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Having been in this type of situation twice...go straight to a lawyer. You have a bad neighbor, who is committing illegal actions harming the value of your property. Property line / fence disputes can turn ugly.
These kind of folks, there is no talking it over with. Time to get legal help, like yesterday.
Yes, the neighbor got the letter, the neighbor moved the stakes. Look up your state law on stakes or call the surveyor who could easily quote it.
(Hope you have a copy of the letter you sent.)
I wouldn't bother with such a passive aggressive person in person. Instead of calling a law officer to escort you as you hand him another letter or something...have an attorney write a letter. Not a big expense and is often all that is needed. Return receipt. Copy to you. You might even include that you are concerned about his beautiful flowers and don't want them damaged as you would have to do when installing your fence. That is pretty cut and dry. Being nice and yet making a clear statement.
Yes, the neighbor got the letter, the neighbor moved the stakes. Look up your state law on stakes or call the surveyor who could easily quote it.
(Hope you have a copy of the letter you sent.)
I wouldn't bother with such a passive aggressive person in person. Instead of calling a law officer to escort you as you hand him another letter or something...have an attorney write a letter. Not a big expense and is often all that is needed. Return receipt. Copy to you. You might even include that you are concerned about his beautiful flowers and don't want them damaged as you would have to do when installing your fence. That is pretty cut and dry. Being nice and yet making a clear statement.
I agree with this.
You know he got your letter.
You know he moved your stakes.
What are you hoping to accomplish with this person?
Send the letter stating the facts of what you are GOING to do, and then do it. Period. No further discussion and NO further warning.
OP, it is illegal in almost all states (maybe ALL) to move surveyor stakes. Since you have already paid for the survey, I would send the neighbor another letter informing him that it is illegal to move the surveyor's stakes and that if he wishes to contest the property line, he is more than able to hire his own surveyor but the fence is going along the property line according to the survey you paid for.
Then do it.
Our story is somewhat different, but our family has just "sort of finished" a seven year battle, complete with thousands of dollars of attorneys fees and hundreds and hundreds of hours of personal research regarding a difficult property line problem. And it may continue for years to come.
Don't be a "nice guy". Make your neighbor follow the law.
Yeah me too. I thought with the letter he would have at least responded but it appears his response was to move the stakes. I will send the husband over to talk to them.
That's what I would do too.
Personally, I would hate to see all of those flowers and bushes destroyed if it could be avoided.
I would even offer to help the neighbor move them, assuming he has someplace to move them to, if it would keep the peace.
If helping him move the plantings would keep him from becoming an enemy, it would be well worth it to me, especially since it would be all too easy to throw a piece of poisoned meat over that fence.
Maybe both of you should go over to talk to him, might seem less confrontational if your husband brings the wife along. More like you, as a couple, are going to meet your new neighbors.
I hope you can win him over, it will make all of your lives so much easier.
Personally, I would hate to see all of those flowers and bushes destroyed if it could be avoided.
I would even offer to help the neighbor move them, assuming he has someplace to move them to, if it would keep the peace.
If helping him move the plantings would keep him from becoming an enemy, it would be well worth it to me, especially since it would be all too easy to throw a piece of poisoned meat over that fence.
Maybe both of you should go over to talk to him, might seem less confrontational if your husband brings the wife along. More like you, as a couple, are going to meet your new neighbors.
I hope you can win him over, it will make all of your lives so much easier.
I agree. It's one of the reasons why we let him know now so as they lay dormant for Fall/Winter, he can move them. I too hope we can resolve this quietly. My husband is much nicer than I am and better at resolving conflicts if any should arise. If it doesn't go well, then I'll contact an attorney.
I do have the copy of my letter I sent. And I didn't know it was illegal to move the stakes. Wow. I just thought he was being petty. If it doesn't work out this weekend, I'll let the attorney know when i consult with one.
I am curious as to what "he lives in another community" means?
Is your property line as surveyed the edge of a municipal line? And the neighbor is in a totally different city / township / municipal entity?
Or is the neighbor simply in a neighboring 'development that backs up to your property?
The reason I ask (and it's a long shot - caveat) is that in some rare cases - not that its likely based on everything you've described; the neighbors moving surveying stakes and not responding to a proactive considerate overture on your part - but municipalities don't always have their boundaries surveyed accurately. If the neighbor is basing his off of another county / city line, or some such municipal entity, there is a minute chance there could be a reasonable misunderstanding due to an error in how a property deed was recorded.
I'm reminded of the funny errors in State line demarcations due to poor surveying errors. I think it is along the Tennessee - Georgia state line where someone's house has since been found to straddle the two states and they can be in one state when in the living room and in the other when they are in the bedroom or bathroom. It was caused by surveyors working from opposite directions and slight variances leading to error of plating.
I agree having your husband talk to the neighbor first is best first approach since the incident, and then if neighbor is going to be belligerent after your considerate move (which you should document well) then it's re-stake take photos of the surveyed site with stakes (tell him if he moves them you will prosecute and have him pay for the re surveying) and put up fence and claim what is rightfully yours. As the old saying goes: good fences make good neighbors. And it seems from your description this one doesn't intend to be one so put up the fence.
I live in a different community than he does. In order to drive to where he lives, I have to drive out of mine and drive into his community then on to his street. I could walk through his backyard but I would never do that without permission. Our communities were built at around the same time and he bought his house last year. (Looked up records so I could get the name and address)
There is an easement but it's closer to his treeline. My neighbors fence lined up with my survey flags so I know it's correct.
I live in a different community than he does. In order to drive to where he lives, I have to drive out of mine and drive into his community then on to his street. I could walk through his backyard but I would never do that without permission. Our communities were built at around the same time and he bought his house last year. (Looked up records so I could get the name and address)
There is an easement but it's closer to his treeline. My neighbors fence lined up with my survey flags so I know it's correct.
Wow, I had an idea of a guy who's lived there forever, planted these plants and watched them grow over many years, which might have explained his anger over losing them. But, the guy just bought the place last year! He should be very aware of where his property line is.
I'm afraid you just have a jerk for a neighbor, and that's not likely to change. So, you'll have to tell him, well, we had hoped to get along and work things out in a friendly way, but we will be fencing our property and standing up for ourselves if you do anything again like illegally pulling up survey stakes.
I think it's good your husband is going to talk to him, and that he's going alone. Guys do better mano a mano at this type of stuff without wives around, in my opinion. If the guy insults you, then your husband has to stand up for you, etc., etc. Plus, the guy may be more of a jerk if he feels humiliated in front of you (a woman). Plus, since your husband is Mr. Diplomacy, he may actually get this guy to come around a bit.
Sorry for the jerk neighbor. Bummer.
I have a quick jerk neighbor story. Short version: my neighbor was a TOTAL jerk to me, even though I tried at first to be neighborly. Won't go into details. But, we were not on friendly terms.
This was in WA state in the mountains, and the neighbor had huge beautiful Douglas Fir old growth trees lining his property on the road.
One day, I was sitting in my home, and heard chain saws. I looked out and saw a crew of loggers cutting down those old trees. I thought, that's weird, but maybe he needs the money, ho hum.
A little while later, I went out to start my truck and let it warm up. The crew was still cutting trees. I came out of my home to get in the truck and the crew was long gone. I thought, wow, that was quick.
Went to town, came back, made dinner and there's a knock on the door and it's the sheriff asking me if I saw any guys cutting down the neighbor's trees. Well, yep I sure did. Sheriff says, didn't you think it was odd? I said, well, yep I sure did, but my neighbor is such a jerk, I didn't want him to be snarky to me if I asked him why he was cutting down his trees.
The tree thieves cut some initials in one of the stumps. I wouldn't be surprised if this was some sort of revenge on the guy, he was that big of a jerk.
Interestingly enough, the neighbors started being nice to me after that.
Moral: Your neighbor may be shooting himself in the foot by making an enemy of someone like you, who would have been a good neighbor. Karma's a b*tch.
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It was caused by surveyors working from opposite directions and slight variances leading to error of plating.
