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Old 01-08-2022, 09:28 PM
 
Location: Silicon Valley
7,651 posts, read 4,608,655 times
Reputation: 12729

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wile E. Coyote View Post
No worries as higher interest rates are going to put a lid on all of this...

Jury is still out, and I don't think this would affect direct flipper interest per se....they after all are only holding onto these for a short period of time. But if higher interest rates cause consumer activity to decline....they may be fearful of getting stuck holding a property.



Interest rates will only rise if there's inflation though. If the Fed jumps out in front of inflation, then I would 100% agree with your comment. However, if the Fed lags too long and the dollar starts to deteriorate, then we could have a massive buy into real estate at any price.



https://www.federalreserve.gov/econr...r-20211006.htm


This of course is unlikely in the near term. The closest competitors have issues all their own. RMB is rigged, Euro showed her frailty in the last crisis, yen is too thinly held. Proponents of cryptocurrencies may have something, but nobody is nearly close enough....and the cryptos lack military means.


But I'd sidetracking. At the dearth of the 09 fallout locally, I can say the only people buying were investors. Everyone else was too scared. There was a lot to be scared of too. I saw homes where the wiring or piping had been removed. One home had kept animals inside and feces was everywhere. One home had a basement....and I was excited as they are rare here, but upon arriving realized there wasn't pictures or information because they had literally filled the entire basement with water before leaving. There were tons of people in various states of eviction, and some were undoubtedly dangerous. Some were just very sad. There was an old German grandmother who kept her home meticulously well. She had nowhere to go for visits. She even made cookies. Extremely embarrassed by whatever had lead her to re-leverage a home she'd obviously lived in for a long time, but still showing that she was a good sport in all ways. I literally couldn't buy it from her. I'm sure I can't convey it accurately, but I must have gone through 100 homes during that time and she sticks out.



Anyway, once finances were settled and things were looking up....then suddenly a bunch of retailers came looking for homes in 2013 and such....as the market was clearly rising. Then the investors went away. The housing stock had been renewed and it was harder finding obvious impact purchases.
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Old 01-10-2022, 02:44 AM
 
51,655 posts, read 25,850,631 times
Reputation: 37895
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Beco View Post
It's probably good and bad....depends. The houses on TV all need repair, sometimes structural issues or mold, the floor plan is not current, or electrical, plumbing and fixing leaks in the basement, etc. So fixing these older homes is a good thing. Especially the 100-year-old homes and saving the architecture...and it helped neighborhoods, encourages development, and less crime down the road. It puts things in motion,

I guess the negative is yes, it knocks people out of the market, buy a home for $300,000, for example, fix it and resell it at $450,000 or $500,000 ....so lower-income purchasers cannot do the down payment or other....so yeah, it might impact.
But how this is any different than it has ever been?

The $500K sale will likely increase the appearance as well as the property values of the entire neighborhood, and the ultimate buyers are likely to have the funds as well as the motivation to keep the place fixed up.

Say the heirs to three homes in our community sell to buyers who can barely scrape up the down payment and the monthly mortgage. What are the chances they are going to have the funds to fix the place up or keep it fixed up either?

What would be better for society?
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Old 01-10-2022, 09:12 AM
 
956 posts, read 511,305 times
Reputation: 1015
Very bad for society since it drives prices through the roof.

If prices where were they were from 2009-2012/2013, then it would not be so bad.

But flipping is one of the reasons why prices have gotten so out of hand, but not the only reason.
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Old 01-10-2022, 10:19 AM
 
Location: Columbia, SC
10,967 posts, read 21,995,719 times
Reputation: 10685
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolverine607 View Post
Very bad for society since it drives prices through the roof.

If prices where were they were from 2009-2012/2013, then it would not be so bad.

But flipping is one of the reasons why prices have gotten so out of hand, but not the only reason.
What about the other owners in that neighborhood, where that neighborhod value increases and the homes look nicer? (Instead of that neighborhood having run down houses and owners that don't keep up with them, now they have nice looking homes and owners that are going maintain them).

Would they complain about their home values increasing and the neighborhood being nicer looking with more responsible owners in it? I know we just finished up with one and I've spoken with many of the neighbors that are glad the eyesore has been cleaned up and the trashy renters are gone. Not many buyers in the price point have the money needed to restore and renovate the house like we just did.

I hear what you're saying Wolverine, but there are 2 sides to the coin here.
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Old 01-10-2022, 10:40 AM
 
Location: North Idaho
32,664 posts, read 48,091,772 times
Reputation: 78504
Quote:
Originally Posted by howard555 View Post
You can say that again and lower the price range to $70K-$115K and it's worse. We have made a few offers over a couple years and the flippers with cash got all of them. And our lending power can't get us into a higher price range where we might have a better chance of being the highest and best offer.

Then you have to do what the successful flippers do and find that house before it is listed on the market. Then you don't have to worry about bidding wars.


Flippers can't pay full market value and you can if you are planning to owner occupy. As an owner occupant, you get much more attractive financing terms.


If you don't have enough money to buy at the bottom the your local market, that is not a flipper problem. That is a personal income problem.
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Old 01-10-2022, 12:51 PM
 
Location: Raleigh
13,715 posts, read 12,449,591 times
Reputation: 20227
Quote:
Originally Posted by oregonwoodsmoke View Post
Then you have to do what the successful flippers do and find that house before it is listed on the market. Then you don't have to worry about bidding wars.


Flippers can't pay full market value and you can if you are planning to owner occupy. As an owner occupant, you get much more attractive financing terms.
They can, and do. The question isn't "Did they get it at a discount?" the question is "Did they leave enough meat on the bone to make money after they fix it up?"
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Old 01-11-2022, 01:48 AM
 
Location: California
37,145 posts, read 42,240,055 times
Reputation: 35024
I don't know about "flipping" but updating and bringing things up to code and modern standards is nothing but positive.
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Old 01-18-2022, 01:34 PM
 
2,605 posts, read 2,714,114 times
Reputation: 3550
As someone who is helping my sister and her husband find their first home, I see the value of flipper. They get turned off by houses that needs updating & majority of the houses in our neighborhood have not been updated since 1970s, wall paper everywhere, green toilet..etc E

Even to me who is more experience in housing, the renovation seems overwhelming. I can still see the potential beyond renovation but first time home buyers are too green to see anything but dated. I just wish flippers didn't go extreme & did enough to bring house upto standard so buyers will be interested in it. Clean, Paint, open things up a little bit & sell at slightly above price.
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Old 01-18-2022, 03:44 PM
 
Location: Youngstown, Oh.
5,510 posts, read 9,498,898 times
Reputation: 5627
Quote:
Originally Posted by keraT View Post
As someone who is helping my sister and her husband find their first home, I see the value of flipper. They get turned off by houses that needs updating & majority of the houses in our neighborhood have not been updated since 1970s, wall paper everywhere, green toilet..etc E

Even to me who is more experience in housing, the renovation seems overwhelming. I can still see the potential beyond renovation but first time home buyers are too green to see anything but dated. I just wish flippers didn't go extreme & did enough to bring house upto standard so buyers will be interested in it. Clean, Paint, open things up a little bit & sell at slightly above price.
Give it another 10 years, and 70s styling will transition from "dated" to "vintage". Look how popular MCM is, now.

My philosophy is: "if it ain't broke, don't fix it." My house was built in 1902, and most of the house has never had any aesthetic updates, other than paint on the walls. They updated the kitchen in the early 40s, and after a thorough cleaning and painting, I'm pretty happy with it. They also converted the back porch into a second bathroom in the early 70s, and I haven't had any problems using it. But, thankfully, they didn't use any of the trendy colors of the time. I will have to renovate that bathroom eventually, though. They did the conversion cheaply, and it's pretty worn out.

I guess the point of the thread is that people like me who can live with--or even want--a house that isn't updated, can't beat the flippers to those houses, and are left with nothing to choose from, but the overpriced updated houses.
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Old 01-18-2022, 03:51 PM
 
14,487 posts, read 20,671,714 times
Reputation: 8002
Quote:
Originally Posted by jr_c View Post
i guess the point of the thread is that people like me who can live with--or even want--a house that isn't updated, can't beat the flippers to those houses, and are left with nothing to choose from, but the overpriced updated houses.

b i n g o
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