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Old 05-05-2013, 09:00 PM
 
Location: USA
31,006 posts, read 22,045,160 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pi64 View Post
One of the main reasons I reject the whole concept of relationship rules (including the whole idea of "open relationships") is that people are going to do what they want anyway. Insisting people tell you things they don't want to tell you, making people agree to things under duress (and if it's clear they'll lose you if they don't agree to it, that's duress in my book), etc. won't get someone to behave the way you want. As I've said before, it's main use appears to be to make oneself feel better and give a sense of having the moral high ground if there's heartbreak later. That doesn't seem like sufficient justification to me.
"Rules" right! I rarely see anyone here be in agreement on more than 1 or 2 topics at a time
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Old 05-05-2013, 09:30 PM
 
Location: Newport Beach, California
39,209 posts, read 27,575,665 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by somebodynew View Post
I disagree with this with enthusiasm. Both that emotions cannot be unlearned and that jealousy has nothing to do with insecurity and self esteem. That these are things with which you have no experience is clear. But there are so many people for whom this is exactly the case, it seems funny for people to continue to assert the impossibility.


I would say MOST people prefer to have sex with people with whom they are connected. Among those of us who can be attracted to or even love more than one person, that connection is not threatening to the OTHER person or our connection with them.



I think you are making a mistake that it NEEDS be "just sex" to work. Quite the opposite is true for every single person I know who participates in these lifestyles.


In my experience, it is the men who develop the strongest emotional attachment THROUGH sex.
well, we just have to agree to disagree then. However, I do agree with the bold.

Thank you for sharing with me. I appreciate it.
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Old 05-05-2013, 10:37 PM
 
Location: Chicago
3,391 posts, read 4,480,210 times
Reputation: 7857
Quote:
Originally Posted by OngletNYC View Post
The other night, a friend and I were having a conversation about relationships and fidelity. He is all for open relationships and has one with his wife. As I have always said, I would never be in an open relationship despite the fact that monogamy is not my strong suit. As we talked about it, I finally figured out why I don't like open relationships: it's the talking about it.

It seems that people in open relationships are very open about discussing their side sexual escapades. This includes the guys on OK Cupid etc who tell me I am welcome to call or email his wife to confirm things are open. Or for instance my boss, she and her husband have an open relationship (why do I know this? Too much talk...) and when they went to a trade show in Las Vegas he brought a woman back to their hotel room and asked my boss to take a walk. Online I see people talk about how their lover and spouse are all friends, or about how they are actively dating.

I have said before that the perfect relationship is open for me and closed for you, but that's not accurate. I don't care if you sleep with someone else. I just don't want to hear about it. What works for me: Don't ask don't tell. If my partner is out somewhere and a desirable one night stand were to present itself, I don't have a problem with it. But I don't want to hear about it either. Bored on a business trip and met someone at the hotel bar? Go for it. But I don't want to hear about it. Take care of yourself, use a condom, and keep up your personal obligations. And of course I will do the same. A dating profile that lists you as "available" is a no. Randomly meeting someone and going for it is a yes. But I don't want to hear about, nor will I ask you.

I would like to hear from you open relationship proponents, do any of you structure your relationships in this way? Or do you always talk about it?
If you need a don't-ask-don't-tell policy to be at peace with an "open" relationship, then open relationships are not for you.

I can tell you, from experience, that one of the joys of being in an open relationship is that you and your primary partner can openly talk about what you do sexually and not feel threatened or jealous. It is hard to describe just how liberating that is. The whole point of being in an open relationship with someone is that you are so close, so solid with each other, that you don't need to appease each other's insecurities by being sexually exclusive. If you need a don't-ask-don't-tell policy, then you and your partner have not reached the point yet where you're secure enough in your devotion to each other to have an open relationship.
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Old 05-05-2013, 10:39 PM
 
15,013 posts, read 21,642,088 times
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Meh. I wouldn't like either of these relationships.
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Old 05-05-2013, 10:49 PM
 
6,732 posts, read 9,991,054 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pi64 View Post
One of the main reasons I reject the whole concept of relationship rules (including the whole idea of "open relationships") is that people are going to do what they want anyway. Insisting people tell you things they don't want to tell you, making people agree to things under duress (and if it's clear they'll lose you if they don't agree to it, that's duress in my book), etc. won't get someone to behave the way you want. As I've said before, it's main use appears to be to make oneself feel better and give a sense of having the moral high ground if there's heartbreak later. That doesn't seem like sufficient justification to me.
This is the little kid/ teenager view of 'rules' -- they are imposed on one person by another.

There is an adult version. In it, you take responsibility for never agreeing to anything you don't wholeheartedly want. You speak up, and say, 'No, that won't work for me,' when it won't. You don't say, 'Ok,' and then resent the person you made the promise to.

'Rules' become something you impose on yourself, because you strongly want to -- you might make a rule for yourself that if you go above a certain weight, you go on a diet, or that you won't stay late at work more than 3 days a week, or that you won't date people who are hostile to your existing relationships. You do these things because you have thought them through and decide you don't like the results of doing otherwise. You don't like to be too fat, or too tired out, or have to much drama in your life.

It's pretty awesomely empowering, when you get the hang of it. Many people find it threatening at first, though. How will you cope, with no-one to blame?!
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Old 05-06-2013, 05:32 AM
 
Location: NYC
7,364 posts, read 14,670,185 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RogersParkGuy View Post
If you need a don't-ask-don't-tell policy to be at peace with an "open" relationship, then open relationships are not for you.

I can tell you, from experience, that one of the joys of being in an open relationship is that you and your primary partner can openly talk about what you do sexually and not feel threatened or jealous. It is hard to describe just how liberating that is. The whole point of being in an open relationship with someone is that you are so close, so solid with each other, that you don't need to appease each other's insecurities by being sexually exclusive. If you need a don't-ask-don't-tell policy, then you and your partner have not reached the point yet where you're secure enough in your devotion to each other to have an open relationship.
I notice that anytime someone expresses a distaste for open relationships, someone who is in one claims said person is either threatened or jealous, as though these are the only two possible reasons one might disagree with your lifestyle. Why is that? I suspect it makes you feel superior. Look at what I have bolded, your belief that anyone whose relationship isn't like yours simply isn't as secure as yours. .

PS I am not in a relationship at all.
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Old 05-06-2013, 07:05 AM
 
Location: Newport Beach, California
39,209 posts, read 27,575,665 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by somebodynew View Post
Thankfully there are those who do not let society dictate to them how they should act. If so, interracial marriage would still not be done! Openly gay people would not exist! Thank goodness for these people. Open and poly people's romantic life is hardly ruined! Quite the opposite.
It is funny that you have to draw a parallel between open relationship and interracial marriage. It is like comparing apples to oranges.

Let me start off by saying that I have absolutely nothing against the idea of open relationship. It is really none of my business. If you're someone who thinks you can make it work, and you're dating a like-minded individual, it just might be successful. People are willing to be in a lot more different models of relationships than they used to be. The one-size-fits-all, let's-get-married-and- never-bang-anyone-else-ever-again thing doesn't fit everyone anymore. I get it.

My parents have been happily married for over 30 years. I am in my 20s still and I will NEVER be in an open relationship (again, I am not bashing the idea or people who are in open relationship, it is really none of my business) My parents have a very successful interracial marriage (Japanese/Hawaiian/White) and one of the key things of their success is staying loyal to each other sexually.

Correct me if I am wrong. To me, it seems like you are viewing interracial marriage as an alternative life style just like open relationship.

edit: Open relationship may sound exhilarating and exciting. My personal experience with friends who have tried this style of living is that it ends generally in separation and further therapy. The women and the men wind up jealous and wondering whats going on with the other partner. After they get past this point my several pairs of friends actually just switched partners. However, I can understand this kind of relationship works wonder for some couples, but exception is not the norm.

Last edited by lilyflower3191981; 05-06-2013 at 07:34 AM..
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Old 05-06-2013, 08:00 AM
 
14,294 posts, read 13,181,676 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pi64 View Post
If you mean "committed" in the sense of never seeing anyone else again, no.

In a large sense, how "committed" are relationships anyway when either person can end them whenever they want to?
It seems to me that this thread woudl be largely moot to you. There is no expectation of exclusivity in non-committed relationships. So your chosen lifestyle is golden for you.
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Old 05-06-2013, 09:10 AM
 
14,294 posts, read 13,181,676 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lilyflower3191981 View Post
It is funny that you have to draw a parallel between open relationship and interracial marriage. It is like comparing apples to oranges.
Not really in the context of "society's" view of relationships which is precisely the context to which I was referring in response to a poster's comments about living WITHIN society's vision of what is appropriate, ok, whatever. Every single thing that is commonplace now was once considered "bad" until some courageous people bucked the system, from interracial relationships to gay relationships to relations based on love rather than property for that matter.

Quote:
Correct me if I am wrong. To me, it seems like you are viewing interracial marriage as an alternative life style just like open relationship.
Only insofar as it relates to what we might learn historically about society and relationships.
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Old 05-06-2013, 09:30 AM
 
14,294 posts, read 13,181,676 times
Reputation: 17797
Quote:
Originally Posted by OngletNYC View Post
Huh? I am looking for a variety of opinions, rather than simply believing everything I have heard from the two people I know who are in an open relationship. No need to flip out on me here...jeez... must be a poly person, standard freak out response when you think your lifestyle is being threatened.

I am not sure why you think I am flipping out. I have no need to defend anything or anyone. Certainly no one is threatening me! I am as happy as can be.

I do have some thoughts on this thread. You mention discussing sexual matters as boring. I can appreciate that. There are things that I find boring that become, if not interesting, at least worth my time when it becomes important to one of my partners. Not that I care about the topic that s/he is discussing so much as its impact on THEM or to the degree it impacts US. That is what I mean by discussion, not the mechanics. Not a voyeuristic titillation as if by reliving someone else' porn scene. That is certainly not what I mean by the goal of discussion.

There are a lot of folks on the board who miss the point by a mile. I think you are one of them. Since you are the OP, you are the most interesting to reply to. Basically it seems that people assume you have to ONE person with whom you have a MEANINGFUL relationship and everyone else is just a glory hole or whatever people mean by "just sex". While many of us have known people who have claimed "open relationship" status as a slightly less sleazy way of getting some on the side, that is not what the proponents of real RESPONSIBLE monogamy mean.

When you talk about your experience with your ex husband, it does not look so much to me like a failure to communicate. That kind of issue is not usually communicated in a single line of a legal conversation of expectations at the beginning of the relationship. The point is to genuinely care about your partner(s) FEELINGS on the topic and treat that as paramount. Oops you misunderstood me when I said I was going to schtick other people is NOT really an open relationship. It is not responsible monogamy.

I would venture that as much as there are people who are suited for poly, for mono and for no commitment at all, it is wise that you recognize yourself as the latter, if I recall your past posts which indicate your intentions.
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