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Ours found mold on an exterior door, an issue with the sliding glass door, and a minor problem with the water system. We agreed that the seller would replace the slider and we ate the cost of the other two repairs. It was under $300 for both of them, so we certainly weren't going to not buy the house because of it.
Because of my profession and my hobby I have had a lot of friends, neighbors, and family members show me their inspection reports and ask what I thought. There were some that were remarkable. Very thorough. I could not believe they did all that for only $500 or less. The majority of them however a few things were clear:
1. They use a one size fits all/fill in the blank form. Many things in the report did not apply to that particular house (for example two or three pages of instructions for maintaining a furnace/forced air system when the house had a boiler/radiated heat; or information about a breaker box and breakers for a house that had a fuse box/ fuses). If they do not delete that stuff, it makes you wonder whether they ever looked at the house at all.
2. They were not about to get dirty for that price. They walked through the house and looked around. They did not go into the attic or crawl space, usually just peeked into the garage, did not climb up to the rood, did not bother to scrape dirt or grass away from the foundation to verify conditions, did not open anything up except the breaker/fuse box if that.
3. It is common to find things from prior reports they forgot to delete. One had a detailed analysis of the condition of the swimming pool. It talked about cracking in the gunnite walls, and some rotted boards in the deck. My friend said - "We do not have a swimming pool!" The inspector just forgot to delete something from a prior report he was copying. Usually when that happens it is less obvious, but it happens with some frequency. In our current house, an appraiser had a home inspector look at things because the appraiser was not sure what he was looking at (our house is 182 ears old, but some of the systems and materials are high tech/cutting edge (for 2007)). The inspector's report had an analysis of our air conditioning system and indicated it was likely 40 years old or more. We do not have air-conditioning (we have ducting, but no AC unit - never put it in).
3. A majority of inspectors seem to come from a single specialty trade. So if you get a former plumber, they know little to nothing about electrical work. (It is rare you get a true GC because any decent GC will make a lot more money being a GC than doing inspection reports, sometimes you might get a retired guy making a few bucks part time, that is your best bet I think).
4. Many of them are often afraid to say something is broken and must be replaced even when it is obvious.
5. Many of them appear to walk through the house with their eyes closed. They miss some pretty obvious things.
6. Very few know anything at all about old houses. What was done and why, what is fine or not, or how to read signs of specific problems. It is amusing to see them struggling to say something about framing methods they do not understand or electrical systems they have not seen before. At one house we had a garage with membrane framing (there is another word for it). Inspector said. "The garage has no frame at all. It is impossible for it to even be standing. It must be torn down and replaced." the garage had been there since 1909. It is still there.
7. They are true marvels when it comes to being vague and saying nothing at all while using as many words as possible. Even better than lawyers at this.
I agree, I have a fairly limited sampling. Fewer than 50 reports. But whenever and wherever I post things like this or discuss things like this, I always get people saying, "Yes, I have encountered the same thing"
Absolutely, there are some great and worthwhile inspectors out there who can and do save the day. However finding one seems about as likely as catching a Sturgeon. Plus you never know what you have caught until you pay for and receive the report. Asking them for examples of past reports does not work. They have all kinds of reasons they cannot or will not show you past reports (some valid, some not so valid).
Because of my profession and my hobby I have had a lot of friends, neighbors, and family members show me their inspection reports and ask what I thought. There were some that were remarkable. Very thorough. I could not believe they did all that for only $500 or less. The majority of them however a few things were clear:
My comments on a few of your comments:
Quote:
1. They use a one size fits all/fill in the blank form. Many things in the report did not apply to that particular house (for example two or three pages of instructions for maintaining a furnace/forced air system when the house had a boiler/radiated heat; or information about a breaker box and breakers for a house that had a fuse box/ fuses). If they do not delete that stuff, it makes you wonder whether they ever looked at the house at all.
Yes, they do use one of a few boilerplate report formats that include some generic background info.
Quote:
2. They were not about to get dirty for that price. They walked through the house and looked around. They did not go into the attic or crawl space, usually just peeked into the garage, did not climb up to the rood, did not bother to scrape dirt or grass away from the foundation to verify conditions, did not open anything up except the breaker/fuse box if that.
Our current favorite inspector, and most I've seen certainly DO go into crawlspaces and attics, if accessible, they do go up on the roof, if safely walkable, and they do open every door and cabinet, turn on every appliance and operate every mechanical system in the home.
Quote:
3. It is common to find things from prior reports they forgot to delete. One had a detailed analysis of the condition of the swimming pool. It talked about cracking in the gunnite walls, and some rotted boards in the deck. My friend said - "We do not have a swimming pool!" The inspector just forgot to delete something from a prior report he was copying. Usually when that happens it is less obvious, but it happens with some frequency. In our current house, an appraiser had a home inspector look at things because the appraiser was not sure what he was looking at (our house is 182 ears old, but some of the systems and materials are high tech/cutting edge (for 2007)). The inspector's report had an analysis of our air conditioning system and indicated it was likely 40 years old or more. We do not have air-conditioning (we have ducting, but no AC unit - never put it in).
That sounds just sloppy, and I've never seen it in the inspection reports I've seen.
Quote:
4. Many of them are often afraid to say something is broken and must be replaced even when it is obvious.
I don't think this is a common experience, you're on a thread that talks about inspectors being too picky! Very common to see reports of mechanicals and appliances, roofs, electrical panels, etc that are old, outdated or obsolete.
As for the rest of your comments... I too have seen some inspectors who are better than others, much like the rest of the human race. I think people in the business usually know who the good ones are, and that's who we try to encourage our clients to use.
As for the rest of your comments... I too have seen some inspectors who are better than others, much like the rest of the human race. I think people in the business usually know who the good ones are, and that's who we try to encourage our clients to use.
Having bought and sold many millions of dollars worth of SFHs as a Builder and investor, I can assure that many, if not a majority of, realtors are not hoping that their clients will do their own due diligence while finding and employing the "best and brightest" of independent home inspectors. In fact I worked in a market for decades where a couple of inspectors were absolutely hated by the local agents,and dismissed as "deal killers", since they actually did their job extraordinarily well. They were far more likely to find significant issues that sellers were hoping to conceal, protected buyers from buying troubled properties until expensive defects were mitigated, any occasionally killed deals, while protecting potential buyers from harm. I've read solid advice in the past, and know why some pros make the recommendation that it can be wise to ask an agent what inspector they recommend, then be sure to scratch that name OFF your list.
Realtors who have cozy relationships with inspectors are often acting in their own best interest, NOT the buyers. A prime example of this was when I liquidated two homes to clean up estates. I knew quite clearly that the HVAC ductwork in these pre-war homes was sealed with Asbestos wrap. I asked the Realtor how to handle it. She is a bright, award winning, top producer. She confidently stated that any inspector that knows how to "play the game" will either ignore it, or claim that it is of an unknown material, and typically harmless when left undisturbed. IOW, a "good" inspector never allows the fact that the homes have exposed Asbestos to appear on the report. Two completed sales. Two separate "certified home inspectors" wrote two B.S reports that carefully danced around the obvious, and left two first time buyers feeling warm and fuzzy.
Having bought and sold many millions of dollars worth of SFHs as a Builder and investor, I can assure that many, if not a majority of, realtors are not hoping that their clients will do their own due diligence while finding and employing the "best and brightest" of independent home inspectors. In fact I worked in a market for decades where a couple of inspectors were absolutely hated by the local agents,and dismissed as "deal killers", since they actually did their job extraordinarily well. They were far more likely to find significant issues that sellers were hoping to conceal, protected buyers from buying troubled properties until expensive defects were mitigated, any occasionally killed deals, while protecting potential buyers from harm. I've read solid advice in the past, and know why some pros make the recommendation that it can be wise to ask an agent what inspector they recommend, then be sure to scratch that name OFF your list.
Realtors who have cozy relationships with inspectors are often acting in their own best interest, NOT the buyers. A prime example of this was when I liquidated two homes to clean up estates. I knew quite clearly that the HVAC ductwork in these pre-war homes was sealed with Asbestos wrap. I asked the Realtor how to handle it. She is a bright, award winning, top producer. She confidently stated that any inspector that knows how to "play the game" will either ignore it, or claim that it is of an unknown material, and typically harmless when left undisturbed. IOW, a "good" inspector never allows the fact that the homes have exposed Asbestos to appear on the report. Two completed sales. Two separate "certified home inspectors" wrote two B.S reports that carefully danced around the obvious, and left two first time buyers feeling warm and fuzzy.
as noted, the quality and forthrightness of Realtors pretty much matches the human population. We recommend, and select when given the option by most of our Buyers, a select group of inspectors that are competent for the home at hand. As folks have noted, there aren't a lot of inspectors that are intimately familiar with old houses (60+ years old).
Invariably, when the Buyer/client selects the inspector, they are price or shiny-thing driven. Who's the cheapest, or who says they use something fancy like embedding video in the report.
I can't be 100% sure it's required everywhere, but in NC we require NAHI inspectors. And the NAHI has a specific checklist that inspectors have to make visual observations of. they are not to dismantle, move lots of items around, pass judgement in writing on items which they have not performed additional testing. And their default response is "have a licensed professional repair" or "have a licensed professional investigate further".
You know, and I know, and the inspector knows that it is 99.9% likely asbestos wrap. But unless you test, or unless you expose yourself by disturbing said insulative wrap, you cannot pass judgement. Verbally, the good inspectors will tell you this exact thing - "Hey, that's asbestos but I can't right it up in my report because we're not testing it." Or "I have to write this up in the report, it's nothing to worry about. But this other item, that sounds no worse on this standardized report, THAT you want repaired because it's a real problem."
And the NAHI has a specific checklist that inspectors have to make visual observations of. they are not to dismantle, move lots of items around, pass judgement in writing on items which they have not performed additional testing. And their default response is "have a licensed professional repair" or "have a licensed professional investigate further".
You know, and I know, and the inspector knows that it is 99.9% likely asbestos wrap. But unless you test, or unless you expose yourself by disturbing said insulative wrap, you cannot pass judgement.
I'm not a lawyer, realtor or inspector, but there are ways to word this. "There are possible signs of mold on the floor in the basement and buyers should consider a professional mold inspection", "Asbestos wraps were frequently used in this area around the time when this house was built and buyers should consider a professional inspection for the presence of asbestos"... Those do not require the inspector to have specialized expertise but they still alert the buyer to potential issues.
Our home inspector when we bought our townhome pointed out that the wall plate for an outlet in the kitchen wasn't screwed down tight enough. That's picky.
One important thing he pointed out was a circuit was double tapped. We let it slide, bought the place and promptly forgot about it. The inspector for our buyer didn't catch it. But he did notice some slight cracking in the tile grout on the deck of our soaker tub.
I'm not a lawyer, realtor or inspector, but there are ways to word this. "There are possible signs of mold on the floor in the basement and buyers should consider a professional mold inspection", "Asbestos wraps were frequently used in this area around the time when this house was built and buyers should consider a professional inspection for the presence of asbestos"... Those do not require the inspector to have specialized expertise but they still alert the buyer to potential issues.
"there is a substance on the floor which could be fungal growth and should be further investigated" is quite common.
We just had our house inspection - the inspector couldn't find a whole lot wrong with our home so he included things on the report like: Light fixture outside kitchen door doesn't have a lightbulb in it (on the side of the house that no one ever uses for any reason) and fan in bedroom doesn't have a lightkit - the inspector felt that for safety reasons the fan should have a light in it (we don't care for the look of fans with lights in them nor the way a center ceiling light reflects on the room and we do have multiple lamps throughout the room - one is within inches of the door on a bedside chest.
Soooo, I'd love to read some of your house inspector's odd demerits on your report.
House has extension cord in crawl space that maybe being used for power. It wasn't an extension cord though it was orange. It was low voltage wire for the sprinkler system. Idiot could have known that if he just traced it to where it went and then looked in the garage and saw the same orange wire going to the sprinkler timer. We had to drive back up from Florida to figure out what the hell he was talking about then convince the buyer that it wasn't an extension cord. Most of the other stuff was silly stuff that was easily fixed but he didn't even catch the one thing my husband did for him to find because every inspector has to find something. I don't even remember what it was but it had something to do with the air conditioning system under the house.
Edited to add: I forgot there was an island in my kitchen, it was movable but matched the cabinets. (ironically another story was that this island disappeared between the sale from original owner to second owner who we bought from and was replaced by the agent) The inspector noted that the island didn't have an electrical outlet and was a safety issue (we had plenty of counter space where electrical outlets were) but then he noted that it wasn't screwed down and was movable.
"I can't be 100% sure it's required everywhere, but in NC we require NAHI inspectors. And the NAHI has a specific checklist that inspectors have to make visual observations of. they are not to dismantle, move lots of items around, pass judgement in writing on items which they have not performed additional testing. And their default response is "have a licensed professional repair" or "have a licensed professional investigate further"."
I hope you realize that NAHI ceased to exist in 2016. ASHI took all the NAHI members that wanted to join without requiring additional testing.
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I think people in the business usually know who the good ones are, and that's who we try to encourage our clients to use.
