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I save emails from my online dating experiences that think are "teachable moments". I actually used one in a discussion in one of my college classes. It was a great exercise. And I'd love to get your views. I ask a few questions here so it could be a little time consuming. This is about a conversation I had with an Hispanic man who was not happy with my preference for Caucasian men. I am Hispanic (for those who didn't know).
He wrote to me to shame me for having this preference. Said he thought it was a wonderful ad until he saw that. He didn't know how I could claim to be x, y, z qualities and in the same breath say I have a preference for white men. It was "very ironic" and he was very condescending. He listed all the other things I wanted that he was or was close to being, but he's "NOT WHITE!!!!" so he doesn't qualify.
I responded and said that it was hypocritical for him to do what he just did and look down his nose at me. A preference, defined, means to favor one over the other. I did not exclude others nor was it derogatory to anyone. I have dated men of many cultures and I simply prefer Caucasian men. I like what I like. But I was also to meet with an Indian man the following week when he got back from a business trip. I wouldn't meet with him if he didn't "qualify". Of course, none of this meant anything. In one eye and out the other.
He said he wasn't implying that I was a racist, but he doesn't see the logic in basing one of my "criteria for a partner on the color of his skin". I ax ya, fellow CDers, when someone uses the terminology I quoted, what message does it send you?
He also asked me what it was that made these men more attractive to me, so he could "debunk" my "whack *ss preference". Tell me.....was he asking so he could gain some understanding? Or is he inviting me to share my reasoning so he can further ridicule and dismiss what I like? I pointed this out to him and he said he doesn't get how I would even draw such a conclusion.....of course.
He also said, in a subsequent email, that he wonders if he should say that Hispanic men are better lovers than white men. Well, duh, he said it. What would be behind such a statement? Unless he has dated ALL white men, how would he back such a statement?
There is a stereotype about Hispanics that dictates we are ignorant and uneducated. It's a fact. It's not pretty and I'm not making it up - I've lived with it. I mentioned this to him and said his behavior wasn't helping the cause. Two things happened:
1) He said he didn't know what kind of people I hang out with but his friends do not look down upon Hispanics or any others for that matter. It has nothing to do with who either one of us hangs out with but the best defense is a good offense. It is his inclination to suggest such a thing that stands out. So, now he is suggesting that my friends are racists. Is this the message you get as well?
Also, his friends don't look down upon Hispanics or "any others", but my preference for white men is "whack", so HE does. Do you find that statement to be derogatory toward Caucasian men?
2) He asked, again, why I had the preference, then said it didn't matter why, it fed into the stereotype. Again, he's not interested in my position because "it doesn't matter" why. So, preferring a white partner makes me ignorant and uneducated. Is that not also derogatory to Caucasian men?
He kept asking why, why, why. I told him I already answered that question, but it doesn't back his argument so he is reaching for something that will.
He said he doesn't base his attraction on skin color, "I base it on looks, DUH!". It's his right, but if I were ugly, should I slam him for not wanting to date ugly women?
He then said we should meet, that "we all need a good argument every now and then, it leads to good sex.". I don't thrive on this kind of thing. And it certainly wouldn't turn me on.
Finally, how do you defend a preference for a particular race/culture? It really made me think. Is it the color of their skin? I haven't thought of it that way because there is racist overtone to that statement and I am not a racist. It wasn't the color of Hispanic or Black skin that drew me to them. To me, it is the whole package of Caucasian men that I like. I do love the way they tan in the summer, so maybe that's part of it....lol. I really can't say that it is just one thing. But I can't for other races either. I just prefer Caucasians. It just is.
IMO he is a bigot. And he is projecting because, to him, to prefer one means to see the other as inferior. He clearly sees white men as inferior, at the very least, in the dating department. It explains why my preference offended him.
Your thoughts?
There must be a reason. You said you said what it is, but I did not see that. The reason is probably subconscious - probably tied into your perceptions about survival and who can be better providers - otherwise, why would anyone choose "white men," per se? There are some very unattractive white men. Is it any white man or just certain ones? What is it about the certain ones, if that's the case?
What do you think of Hispanic men and why do you rule them out of your dating preference? If you don't know, guess. What was your father like? Your brothers, grandfather, boys in school? Were you traumatized by a Hispanic man?
It doesn't seem like you have really given it much thought. You think you "just happen to have" a preference, but there is always a reason and maybe it's buried, but it's "in there."
Just curious, what would you do if you observed white men that you found attractive specifically put in in their dating profles that they didn't date latin women? Would you feel insulted?
I have met met who have said to me directly that they don't date Latin women. It doesn't offend me in the least. If they said they hated Latinas, it would an ignorance that I would be happy to not have to deal with. I would be offensive, sure.
Quote:
Originally Posted by OregonYeti
Race preference=stupid
Cultural preference, I can understand.
Equating a certain race with a certain kind of personality=blind. In other words, as long as you aren't prejudiced based on race, I think it's valid. But then, why even mention race, since there are so many exceptions to whatever rule you might believe in? My 2 cents.
Race, culture....what is the PC term, really? The culture of white men can be anything from anywhere. He could be of German descent, Irish, Italian, Scandinavian, you name it. I couldn't possibly say I have a preference for their culture when I have no clue what that means for them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sierraAZ
I don't feel the need to "defend" any of my preferences. Why do you...? Why did you engage in this argument at all?
You're right. He should have gone where emails went to die. And I explained once why I had my preference, no more. I sometimes give people credit for being more open and intelligent than they are.
I do know lots of nonwhite Cubans who can't stand whites though.
I've never known any, though I know they exist. I've only known ones who were one step away from Spain, in their heads, and for whom nothing less than a fair maiden or a lanky white guy, depending on their gender, would do.
Somewhere the guy has some insecurity issues. I really don't give a rip who is dating who, some black chick only digs on the black guys, fine.
I'm sure as heck not gonna call her a racist because I'm a white guy and she prefers black guys. That other thread is completely and utterly ridiculous to make an assumption about whether or not some woman will only date x and she happens to be y.
The leaps in logic some people make completely astound me at times. I realize I'm not the smartest man in the room, but damn, some people......
There must be a reason. You said you said what it is, but I did not see that. The reason is probably subconscious - probably tied into your perceptions about survival and who can be better providers - otherwise, why would anyone choose "white men," per se? There are some very unattractive white men. Is it any white man or just certain ones? What is it about the certain ones, if that's the case?
Certainly it isn't any white man. It is just a general draw. I have other preferences, like not being overweight, not having a record of violence, having a good job, respect for others, sharing the same values, etc.
Quote:
What do you think of Hispanic men and why do you rule them out of your dating preference? If you don't know, guess. What was your father like? Your brothers, grandfather, boys in school? Were you traumatized by a Hispanic man?
I have no problem with Hispanic men. My father was and brothers are honorable family men. I have been betrayed by both white and Hispanic men and a coupla others. As far as trauma, they were perpetrated by white men.
Sure, I can tell you what I don't like about some men of any race. It is the behaviors that lend to stereotypes. Still, these behaviors don't always apply to any one culture either. I won't date anyone who lives/represents the negative of any culture.
Quote:
It doesn't seem like you have really given it much thought. You think you "just happen to have" a preference, but there is always a reason and maybe it's buried, but it's "in there."
The reason I stated was that I like what I like. That's it. It's all I've got. I've given it lots of thought because I've been confronted with this many times. I seriously do not want to offend, so I examine my motives. I can't find any that are any where near diminishing to non-whites. I can't please everyone and I can't control how they view my preferences.
The theme seems to be that if I prefer one over the other, I must not like the other. And that simply isn't true.
Somewhere the guy has some insecurity issues. I really don't give a rip who is dating who, some black chick only digs on the black guys, fine.
I'm sure as heck not gonna call her a racist because I'm a white guy and she prefers black guys. That other thread is completely and utterly ridiculous to make an assumption about whether or not some woman will only date x and she happens to be y.
The leaps in logic some people make completely astound me at times. I realize I'm not the smartest man in the room, but damn, some people......
I agree. But the questions that I posed in class that got lost in my long winded post are:
Race, culture....what is the PC term, really? The culture of white men can be anything from anywhere..
It's not about PC. Yep, the culture from one person to another, of the same race, can be very different. So why are you pulling the PC thing on me, if you mean what you say?
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