Post Closing Violations (Number of Bedrooms/Sq. Footage) (agents, legal, brokers)
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Location: Mokelumne Hill, CA & El Pescadero, BCS MX.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jayrandom
I can't find a link that agrees with the idea that the building code says bedrooms require closets. The first two I could find definitely did not have closest as a requirement:
It might be something like fruits, where botanists and grocers have similar but different definitions.
Yep, hence the local modifications. It's been years since I've been in the construction trades and had to parse the UBC. Since my county doesn't have the staff to opt out (or in), I think they go for the easiest path.
Your appraisal didn't mention this, and neither did your inspector?
It's a good reminder though, that the "buyer's agent" isn't really acting for you, they're aiming for the quickest closing with the fewest showings they can get away with, no matter how much you pay or how much you like the house.
where is the OP ? It just seems like an introduction to a topic to generate posts. That can be okay but I like to get feedback and what is happening from the OP.
OP a bit more information I think is needed. Where we have purchased houses, bedrooms in the basement as you have described are not legal.
*How was the house evaluated for comps?
*How are your taxes rated?
*Were there permits for the bedrooms?
*Did you have to get a certificate of occupancy? (in certain states)
*Wasn't this caught on the inspection?
Several red flags that this wasn't caught before you closed!
If we have a listing that has some bedrooms without legal egress, we almost always still list them as a bedroom, but with a note that says that some bedrooms may not/do not have legal egress. I've never heard of those rooms not being counted in the square footage, though. They just may not count as bedrooms. As the buyer may or may not see the listing, it would be on their agent to make sure that information was passed along. There isn't a place on our property disclosure form to put this information.
It sounds like some people here assume that no basement bedrooms are legal bedrooms at all, which isn't true. I lived in a 6 bedroom house, where 2 of the bedrooms were in the basement. Not only were the 2 bedrooms legal, the city actually counted the house as a 9 bedroom because several of the non-bedrooms had closets and egress, so they picked them up as bedrooms even though they weren't. 2 of those extra "bedrooms" were also in the basement.
Although I will say that in some states/regions, basement square footage is not counted at all, so this is very region specific.
^^^ Silverfall has started us down the correct path.
There is a difference between bedroom and a room that "functions" as a bedroom.
We've all seen MLS listings that state X number of baths, X number of bedroom, plus an optional "bedroom/den". How can that be? Well, that room is missing something -- normally a door or closet. But you can put up a privacy curtain and a wardrobe cabinet and, voila, it's a functioning bedroom.
Whether that room would count as a bedroom in the overall room count of the homes depends upon a variety of different factors, all of which are articulated in the various posts above.
In my market areas, only above grade rooms are included in the room count of the homes. Basement spaces, finished or unfinished, do normally add value to the home unless the improvements are way over the top or are in violation of municipal ordinances, e.g., having a kitchen in the basement where it is legally not permitted. But you can have three bedrooms in the basement and two above great and, at the end of the day, you have a two bedroom house and a large basement.
Again, this is my market area but it also reflects Fannie Mae and FHA standards.
OP a bit more information I think is needed. Where we have purchased houses, bedrooms in the basement as you have described are not legal.
*How was the house evaluated for comps?
*How are your taxes rated?
*Were there permits for the bedrooms?
*Did you have to get a certificate of occupancy? (in certain states)
*Wasn't this caught on the inspection?
Several red flags that this wasn't caught before you closed!
How would the buyer have any of this information available? Especially the first three points?
I don't know if this applies to the OP but with all the HGTV types shows, does no one every remember that a bedroom in the basement always must have some opening to the outside in order for it to be counted as a bedroom? Including a closet? Maybe it's just me then.
Counting bedrooms is a very local thing. Some MLS leave it to the discretion of the listing agent and some have very specific rules.
My MLS does not allow bedrooms is basements to be included in the bedroom count, regardless if those below grade rooms have windows or not. Any Finished and heated above grade room with a door, with or without a window or closet may be included in the bedroom count. And lastly, below grade space cannot be included in the square footage.
My MLS covers about 100 different municipalities and no two municipalities have the same zoning laws.
As it relates to the OP of this thread, what matters are the rules of the MLS that was used to advertise the property. Your agent should have made you aware that not all bedrooms are created equal.
Lastly, you have a right to see the appraisal given you paid for it, assuming you financed the purpose.look at the comps used to determine an appraised value. I think it's unlikely the appraiser compared your 2 above grade bedrooms to other properties with 4 above grade rooms.
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