Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
The reason I seem ridiculously argumentative (though I disagree with that) is that:
You are incredibly argumentative!
twia, twia, twia...let it go. You are losing everyone in your insistence to make your point about willow's offensive answer to your query (and making yourself look kinda silly).
It's been on all 3 appraisals I've ever received. Granted, that's not a lot of appraisals, but it was on every one in some form. So I can't think it's something unheard of. It was either represented as "condition" on its own line or as "upgrade" next to the kitchen, bath, etc. line items.
How would an appraiser know the inside condition of a comp?
You have the addresses of the comps, yes?
Are they all "for sale"?
No one has ever knocked on my door at my primary residence or contacted me as an owner of multiple investment properties to "take a peek inside" for an appraisal they are working on. I've never heard of anyone who has had an appraiser ask to see the inside of their recently bought home so it can be used as a comp for their appraisal either.
Not really asking you, because you obviously don't know any more than I do.
How would an appraiser know the inside condition of a comp?
You have the addresses of the comps, yes?
Are they all "for sale"?
No one has ever knocked on my door at my primary residence or contacted me as an owner of multiple investment properties to "take a peek inside" for an appraisal they are working on. I've never heard of anyone who has had an appraiser ask to see the inside of their recently bought home so it can be used as a comp for their appraisal either.
Not really asking you, because you obviously don't know any more than I do.
What say the appraisers? I'm curious.
If the Comparable Sales are on MLS there are usually interior photos. The Listing agent can/should be contacted. And the condition can be determined through depreciation.
How would an appraiser know the inside condition of a comp?
I've never heard of anyone who has had an appraiser ask to see the inside of their recently bought home so it can be used as a comp for their appraisal either.
I often get calls from appraisers wanting more info on the condition of sold properties where I represented the buyer. I assume other agents do as well.
I'm an engineer. I see math that don't make sense to me. I want someone to explain the math. There's nothing more to why I want to know than that.
I realize it's not a science and therefore not exact. There are human opinions that play a role in the appraisal. But these numbers suggest to me that 4 of the 6 numbers used didn't play any role in the final value. Why are they included at all? Are there no rules for things like limits to weighting can be given to one comp vs others. I had assumed for appraisals there were basic equations depending on the appraisal method chosen and some type of guidelines dictating acceptable deviation from those equations. But from the perspective of this non-expert on appraisals who is pretty mathematically inclined, it seems like there's not really any math at all.
I checked the pics of comp #1's listing, which is the identical unit that sold for $393k in 11/13. Similar condition. Differences:
- laminate floors downstairs, this one has (new) carpet
- has original (80's style) kitchen cabinets and counters, this one has new cabinets and new kitchen counters
- kitchen has old appliances, this one has new stainless ones
- it has storage cabinets in the garage, this one doesn't
What you see on the market grid is not the whole picture. There are other factors that go into the picture that will not show up on the hard copy and cannot be figured by a math formula. Example: seller motivation. If a really good direct model match seems to be the best indicator, but has unusual seller motivation (divorce, relocation, etc), I might not weight it as heavily as a nominally worse comp. Example: Location in complex. Two units might me a model match, but one is near the garbage sheds. Or the noisy pool. Or near the edge of the complex backing to a busier road. So I might weigh more heavily to an apparently dissimilar unit that shares more locational features. There are many more examples of this. So you aren't going to be able to figure out the whole picture by looking at the report. The report is a summary of the entire analysis, but there are other things going on behind the scenes that you will not be able to figure out using a math based analysis.
Some of it is just plain old subjective judgement based on experience. As a realtor I see how buyers react to things. Some of that makes its way into my appraisals, but sometimes you will not see just how that took place in looking at the report.
So I would stick the thing in the file and forget about it and move on with enjoying your new home.
This thread was interesting when the posts were informative as to how appraisals are done.
But I give up. The "I must prove I'm right" posts are wearying.
No surprise in that answer. If you didn't want me to tell you what I found rude about post #4, then why bring it up again? You and ww are the ones who wouldn't let it drop that I found ww's post rude. In case you didn't notice, I included several smiles, winks, and thumbs up in my recent responses to indicate I wasn't upset. But I guess that whole "not serious" thing only applies to "lol". lol.
Your only contribution to this thread that I recall is "ww isn't rude. I wuuuuv his/her post so much it hurts. ww's post was so much better than everyone else's. you suck for not wuuuuving it as much as me." You've been defending ww like you've got some kind of crush. I guess I should have just ignored you then instead of being polite enough to explain what you kept wanting to talk about.
As for the whole "I must prove I'm right" thing, I'm not the one who literally keeps saying variations of "I'm right", "you know I'm right". I was having a back and forth discussion which was fairly productive with everyone else until you two needed to be the center of attention. There was no need for ww to come in and repeat everything that had already been said by others just to prove that somehow he or she is smarter and a better answerer than everybody else. The other people on this thread had better answers and were more helpful. I'm not going to diminish everyone else's incredibly helpful and courteous contribution by agreeing with you otherwise. And there's no prize to be won by convincing me that ww is the best poster. Get over it!
The reason I seem ridiculously argumentative (though I disagree with that) is that:
You are incredibly argumentative!
Whatevs.
Quote:
twia, twia, twia...let it go. You are losing everyone in your insistence to make your point about willow's offensive answer to your query (and making yourself look kinda silly).
I apologize to everyone else in the thread in getting detoured by ww and kayanne's refusal to just let it go that I was offended by post #4. I should have just ignored them instead of trying to explain it. I ought to know that there's no use trying to explain to rude people how they're being rude. They just feed on it.
I tried to engage a discussion about the misunderstanding involved when an engineering type asks about math and formulas vs what the people in the appraisal field think of as formulas. (But only got back snark.)
I think it could be a valuable thing to discuss with the other people here. I found it interesting to discover that my concept of math/formulas seems to be very different than ww's (and probably others in the appraisal field). And that's possibly why people have said they find that engineers can't accept how appraisals are done. It might not be because of how appraisals work, but quite possibly because of what each type of person is saying to the other isn't what's being heard by the other.
What I took from the conversation is that one person's interpretation of "What's the math involved?" can be "What is the equation you have to use to calculate this final number?" while another person's is "What are the possible ways you can manipulate this group of numbers to get to this final number?"
I found it very eye-opening to realize that not everyone interprets that question as the latter.
From this experience, I think the reason engineers find the explanations maddening is that they hear "there are no formulas" followed immediately by a bunch of things that in their mind are formulas. It's maddening because both parties aren't operating under the same understanding of what a formula is.
How would an appraiser know the inside condition of a comp?
You have the addresses of the comps, yes?
Are they all "for sale"?
No one has ever knocked on my door at my primary residence or contacted me as an owner of multiple investment properties to "take a peek inside" for an appraisal they are working on. I've never heard of anyone who has had an appraiser ask to see the inside of their recently bought home so it can be used as a comp for their appraisal either.
Not really asking you, because you obviously don't know any more than I do.
What say the appraisers? I'm curious.
It explains that on the appraisal. "THE COMPARABLE INTERIOR INFORMATION IS PROVIDED FROM REAL ESTATE AGENTS MLS DESCRIPTION AND EXTERIOR APPRAISER OBSERVATION."
Sorry in all caps. That's how it's written and I copied it directly.
Comps are recently closed, pending or active listings. The recently closed listings will generally still have the photos available. I was able to look up their listings and still see the photos. The appraiser can also talk to the listing agent.
Last edited by twia; 05-31-2014 at 11:00 AM..
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
