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People who believe in strict monogamy will not be moved, no matter how hard you push. It doesn't matter how good your arguments are. It doesn't matter how many times they get cheated on. It doesn't matter how clearly they can see that cheating is rampant in other people's relationships. They want what they want, and they aren't going to budge. And that's fine.
Luckily, if you are into non-monogamy, plenty of other people are, too. Better to seek out other non-monogamous people out than try browbeat a monogamous person into your POV. Maybe, in time, if non-monogamous people become more open and visible, things will change. The fact, is there are FAR more non-monogamous people out there than most monogamous people think. They just aren't open about it.
Honestly, I think that if someone is "not into" monogamy, the best course of action in most cases is to just "cheat" and be discrete and safe about it. Just because someone doesn't want to be monogamous doesn't mean they won't get jealous if their partner isn't monogamous as well. That's why it seems like official non-monogamy rarely works in practice.
Furthermore, if these people aren't "open about it," how do you know there are so many?
What boggles my mind about this thread is the closing of minds. Two posters one with an I don't know how and won't listen to him comment and one who will not listen to the words for their own merit or lack thereof because the man is gay.
For myself I listen to Dan Savage the same way I listen to anyone else, with a critical mind. Does what he says make any sense? For instance, he makes an assertion that the expectation of monogamy is recent within the last 60 years. I am not prepared to call full blown BS on that. But I would want more information on how he came to that conclusion.
But the thing about his piece that resonated with me is the expectation that monogamy is the good, one, right way to be. I think he is wrong that the desire to have sex with multiple people is the compelling motivator. I think we are all big, fat love generators. We want to be close to each other. Religion and "society" has weighed and measured that into "acceptable" outlets and venues. In my opinion even sought to squelch it.
Let your mind boggle in wonderment while I sit here and finish my apple and banana.
Why should I listen to this? Cuz it's interesting? I don't care to know why he feels that monogamy is ridiculous, but you and some other posters think it's interesting, so I just gotta listen and then read all his articles and such, because if I don't, I'm closed minded!
I guarantee every single person on this planet is closed minded. I know that there are things that I listen/watch/do that you would want nothing to do with. I'm disinterested in this guy, and that makes me closed minded. I'm OK with this.
Guy has a point though. Homosexual men have different views on fidelity than heterosexual women. (They have similar views to hetero men, but hetero men date women and therefore take female needs into consideration.) Lets don't go pretending we all are the same when we aren't.
Yes, let's don't. The fact that we are all different is exactly why expecting monogamy to be a normal instinct for everyone is BS.
Honestly, I think that if someone is "not into" monogamy, the best course of action in most cases is to just "cheat" and be discrete and safe about it. Just because someone doesn't want to be monogamous doesn't mean they won't get jealous if their partner isn't monogamous as well. That's why it seems like official non-monogamy rarely works in practice.
I disagree.
There is a big difference between non-monogamy and cheating. Non-monogamous thrives on openness, honesty, and equality. A person who desires non-monogamy for themselves but refuses to give their partner the same freedom is selfish, immature and controlling. They are not fit to handle non-monogamy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pi64
Furthermore, if these people aren't "open about it," how do you know there are so many?
I was in a non-monogamous relationship for a number of years. As a consequence of that, I met literally scores of other non-monogamous couples. To the best of my knowledge, not one of those couples is open about their lifestyle. I don't how many non-monogamous couples are out there. But the fact I, just one person, met 50 or 60 secretly non monogamous couples in just a few years suggests to me it is more common than people think.
Monogamy is a must for me and I expect others to respect my choice as I do theirs.
We live in a world in which very few things are shocking anymore. Why would anyone care if people know they made a certain lifestyle choice? If someone judges you, move along.
There is a big difference between non-monogamy and cheating. Non-monogamous thrives on openness, honesty, and equality. A person who desires non-monogamy for themselves but refuses to give their partner the same freedom is selfish, immature and controlling.
They aren't denying their partner anything. If they can see other people without their partner's permission, obviously their partner can do the same thing, whether they choose to or not.
I am particularly fond of this pointing out that the current expectation is that if you are in love, you wont WANT to have sex with other people. That is clearly BS.
Yeah, I appreciated that too. It makes sense.
Anyway I didn't read this as anti-monogamy per se. I think it's anti this expectation of easy monogamy that will hold simply because your partner loves you, and that if they are even so much as attracted to someone else it means they don't really love you. I think he's trying to say that over the course of 40-50 years together, OF COURSE each person will come across someone they are tempted to bone, or at times really crave some variety, and that it doesn't mean they don't love you. Yeah people can spend a good chunk of that 50 years not thinking about straying, but just the same it is normal to have the urge at some point.
I also think he's saying that if someone does fall off the wagon during those tempting times, it is possible to get back on the wagon and stay monogamous going forward. It's a relatively difficult thing to do and it has to be managed just like sobriety.
I think there really is some merit to this line of thinking. Now, if someone just wantonly lies and screws everything that moves that's different. He's talking about someone who truly wants to live up to the ideal but may screw up.
Honestly, I think that if someone is "not into" monogamy, the best course of action in most cases is to just "cheat" and be discrete and safe about it. Just because someone doesn't want to be monogamous doesn't mean they won't get jealous if their partner isn't monogamous as well. That's why it seems like official non-monogamy rarely works in practice.
Furthermore, if these people aren't "open about it," how do you know there are so many?
So then you are a liar and a cheater. If that's what you strive for..........
How about just be honest, and find someone who is looking for a similar situation? I'm not keen on people who will hurt others just to get their own needs met.
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Yes, let's don't. The fact that we are all different is exactly why expecting monogamy to be a normal instinct for everyone is BS.
What you have written here is VERY different from the thread title which clearly states "why monogamy is ridiculous". Not ridiculous for *some* people, but simply ridiculous as a concept in general. Closed minded nonsense, not sure why you defend it. Just because a homosexual endorses it doesn't make it any less close minded and bigoted.
Let your mind boggle in wonderment while I sit here and finish my apple and banana.
Why should I listen to this? Cuz it's interesting?
How will you ever know?
Quote:
I don't care to know why he feels that monogamy is ridiculous, but you and some other posters think it's interesting, so I just gotta listen and then read all his articles and such, because if I don't, I'm closed minded!
I guarantee every single person on this planet is closed minded. I know that there are things that I listen/watch/do that you would want nothing to do with. I'm disinterested in this guy, and that makes me closed minded. I'm OK with this.
I won't know until I listen to it, eh?
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