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Old 05-25-2017, 08:44 AM
 
Location: Williamsburg, VA
3,550 posts, read 3,089,038 times
Reputation: 10433

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Quote:
Originally Posted by emm74 View Post
Except that Mueller in Austin and Stapleton in Denver, along with other New Urban communities, have already proven you wrong. Thousands of families with kids choose to live in these New Urban communities because they value the things they offer, including close proximity to the things that a city offers.

Look, I'm not saying that the suburbs are dead. Just that these pronouncements that as soon as people have kids, they will want to leave the city is wrong. There is room for both types of environments, so people can choose what they want. It's GOOD that families can opt for a single family home in the city and not be forced to choose between living where they want or in the type of housing they want, just like people can choose to live in the suburbs, if that's what they want.
Oh, I totally agree with you. I think young people are likely to opt for New Urban communities when they can, because that's the design du jour. I guess what I was trying to say is that when money is an issue and family needs become more important, people make compromises. And often, the compromise is to choose that old outdated burb because it has things you need and fits the budget, even if it doesn't have a favored design. My generation had the same issues. We swore we would always live in the city and never never would we move back to our parent's split level suburbs. But over time lots of us did.
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Old 05-25-2017, 09:30 AM
 
6,321 posts, read 10,267,438 times
Reputation: 3835
Quote:
Originally Posted by emm74 View Post
Except that Mueller in Austin and Stapleton in Denver, along with other New Urban communities, have already proven you wrong. Thousands of families with kids choose to live in these New Urban communities because they value the things they offer, including close proximity to the things that a city offers.

Look, I'm not saying that the suburbs are dead. Just that these pronouncements that as soon as people have kids, they will want to leave the city is wrong. There is room for both types of environments, so people can choose what they want. It's GOOD that families can opt for a single family home in the city and not be forced to choose between living where they want or in the type of housing they want, just like people can choose to live in the suburbs, if that's what they want.
How old are the majority of kids in your neighborhood? If they are school-aged, how are the public schools?

Millennials are definitely waiting longer to have kids than past generations. So of course that is one factor in making it easier to live in the city. And once they do have kids, a lot will still stay there in their kids' early years. Sure, there are some "pioneers" who want to expose their kids to more diversity, etc. by staying in the city public schools which often don't score well, but from what I've seen (and maybe it's anecdotal) once the kids reach school age many are still moving to the suburbs. "Close-in" suburbs or outer city neighborhoods that might still have high scoring schools are definitely hot though.

Funny that Austin was mentioned. Here is a quote from the article:
Quote:
The BuildZoom analysis shows that in metro areas where land is less expensive and there are fewer land-use restrictions, exurban starter homes are making a comeback.

In Austin, Texas, for example, 35.6% of new residential sales in 2015 was located more than 20 miles from the center, up from 12% in 2000. Indeed, exurban areas saw a threefold increase in new home sales between 2000 and 2015 with areas five to 20 miles from the urban core experiencing a drop.

But the thing that stuck out to me the most from the chart was that overall new construction was down across the board compared to 2000, except for that slight increase within 5 miles of the city center, but that was still the smallest percentage of homes (yes I realize it's the smallest radius). Maybe that can be "blamed" on millennials, as due to their cost I'd bet that millenials don't make up a huge percentage of new construction sales in general.
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Old 05-25-2017, 09:52 AM
 
Location: Tampa
1,267 posts, read 1,074,945 times
Reputation: 1267
Quote:
Originally Posted by Serious Conversation View Post
People are always going to have different preferences.

My first office in Indianapolis was mostly guys in their mid 20s - mid 30s. Preferences ran the gamut. One of the H-1Bs from Mumbai thought Indianapolis was a small town, lived downtown, and drove up to Chicago most weekends because Indy didn't offer enough for him.

One guy grew up on a farm in southern Indiana, and lived outside the metro in a rural area on a hobby farm. I think he was just 26 or so when I met him. He had a barn with large scale brewing equipment and needed lots of space.

I lived in the suburbs. I had well over a dozen restaurants, sit down and quicker options, within a mile of me. There was a Walmart, Target, three high end grocers, and a high end Kroger within a mile of my apartment. I could walk to some of those restaurants via the municipal greenway system. I rarely locked my doors - crime was a complete nonissue.

A buddy of mine lives in a hip urban neighborhood in a smaller 50s home on a smallish lot with an excellent walking system.
Let me guess? Carmel, Indiana or Westfield? So nice and neat looking, too neat looking for me. What is the commute to downtown? 45 minutes plus. I have relatives that live there.
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Old 05-25-2017, 10:42 AM
 
Location: USA
18,443 posts, read 9,065,805 times
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Few people with $100k in student loan debt can afford to buy a house...
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Old 05-25-2017, 10:48 AM
 
Location: Connecticut
5,104 posts, read 4,790,218 times
Reputation: 3636
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freak80 View Post
Few people with $100k in student loan debt can afford to buy a house...

Student loan debt is the new mortgage. Don't the same banks that issue mortgages also issue student loans? Why would any banks care, they are still getting paid.
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Old 05-25-2017, 10:48 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles (Native)
25,303 posts, read 21,327,723 times
Reputation: 12313
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freak80 View Post
Few people with $100k in student loan debt can afford to buy a house...
Who needs to own property when you have a degree from a highly rated liberal arts college ?
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Old 05-25-2017, 11:38 AM
 
Location: TN/NC
34,864 posts, read 30,954,560 times
Reputation: 47205
Quote:
Originally Posted by cjairo191 View Post
Let me guess? Carmel, Indiana or Westfield? So nice and neat looking, too neat looking for me. What is the commute to downtown? 45 minutes plus. I have relatives that live there.
Carmel. Depending on where in Carmel, you can be downtown in thirty minutes with little traffic.
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Old 05-25-2017, 11:57 AM
 
Location: Denver CO
24,204 posts, read 19,061,221 times
Reputation: 38266
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoPhils View Post
How old are the majority of kids in your neighborhood? If they are school-aged, how are the public schools?

Millennials are definitely waiting longer to have kids than past generations. So of course that is one factor in making it easier to live in the city. And once they do have kids, a lot will still stay there in their kids' early years. Sure, there are some "pioneers" who want to expose their kids to more diversity, etc. by staying in the city public schools which often don't score well, but from what I've seen (and maybe it's anecdotal) once the kids reach school age many are still moving to the suburbs. "Close-in" suburbs or outer city neighborhoods that might still have high scoring schools are definitely hot though.

Funny that Austin was mentioned. Here is a quote from the article:



But the thing that stuck out to me the most from the chart was that overall new construction was down across the board compared to 2000, except for that slight increase within 5 miles of the city center, but that was still the smallest percentage of homes (yes I realize it's the smallest radius). Maybe that can be "blamed" on millennials, as due to their cost I'd bet that millenials don't make up a huge percentage of new construction sales in general.
Lots of younger kids but plenty of school aged kids as well. They are continually building new schools to keep up with enrollment. Schools for the entire zone are excellent, pretty much across the board, and it's one of the few areas in my city where the schools are all good all the way through - there are plenty of other excellent schools in the district, but not always a match of elementary, middle and high school all being excellent the way they are here.

The HS my current middle schooler will attend is one of the top schools in the entire state and in the top 100 nationally. People move to this neighborhood specifically for the schools, I know because I was one of those people.
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Old 05-25-2017, 01:09 PM
 
6,321 posts, read 10,267,438 times
Reputation: 3835
Quote:
Originally Posted by emm74 View Post
Lots of younger kids but plenty of school aged kids as well. They are continually building new schools to keep up with enrollment. Schools for the entire zone are excellent, pretty much across the board, and it's one of the few areas in my city where the schools are all good all the way through - there are plenty of other excellent schools in the district, but not always a match of elementary, middle and high school all being excellent the way they are here.

The HS my current middle schooler will attend is one of the top schools in the entire state and in the top 100 nationally. People move to this neighborhood specifically for the schools, I know because I was one of those people.
Then your area is an exception (and you even said it was an exception for your city), as from what I've seen many city neighborhoods do not have excellent public schools, and that's likely the biggest reason that people move from the city to the suburbs.
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Old 05-25-2017, 01:58 PM
 
Location: Denver CO
24,204 posts, read 19,061,221 times
Reputation: 38266
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoPhils View Post
Then your area is an exception (and you even said it was an exception for your city), as from what I've seen many city neighborhoods do not have excellent public schools, and that's likely the biggest reason that people move from the city to the suburbs.
Yes, but per the whole thread, I've been discussing specifically planned New Urban communities, where schools are purpose built to attract and keep families. Most city neighborhoods don't have that luxury and are working with schools that have evolved and changed over time, sometimes not always for the better.
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