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Speaking in terms of respect, I think a man would have a hard time "respecting" or trusting a woman who had a relationship & baby by a man she knew was married. To me that speaks highly of her character and is not worthy of respect IMO (but I am not a man). But hey, everyone makes mistakes right? She doesn't get kudos for having a job, paying the bills and taking care of her child.....that is her job as a parent. Too bad she couldn't hold such a high regard for herself before becoming impregnated by a married man.
It's a sad scenario for the child who is being punished for his mother's selfishness and his father's infidelity.
Speaking in terms of respect, I think a man would have a hard time "respecting" or trusting a woman who had a relationship & baby by a man she knew was married. To me that speaks highly of her character and is not worthy of respect IMO (but I am not a man). But hey, everyone makes mistakes right? She doesn't get kudos for having a job, paying the bills and taking care of her child.....that is her job as a parent. Too bad she couldn't hold such a high regard for herself before becoming impregnated by a married man.
It's a sad scenario for the child who is being punished for his mother's selfishness and his father's infidelity.
When I said something about her having a job, paying bills, etc -- I'm speaking as a man evaluating A woman, not THIS woman, and basing it on the OP's question of opinions of unwed mothers, not citing the example she gave. I'd call her example eerily close to a worst-case scenario.
As if men will have some kind of respect for her, for being a baby's mother and I use that term purposefully because it applies to unwed mothers IMO. She thinks men will think more of her for raising a child alone.
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She thinks becasue she has a nice job and is doing mostly everything herself she can get back in the dating game carrying on like before, when she was childless.
^^ I was referring to this from the OP.
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Originally Posted by Urban Sasquatch
When I said something about her having a job, paying bills, etc -- I'm speaking as a man evaluating A woman, not THIS woman, and basing it on the OP's question of opinions of unwed mothers, not citing the example she gave. I'd call her example eerily close to a worst-case scenario.
I actually agree with your original post Urban. Sorry, didn't mean to make it sound like I was challenging your comments.
I actually agree with your original post Urban. Sorry, didn't mean to make it sound like I was challenging your comments.
No, no -- I didn't think you were challenging. In fact, I had missed the portion of the OP's comment regarding her friend's job -- despite that I read it twice! Mental block somewhere in there...
The reason I think a woman who has A child but takes excellent care -- despite that it IS just part of parenting, technically -- is because so few people DO take the time to take excellent care of children, especially when single-parenting. I've never met a woman (granted, I've never met a man who claimed so, but since women are the more common single parents...) who didn't ARGUE that she was taking excellent care of her children, even at the slightest provocation -- but I've seen a LOT of snot-nosed, filthy kids rolling around in garbage while wearing clothing which was eight days the other side of the laundry basket.
So a single mom (unwed) with a child, good job, paying bills and taking good care of her kid -- yes, I DO give extra credit for having moved right on past a potentially bad situation and doing her job.
More typically (and sadder still), such isn't the case.
As for the friend thinking men will admire her for taking care of her child, despite that she has a good job men who find out the origins of that child are going to look at her askance and think "Hmm... this is potential trouble with a lot of drama. I'm steering clear."
Do men respect women who wait until marriage to have babies more than the women who don't?
In the situation described in the OP I don't think very many men or women for that matter would have much respect for a woman who had the baby of a man who was already married and I'd have to add that this married man belongs in the same category of not deserving respect. Afterall, it took the decision made by both of them for this to have happened.
However if a couple is not married and has a baby I don't think that's going to raise too many eyebrows, it happens all the time. Also, if I met a woman who had a baby without being married and her boyfriend had dumped her it wouldn't cause me to respect her any less. In fact I would give her credit for taking on the responsibility of raising that child and doing what she felt was right considering the circumstances.
No, no -- I didn't think you were challenging. In fact, I had missed the portion of the OP's comment regarding her friend's job -- despite that I read it twice! Mental block somewhere in there...
The reason I think a woman who has A child but takes excellent care -- despite that it IS just part of parenting, technically -- is because so few people DO take the time to take excellent care of children, especially when single-parenting. I've never met a woman (granted, I've never met a man who claimed so, but since women are the more common single parents...) who didn't ARGUE that she was taking excellent care of her children, even at the slightest provocation -- but I've seen a LOT of snot-nosed, filthy kids rolling around in garbage while wearing clothing which was eight days the other side of the laundry basket.
So a single mom (unwed) with a child, good job, paying bills and taking good care of her kid -- yes, I DO give extra credit for having moved right on past a potentially bad situation and doing her job.
More typically (and sadder still), such isn't the case.
As for the friend thinking men will admire her for taking care of her child, despite that she has a good job men who find out the origins of that child are going to look at her askance and think "Hmm... this is potential trouble with a lot of drama. I'm steering clear."
Then his wife is an immature idiot. Not only is she punishing her husband she is also punishing a poor innocent child from ever knowing his own father. The husband is an idiot as well to let his wife dictate to him that he cannot see his own child.
In their defense, I suppose they're just trying to save their marriage. Remove the baby from the equation and imagine yourself in the wife's shoes. Would you want your husband going over to the house of the woman he had an affair with every week to feed her dogs?
I've been going back and forth with a freind of mine on this subject and we can't seem to come to an agreement. I don't ever plan on having children but I always say I think marriage before children is more ideal than unwed motherhood, which is her situation. Her child's father is a married man. Because he is a married man, his wife does not allow him to have contact with my friend or the baby. She recieves child support though but carries on like superwoman or something. As if men will have some kind of respect for her, for being a baby's mother and I use that term purposefully because it applies to unwed mothers IMO. She thinks men will think more of her for raising a child alone. I say it's the total opposite! Men think of women who have babies all willy nilly as the woman trying to trap them or keep them around for whatever reason (money, security, etc.). They are not going to respect that. Especially in her case, the man was married, she knew and she still had the baby. Men will seek you out for sex but that's it. She thinks becasue she has a nice job and is doing mostly everything herself she can get back in the dating game carrying on like before, when she was childless. LOL, some of the men she's encountered haven't held back on her either. I do recall one of them saying to her regarding her reaction to his attire for the date (because she wouldn't shut up about it): "why are you being so picky & difficult, you're not that much of a catch" and he never called her again. So what do you think?
No often men just don't like to share the space is all. Single mothers tend to put their kids first at every instance and most single guys don't get into that.
No often men just don't like to share the space is all. Single mothers tend to put their kids first at every instance and most single guys don't get into that.
With all due respect, that's a pretty short-sighted stance on the matter with regard to the credit given single guys.
It's another man's child. That's NOT the end of the world -- but it's a huge deal when it comes to beliefs, potential confrontations and one's say-so in an aspect of life which very, very MUCH has an effect on how one not only conducts but is allowed to conduct oneself.
That's no small matter.
I know from experience there is NOTHING like living with someone who has a child which is NOT yours, being held accountable as an adult figure when it comes to that child's welfare and the myriad ways in which daily life affects that child, and yet to be told when disputes or disagreements arise that "she's MY daughter and how I raise her is none of your business!"
People with sense KNOW better than to act that way. Sadly, not all many people have any sense and it ends up being an all-give-and-no-take situation for guys.
No indeed, it's FAR from being as simple as "guys are selfish and don't like it when a woman puts her child first." Ergo, since guys have to consider (despite the typical assertion by women that we're NOT interested in such) whether or not this relationship is worth moving forward, a single mother with child is very much an issue.
Well, a lot of europeans don't view marriage in the same way that we do, as a way of validating your relationship. Lots of them are in long-term relationships and decide to have children - and are still together, without the formality of marriage. Nothing wrong with that.
In your friend's situation though, it is different. Her baby daddy is married to another woman. That is in many ways not so respectable on first impression, but then again I don't know the details of their situation. So in US society, yes she'd be looked down upon.
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She doesn't get kudos for having a job, paying the bills and taking care of her child.....that is her job as a parent. Too bad she couldn't hold such a high regard for herself before becoming impregnated by a married man. 
