most cases, you're parking a good walk from the building, have to fight your fellow tenants during snow removal, get more car door dings, and argue over unassigned parking spots. Why anyone would want to rent when they could own their own place, especially if they can have a driveway and/or garage, is beyond me.
But the biggest thing for me has been stated previously: I can't imagine living somewhere without dogs, they give life much more pleasure, providing companionship and security. Try renting property with anything larger then a Pekinese. Two things in life I am absolutely convinced of: That I don't want to be a landlord (for residential property, anyway), and I don't want to live under a landlord's thumb. Having to put up with municipal codes is bad enough (and one reason I want to move to a more rural location), but throwing another layer on top with a landlord and other tenants? You've gotta be kidding, I'd rather work six days a week if I had to. If you can't meet the price of admission to the current housing market, put a mobile home on a small lot somewhere, or even build an earth-bag, dugout, or other type of "earth ship" house - as foglover said, I'd rather own my own tent than rent an apartment. Being a single guy, all I really need is a "barndominium" (Google it), on ten acres and I'd be thrilled.
I just want to comment that renting does not necessarily mean having to live in an apartment complex or even an apartment. My apartment was above stores, there were 5 apartments up there, with the exception of one all over 40 singles. My neighbors were awesome. The one across the hall owned a store downstairs and would send his workers to help me with things like carrying an air conditioner upstairs. I never heard them in their apartments. I had no one right next to me on any side. It was an old week built building. I was alone, but at the same time I sometimes feel creeped out alone and I felt safer knowing others were close by.
I love our home, but I loved my years there too, and again I could never have had the experience of living in that location without renting. It was once in a lifetime experience that I got to live for 18 years. Just saying renting is not restricted to people packed together in paper thin buildings.
I just want to comment that renting does not necessarily mean having to live in an apartment complex or even an apartment. My apartment was above stores, there were 5 apartments up there, with the exception of one all over 40 singles. My neighbors were awesome. The one across the hall owned a store downstairs and would send his workers to help me with things like carrying an air conditioner upstairs. I never heard them in their apartments. I had no one right next to me on any side. It was an old week built building. I was alone, but at the same time I sometimes feel creeped out alone and I felt safer knowing others were close by.
I love our home, but I loved my years there too, and again I could never have had the experience of living in that location without renting. It was once in a lifetime experience that I got to live for 18 years. Just saying renting is not restricted to people packed together in paper thin buildings.
But even if one is renting an apartment, it's not a sign of delinquency or deviance. You're not saying that, but there is that stigma from many.
Someone in this thread was saying if you're paying $1,500 you should just have a mortgage. For me one of the frustrating things about this rent vs buy discussion for housing is the comparison is made ONLY on month-to-month payment, but there is a lot more to account for
1. Your housing market (Cleveland or Tampa Bay real estate dynamics != NYC or SF real estate dynamics).
2. Location within city (suburb and city-center have different considerations and price per sq ft) and
3. Startup costs for the purchase--when people give the advise of just converting your rent payment to a mortgage, I never know if they mean to go a zero-down loan (there was a lot of specific advise to go zero-down in the 2000s pre-lehman.
In some markets when you're not ready to settle in a specific house long-term, it can be a lot of money to lock up especially if single (it's easier to have a chunk of money to put down with a two-income professional income, than with 1 professional income).
But look at mathjak107, who rents to invest, and myself, who is renting for convenience. Renters with different profiles, different preferences. Why do renters have to be "wrong"? That's what I don't understand.
But even if one is renting an apartment, it's not a sign of delinquency or deviance. You're not saying that, but there is that stigma from many.
Someone in this thread was saying if you're paying $1,500 you should just have a mortgage. For me one of the frustrating things about this rent vs buy discussion for housing is the comparison is made ONLY on month-to-month payment, but there is a lot more to account for
1. Your housing market (Cleveland or Tampa Bay real estate dynamics != NYC or SF real estate dynamics).
2. Location within city (suburb and city-center have different considerations and price per sq ft) and
3. Startup costs for the purchase--when people give the advise of just converting your rent payment to a mortgage, I never know if they mean to go a zero-down loan (there was a lot of specific advise to go zero-down in the 2000s pre-lehman.
In some markets when you're not ready to settle in a specific house long-term, it can be a lot of money to lock up especially if single (it's easier to have a chunk of money to put down with a two-income professional income, than with 1 professional income).
But look at mathjak107, who rents to invest, and myself, who is renting for convenience. Renters with different profiles, different preferences. Why do renters have to be "wrong"? That's what I don't understand.
I don’t know I don’t see either as wrong, or better or worse. I never saw it as a stigma, most people were in awe that I lived on the beach in such an expensive city, and I bragged about how low my rent was! I know what you mean though. When I read threads on the NJ or another state forum where people who have never been to that state are moving there and planning to buy a house right away or before they move there, I think they’re nuts. What if six months in you have it there? I never understood why they didn’t rent first and make sure they like it rather than buy a home immediately. They might find even another town they like better once they move.
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