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As a person who can be prone to anxiety, I find much truth, here. More structure/less uncertainty one one's personal life front (especially when there is a lot of upheaval in one's professional sphere) can make all the difference in the world for a person who becomes anxious easily.
Same here.
It runs in my mom's side of the family.
As much as I hate disappointment? I hate uncertainty far more.
Many consider it exciting. Not me.
I'd rather know what to expect. I can deal with almost anything as long as I know what I've got to work with, yanno?
Personally, I would say thanks for the good times and be willing to move on.
She is already having problems with her mental stability with just a job and a SO. Having a job, family, and a husband may be beyond her scope. Do you want to find out?
I get the feeling that marriage is more important to her than YOU are. I think she has things backwards and thinks too much about status.
I know someone going thru HELL right now because his wifes anxiety and sleep issues have spiraled out of the control and much like the OP's woman, it's not stuff people should be flaking out about.
To me if a woman can't make up her mind and has anxiety over extra work load at work, one can only imagine if she has kids and other life issues come up. Things come up like this in someone's 20's often are seeds that grow into big nasty plants.
I strongly believe that men should never get married until they have fulfilled their dreams or if they are a simple person and just want the career they want, they need to achieve that first. Because otherwise they will always be on the backfoot, not happy doing what they want to and beholden to all the needs and demands that women have.
To me what she is doing is classic emotional manipulation. It's a traditional female tactic that goes back to tribal times where women feared being left defenseless and open to attack by other tribes. To keep the men around they use emotional manipulation to play the heart strings to get what they want. She's playing it full on and wont be happy until or unless she gets what she wants.
Men need to step back and detach themselves and look at the big picture and also consider what they want. Women do have a limited shelf life and by 35 it's the near the end of the road for reproduction. Men who don't tie themselves down only increase their prosperity and happiness and as long as they stay fit are in high demand until 50. In general women want to pair up with an older more established man.
We also need to accept that there are women on the pathway of life and every relationship ends. They have their natural rise, plateau, climax and decline. It's all part of the life experience and there is no need to hold on to a woman in a place you don't want to be in, a job you don't want and with a woman that is having issues. Plenty of women out there.
I am betting there is another guy and she has been cheating, which perfectly explains her anxiety and stress.
Women very rarely leave a secure relationship out of the blue unless they have a soft landing waiting (another guy).
Start poking around if you are interested in learning the truth.
Also I do not understand when you said you did not propose because you were afriad she would say no because you did not have a ring...??? What is that about. Does not make sense.
One study I saw showed that around 60% of women met and slept with their new boyfriend while still technically involved with another man.
So it's very possible she is playing that card.
I didn't know you absolutely needed a ring to propose. People have been watching too much TV and too many diamond commercials.
And that's another bad sign. She sounds more like a 60 or 70 year old woman trapped in a 27 yr old's body and she's only going to get older yet inside with time. She has no sense of adventure, and even when you called her to talk, she was with her mother and so couldn't be bothered.
It sounds like she's not happy but not going to do anything about it and she's never going to want to leave her family for you but will resent you not finding a good job.
If she thinks like that now, AND believe me I have seen this happen, when she's 60 she'll be pottering around like she's 97 and mewing and moaning all the while.
I strongly believe that men should never get married until they have fulfilled their dreams
Hah, as if this were a simple, finite thing. "Okay, I'm 38, and have NOW FULFILLED MY DREAMS. Let's get hitched, there's nothing else in life that I want, so might as well resign myself to that miserable fate." Pffft.
To be honest it doesn't seem like you have much to offer at this time due to unfortunate circumstances and the fact that you've had less time to make your career path work. Insecurity about her future is probably stressing her out big time. She's just doing what she needs to feel sane.
Hah, as if this were a simple, finite thing. "Okay, I'm 38, and have NOW FULFILLED MY DREAMS. Let's get hitched, there's nothing else in life that I want, so might as well resign myself to that miserable fate." Pffft.
I think there are a lot of people out there that have dreams of everything from being a firefighter to a racing driver to traveling to Europe. Could be a myriad of just about anything and some people are much simpler than others.
I do believe that before taking on the responsibility of someone else, men should set their lives up for success. It's much harder to finish your education, get your career going, travel, sleep with other women, etc. when you've got a wife and 2 kids making demands on your resources of time and money. No question about it.
There is plenty of time for men to find their way, some will be ready sooner than others. I think when the financial and legal burden still comes down on men to support women and children, then before accepting that responsibility they need to have their lives set up.
And yeah it could end up as a miserable fate as some states like Colorado men have to pay lifetime alimony after 10 years of marriage. So men need to choose well and not be pressured or hounded by the constant yammering of these women making demands. Half of marriages end in divorce and second marriages are even worse. That's not a good stat to stand on.
When you are 24 there is absolutely no need to get married. Find yourself, get the job you want, develop your skills and education, travel, experience other women. Some day after you've had some life experience and a backbone and you want a family or a wife, go for it then.
To me if you feel pressured, manipulated, pushed under the guise of "running out of time" or any other drama, it's not the right girl.
I have anxiety and panic attacks, but this does seem a bit extreme. I mean, I understand she's stressed at work (what? Canada has stress leave!? sorry, that post caught my attention, lol) and it's hard to head off panic attacks, but not impossible. Maybe it is the move that's got her all anxious over this? Maybe you have different spirits. If it were me, I'd be all up for moving to a bigger place and getting out of a small town, but some people prefer the small town life and don't like big cities. I guess it really just boils down to what you both really want. I mean, she could have just as easily take another route and said to you, "Hey, this job is too crazy, I hate it, it's stressing me out and we need to move to get you a good job anyway, so let's get the heck outta here!"
Why don't you bring up the ring issue with her? I remember a co-worker I used to have always said that to me~ How he was gonna wait until he got a career going, give her the best, yadda yadda. I always thought and told him, "She's living with you, she's had your kid and you're talking about having others. You're been together for, like four years and are high school sweethearts. Do you really think she doesn't want you to ask her?" He told me I'd understand when I was older (I was 17 and he was 21 at the time. Well, I'm 26 now and I still don't get his thinking). I mean, if you already have the person you love, just ask!
Also, what do you consider a "nice" ring? When she says nice maybe she's not meaning super expensive? Just pretty? You know, I'm sure those shops offer payment plans and whatnot; in a small town, if you have the right connections, you should be able to get a sweet deal if you talk it up right. On Kay's Jewelers Website, there's even a little bar where you can check out the previously owned jewelry and there are some pretty looking engagement rings for around $300 to $500ish. You can always start out with that and promise more later. Also, I'm sure if you walk into a local shop, they work out a payment plan of some sort if you have decent credit. Are you both worried about the cost of the wedding on top of the ring(s?)? Maybe you should check into some local churches; I had a couple friends at a church. The church put on a renewal of vows for older couples and my friends (early 20s) asked if they could get married at the end of it and the pastor happily agreed. It was all decorated and after the renewed vows, my friends were married and it was free. They had a reception afterwards for everyone. My friends just had to get the rings, a tux, and a dress.
What do you really want the most out of this, though? If you truly want to move and she really doesn't, that seems to be the biggest problem and seems like she sees that and the counselor might, too. Also, if you move, have you looked into the houses/apartments, things to do in the area? Built it up for her, maybe? Suggested a visit to see if you both liked it, etc? Anyway, just throwing stuff out there. I hope everything works out for the best for you; you sound like a caring and sincere guy, who would be willing to trudge through tough times with her!
So I had the talk with her... Still nothing solved but I put out how I felt... She didnt cry at all which makes me believe she has lost those feelings that she once had with me... What she said to everything was the following:
1. "When I told you I wanted a break you didnt even fight for me or us... You basically just accepted it, agreed and then left".. I told her "Yea, I should have fought more for us but I knew you were unhappy and if you had already considered a break then it was probably for the best instead of me arguing about it and then us fighting even more about it"... She said I did make the right choice by giving her time and space but she wishes I would have fought more to reject the idea... So whatever that means....
2. She resents me because im unemployed.... Now this is where it got ugly.. It went like this:
"I have not been happy for awhile now, probably a couple months and its mainly because I have resented you for not having a career set up and you not being on the same page as me career wise"... I told her the following: "Its not that I'm not trying, times are tough for the entire country and unfortunately Im one of those statistics that falls under the unemployed category.. I have put more effort into finding work around here but theres only so much I can do to find a job... I have been offered another restaurant position this summer which offers me full time and $15 a hour off the books and I'm working with my mothers boyfriend as a Contractor... I know neither of these things are careers but its definitely something that many people would take with the poor economy."
Her response to that was "I want a boyfriend who has a career established... I dont doubt you will get one but while you work these basic jobs I have a hard time telling my peers that my boyfriend is working with his mothers boyfriend or working a seasonal restaurant job even though he has a college degree"
I responded with "Im doing what I can to get by... I have no doubt in my mind that I will get a career in my field and if you are willing to believe that too I see no reason why this wont work"
She said "I know you will find a career but I really need someone who has a career right now... I cant continue to wait..."
I replied with "You fell in love with me and started dating me while I was unemployed a year ago... In that time I have worked jobs I hate just so I can pay my bills but also I have put effort into finding a better career that can support both me and her.. I really think you care about status more than you actually love me"
Blah blah blah... She didnt understand what I meant about status so when I told her shes not going to be happy until she finds someone who has a career already. She didnt really have much to say to that...
We talked about proposing and stuff like that and she still has in her mind that I dont love her and she said if Im working that restaurant job in the summer I shouldnt blow my money im making there on a ring for her cause she says I dont want to get married... I wish she could believe me when I tell her I really want to do that.
We talked of her anxiety, her issues at work, how I wanted her to spend more time with me on her long weekends instead of going home to help on the farm and a few other things.. I told her I need to hear from her mouth whether or not she sees any future for us.. She just said that the talk really helped and she would need to think about this a little bit more (another day or 2)...
I dont have high hopes.. Like I said, she didnt shed a tear.. She was constantly hugging me because I was emotional for some of the issues.. I constantly reminded her that I loved her and she just said "I know you do".. She never said "I love you" back.
So yea, it looks like its over... We are going to speak one more time in person with what she decides is best for us...
So whoever picked that she cares more about status and needs a man with a career just so she can feel comfortable talking to her peers about him then congratulations, you picked the right answer.
So I had the talk with her... Still nothing solved but I put out how I felt... She didnt cry at all which makes me believe she has lost those feelings that she once had with me... What she said to everything was the following:
1. "When I told you I wanted a break you didnt even fight for me or us... You basically just accepted it, agreed and then left".. I told her "Yea, I should have fought more for us but I knew you were unhappy and if you had already considered a break then it was probably for the best instead of me arguing about it and then us fighting even more about it"... She said I did make the right choice by giving her time and space but she wishes I would have fought more to reject the idea... So whatever that means....
2. She resents me because im unemployed.... Now this is where it got ugly.. It went like this:
"I have not been happy for awhile now, probably a couple months and its mainly because I have resented you for not having a career set up and you not being on the same page as me career wise"... I told her the following: "Its not that I'm not trying, times are tough for the entire country and unfortunately Im one of those statistics that falls under the unemployed category.. I have put more effort into finding work around here but theres only so much I can do to find a job... I have been offered another restaurant position this summer which offers me full time and $15 a hour off the books and I'm working with my mothers boyfriend as a Contractor... I know neither of these things are careers but its definitely something that many people would take with the poor economy."
Her response to that was "I want a boyfriend who has a career established... I dont doubt you will get one but while you work these basic jobs I have a hard time telling my peers that my boyfriend is working with his mothers boyfriend or working a seasonal restaurant job even though he has a college degree"
I responded with "Im doing what I can to get by... I have no doubt in my mind that I will get a career in my field and if you are willing to believe that too I see no reason why this wont work"
She said "I know you will find a career but I really need someone who has a career right now... I cant continue to wait..."
I replied with "You fell in love with me and started dating me while I was unemployed a year ago... In that time I have worked jobs I hate just so I can pay my bills but also I have put effort into finding a better career that can support both me and her.. I really think you care about status more than you actually love me"
Blah blah blah... She didnt understand what I meant about status so when I told her shes not going to be happy until she finds someone who has a career already. She didnt really have much to say to that...
We talked about proposing and stuff like that and she still has in her mind that I dont love her and she said if Im working that restaurant job in the summer I shouldnt blow my money im making there on a ring for her cause she says I dont want to get married... I wish she could believe me when I tell her I really want to do that.
We talked of her anxiety, her issues at work, how I wanted her to spend more time with me on her long weekends instead of going home to help on the farm and a few other things.. I told her I need to hear from her mouth whether or not she sees any future for us.. She just said that the talk really helped and she would need to think about this a little bit more (another day or 2)...
I dont have high hopes.. Like I said, she didnt shed a tear.. She was constantly hugging me because I was emotional for some of the issues.. I constantly reminded her that I loved her and she just said "I know you do".. She never said "I love you" back.
So yea, it looks like its over... We are going to speak one more time in person with what she decides is best for us...
So whoever picked that she cares more about status and needs a man with a career just so she can feel comfortable talking to her peers about him then congratulations, you picked the right answer.
WHAT???
We are going to speak one more time in person with what she decides is best for us
WHAT???
Dude, there's part of your problem right there - you've given her all controll!
This is no time to turn into a wimpy mess - take back your power and stand up straight and tall.
A women wants a man who knows how to take charge and be assertive. Your attitude right now is reinforcing the notion to her that you are weak.
Waiting around to let her tell you "what she decides is best" for you is bull*****.
How about pointing out to her all the things about her that aren't working for you for starters?
This breakup may indeed be for the best, but you don't have to let her treat you like a doormat on her way out the door.
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