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There was an old saying that I heard a lot: you can attract more bees with honey than with vinegar.
You immediately put Cindy on the defensive by accusing her of not looking out for your best interests. You do not know what other things were going on at the time - yes, she acted unprofessionally but perhaps for her it was the straw that broke the camel's back. She probably saw the entire discussion going downhill at that point.
Agents tend to get treated like little more than peons who do not have a life by a lot of customers. We are expected to be on call 24 hours a day (I have had people calling me before 8 am and after 10 pm !!!) or they'll go to someone else. We make appointments for people and turn away other customers because of the appointment, and then the appointment is either a no show or tells you to forget it, they found someone else in the meantime, when you call a couple hours ahead of time to confirm the appointment you made. We are expected to be insulted and respond with a smile....
Perhaps if we all treated each other the same way we ourselves would want to be treated - with respect and understanding - we wouldn't have people melting down and losing it over something that seems to trivial to someone else.
Maybe if you would have just said "Cindy, I was wondering why you are suggesting this plan of action...." rather than accusing her of not looking out for your best interests you could have had a better dialogue.
Not making excuses, she should never have reacted the way she did; a professional should always remain cool and collected - but it is what it is. It's easy to say "I would never say this" or "I would do that" unless you are actually in the same place as the other person.
In trying to keep a deal together agents have had sellers accuse them of being on the buyer's side...they've had buyers accuse them of trying to get the highest price for the commission (and really, you know, the difference in commission on a 10,000 price difference is negligible...)
All that to say - perhaps a softer approach would have netted a different response.
Not making excuses for Cindy, she sound fairly unprofessional but sometimes what we do to make the transaction work almost comes off to a buyer as sometimes protecting the seller. (which we're not)
It's hard to explain, but to keep the transaction moving forward we understand the seller needs to feel like they are not getting abused. Nothing like having an upset seller who then makes everything worse and then becomes difficult to negotiate with.
That may not be a good explanation & she may have been way out of line but sometime it may not look like it but we are trying to do best for our buyers. You've got to give a little to get a little.
I know ya'll position must not be an easy one. Being a negotiator, never is... I understand what you are trying to explain , I wish Cindy would have explained her side...That is all that I wanted her to do.
There was an old saying that I heard a lot: you can attract more bees with honey than with vinegar.
You immediately put Cindy on the defensive by accusing her of not looking out for your best interests. You do not know what other things were going on at the time - yes, she acted unprofessionally but perhaps for her it was the straw that broke the camel's back. She probably saw the entire discussion going downhill at that point.
Agents tend to get treated like little more than peons who do not have a life by a lot of customers. We are expected to be on call 24 hours a day (I have had people calling me before 8 am and after 10 pm !!!) or they'll go to someone else. We make appointments for people and turn away other customers because of the appointment, and then the appointment is either a no show or tells you to forget it, they found someone else in the meantime, when you call a couple hours ahead of time to confirm the appointment you made. We are expected to be insulted and respond with a smile....
Perhaps if we all treated each other the same way we ourselves would want to be treated - with respect and understanding - we wouldn't have people melting down and losing it over something that seems to trivial to someone else.
Maybe if you would have just said "Cindy, I was wondering why you are suggesting this plan of action...." rather than accusing her of not looking out for your best interests you could have had a better dialogue.
Not making excuses, she should never have reacted the way she did; a professional should always remain cool and collected - but it is what it is. It's easy to say "I would never say this" or "I would do that" unless you are actually in the same place as the other person.
In trying to keep a deal together agents have had sellers accuse them of being on the buyer's side...they've had buyers accuse them of trying to get the highest price for the commission (and really, you know, the difference in commission on a 10,000 price difference is negligible...)
All that to say - perhaps a softer approach would have netted a different response.
To this day, I would say that Cindy was a good realtor, but perhaps she was not the best realtor for me. Part of that is my fault since I never interviewed her. I am a first time buyer. I just called her up (based on a reccomendation of a friend) and we went out to see houses. She never tried to push me to buy a house, and she was good at explaining what things to look for in a house..which was good. After we went out to see houses 3 times, I kind of felt stuck with her. She definitely wasn't good at doing a CMA, knowing the market trends, or explaining what she thought a house should be listed for. Would I reccommend her to someone else, unfortuantely, no (based on the latter, not on the former).
The main reason when I started to wonder if Cindy was looking out for my best interest is when she told me to just sign a document after the sellers (the REO bank) made changes to the financing conditions. We had submitted our offer, the sellers had accepted and sent us their paperwork to sign which specified the financing that we submitted in our offer. After we signed it, everything should have been good, but then the sellers made changes to the document by increasing the downpayment amount and sent it back to us to sign off on.
As you can imagine, we (hubby and I) were concerned, however when I was talking to Cindy she basically advised me to just sign the document and that I wouldn't have to actually pay the downpayment that the sellers changed the contract to. The listing agent told her that the sellers don't actually need us to pay the increased downpayment, but they need to show it there for their books. I was not willing to just sign off on it, and I don't think Cindy should have advised us to just sign off on it. It wasn't until I kept asking Cindy detailed questions, that she said "if you don't feel comfortable maybe you should talk to your lenders". We have a good financing deal set up with my credit union and Cindy knew that was the only financing I wanted to deal with. Our lender actually told me that it was good that I didn't sign it, because they would have had to process the loan as the contract was written (i.e. with the increased down payment). It took two weeks for us to work that out.
This was the issue that brought forth my concerns with the closing date. Since it took two weeks to work out, I was concerned about meeting the closing date (which was now less than 3 weeks away) and asked Cindy about us getting the closing extended. She kept advising me against that, saying that the sellers are not to want that (which I can understand) and that by doing we would not have an executed contract until they sign the addendum). I mean, it was like pulling teeth for me to get her to even ask the listing agent about the closing date. I was really concerned about paying the fees for missing the closing date since the contract states that. Cindy said it is unlikely for the sellers to enforce that. I wanted to just do it now instead of relying on the good nature of the sellers. Cindy finally asked the listing agent about getting the closing date moved back and he said that making the change to the closing date should not be a problem. We submitted the addendum. I got an email from Cindy (forwarded from the listing agent) saying it was approved. So I asked Cindy to ask the listing agent to send us the signed addendum with the seller's signature. 5 hours later, Cindy calls and said the sellers denied the original closing date request, but that they would extend it to Sep 30 (note: original closing date was sept. 25, and we asked for Oct.5).
So this where the current troubles started. We wanted Cindy to present the case again for the Oct 5 closing date. Hubby asked Cindy to ask the listing agent what happens if we miss the Sept. 30 deadline. We received an email from Cindy in which she tells the listing agent that the buyers foresee a problem with the closing date, what happens if we miss the Sept. 30 deadline, and in the email the listing agent said "it should not be a problem and that we could fill out an addendum if we get close to the closing date asking for another extension". When I called Cindy it was to ask her if she could please try to work on the closing date again and to present our case. Maybe she figured it was a wasted effort since the bank already say no. I can understand that, however I was not sure how she presented the first closing date request to the listing agent. Essentially, I was not sure how hard she was advocating for this closing date extension since from the first time I brought up extending the closing date she had 101 (okay that is an exaggeration) reasons why we shouldn't. Could I have stated it better, sure..Could I have stated it worst, sure.... Whenever I was not comfortable with something, I always asked her to explain her reasons for suggesting XYZ, if her reasons were sufficient by all means I willing to go along with it. But when her reasons could not address my concerns or if it puts me in a position that could later on hurt me...I'm sorry I'm not going along with it. And yes, at that point I do have to ask whether you are looking out for my best interest regarding this issue. When I was talking to Cindy I made sure that I was telling her that I was concerned on how she was handling the closing date issue. I think she was having a bad day...I'm sorry for that if that is the case.
The funny thing is when I spoke to Mary, she told me that now is the best time to negotiate the closing since we are still in the option period (which apparently ends on Monday). Mary also told me that Cindy was right, that in all likelihood that the bank would just do an extension if we don't make the closing date. However, Mary also told me that she had to disclose that if we do not make the closing date that the bank does have the right to terminate the agreement and sell it to someone else. I was so focused on the fees that i didn't even look at that. Mary said that this is highly unlikely to happen, but that she had to disclose that to me. Mary said that it is in our best interest to get the closing date changed now instead of doing the addendum.
Mary presented the case to the listing agent on friday afternoon and she called us that night saying that the listing agent is going to talk to the sellers again. She said that she felt optimistic about getting the closing date to Oct. 5. Hopefully, we will find out tomorrow. Even if we don't get the closing date to Oct 5, I at least now feel as if a strong effort was put forth...Maybe Cindy did put forth a strong effort...I will never know...
Agents tend to get treated like little more than peons who do not have a life by a lot of customers. We are expected to be on call 24 hours a day (I have had people calling me before 8 am and after 10 pm !!!) or they'll go to someone else. We make appointments for people and turn away other customers because of the appointment, and then the appointment is either a no show or tells you to forget it, they found someone else in the meantime, when you call a couple hours ahead of time to confirm the appointment you made. We are expected to be insulted and respond with a smile....
I did not realize how much work agents do until now. And I was appreciative of the hard work that Cindy did for me. In fact, I always apologized when we met on the weekends to see houses (my husband works out of town so Sat was the only day he could see houses) because I felt like I was taking her away from her husband. Cindy always told me to not to apologize because it was her job and she enjoyed doing it. Once again, I would state that I thought Cindy was a good agent because she never tried to push me into buying anything. She was patient with the house search and I do appreciate that.
sweetrai, based on that pretty detailed story.. I say you had an inexperienced agent working for you (or not as you detailed). I hope anyone reading this knows that at anytime they can talk to the broker and discuss issues with him/her. And the others are correct, your agreement is with the brokerage and they will determine how the commission is dispursed.
One other point for anyone reading this, working with REO's and banks is incredibly difficult and banks have several addendums and their own forms that can be in direct conflict with state law!! and yet if you do not execute them, you aren't getting that house. I wish everyone out shopping for a REO would open their eyes and do some real due diligence..... READ every piece of paper. and then have your attorney explain them to you!!!
sweetrai, based on that pretty detailed story.. I say you had an inexperienced agent working for you (or not as you detailed). I hope anyone reading this knows that at anytime they can talk to the broker and discuss issues with him/her. And the others are correct, your agreement is with the brokerage and they will determine how the commission is dispursed.
One other point for anyone reading this, working with REO's and banks is incredibly difficult and banks have several addendums and their own forms that can be in direct conflict with state law!! and yet if you do not execute them, you aren't getting that house. I wish everyone out shopping for a REO would open their eyes and do some real due diligence..... READ every piece of paper. and then have your attorney explain them to you!!!
shelly
"But, Shelly, Just show me foreclosures. I'm looking for a deal..."
AAAAAHHHHGGGGGG!!!!! Mike, I have heard that oh so many times...
Just this week, client decided they HAD to have this REO. I go look at it, it is a nice big house, that you have to drive through cracktown townhouse's to get too, in the worst school district in the area.... no appliances, missing light fixtures, can't see certain rooms due to no light... we are standing in the middle of the room discussing an offer when I look at a window sill and it looks like a gouge. I walk over there to check it out and it looks soft. Push, Push... soft. Look at the HUGE gouge and see ..... TUNNELS!! oh good, let me guess. termites too?
Then I go pull a CMA for them, house sold (Not a REO or Short) a few months ago in same neighborhood, with all the light fixtures intact, and the appliances, oh and the central air (cause it was missing on REO house) and NO termites... for wait for it..... $5k more.
And REO house had multiple offers on it!! What the Heck?????
people, if it looks too good to be true, it probably is.
AAAAAHHHHGGGGGG!!!!! Mike, I have heard that oh so many times...
Just this week, client decided they HAD to have this REO. I go look at it, it is a nice big house, that you have to drive through cracktown townhouse's to get too, in the worst school district in the area.... no appliances, missing light fixtures, can't see certain rooms due to no light... we are standing in the middle of the room discussing an offer when I look at a window sill and it looks like a gouge. I walk over there to check it out and it looks soft. Push, Push... soft. Look at the HUGE gouge and see ..... TUNNELS!! oh good, let me guess. termites too?
Then I go pull a CMA for them, house sold (Not a REO or Short) a few months ago in same neighborhood, with all the light fixtures intact, and the appliances, oh and the central air (cause it was missing on REO house) and NO termites... for wait for it..... $5k more.
And REO house had multiple offers on it!! What the Heck?????
people, if it looks too good to be true, it probably is.
shelly
yep.. Too good to be true, and they should offer 50% off list price.
Even though their lease is up in 40 days, the place won't fund a loan because it is uninhabitable, and they have no cash for repairs.
So... they figure you think you are too good for them when you tell them the truth, and go get a lease/option on something worse from someone who "cares"...
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, I wish Cindy would have explained her side...That is all that I wanted her to do.
I was so focused on the fees that i didn't even look at that. Mary said that this is highly unlikely to happen, but that she had to disclose that to me. Mary said that it is in our best interest to get the closing date changed now instead of doing the addendum. 
