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Me neither. I'm having a hard time believing the OP actually thought that simply writing the agreement on a piece of paper was binding.
[legally, morally, ethically, financially, etc.]
I actually had a former BF, when I was about 20, want me to verbally agree to having an abortion in the event we had an unplanned pregnancy. This isn't unheard of.
I get this, but the state won't allow her to decline child support. The money is for the child, she's not entitled to decline it on the child's behalf. She could send all his money back to him without the court knowing. She could also choose to not name him on the birth certificate.
And then the OP can go on his merry way living his life the way he wants to live it. She'll eventually meet another guy that will step in as the father figure. But, OP "can't imagine" another man raising his child per his original post.
Ok, so sh*t or get off the pot. Either OP is in, or he's not in.
Again, women can't predict if they'll be able to follow through with an abortion when the time actually comes. She couldn't accurately guess where her emotional state would be, and for them to come to such an agreement was foolish for both of them ESPECIALLY knowing that their agreed upon method of BC had a very high failure rate. If the OP was so concerned about an unplanned pregnancy, he should have also been more active in preventing it.
Not necessarily. If they agree that he is to relinquish his parental rights, there would be no child support payments involved. I had a friend who just went through that with her ex-husband. She'd had enough of his no-show b.s. and the constant heartbreak he was putting their daughter through, so she pursued that avenue.
I get this, but the state won't allow her to decline child support. The money is for the child, she's not entitled to decline it on the child's behalf. She could send all his money back to him without the court knowing. She could also choose to not name him on the birth certificate.
And then the OP can go on his merry way living his life the way he wants to live it. She'll eventually meet another guy that will step in as the father figure. But, OP "can't imagine" another man raising his child per his original post.
Ok, so sh*t or get off the pot. Either OP is in, or he's not in.
Again, women can't predict if they'll be able to follow through with an abortion when the time actually comes. She couldn't accurately guess where her emotional state would be, and for them to come to such an agreement was foolish for both of them ESPECIALLY knowing that their agreed upon method of BC had a very high failure rate. If the OP was so concerned about an unplanned pregnancy, he should have also been more active in preventing it.
The state won't force her to file it either. She has to go to them. Plus there are many outs as in never filing or as you said not listing any name on the certificate. She can't file for government assistance but she may not need it.
I actually had a former BF, when I was about 20, want me to verbally agree to having an abortion in the event we had an unplanned pregnancy. This isn't unheard of.
I don't doubt that people want verbal agreements. However, I still can't believe the OP actually thought that simply writing the agreement on a piece of paper was binding. For something this critically important, it takes more than a piece of paper to guarantee it.
She's now pregnant and doesn't want to get an abortion.
I understand it's her legal right, etc. This isn't a Constitutional law quiz.
What is bothering me is that I'm now in a situation where I can barely bring myself to even look at her because of her lying to me. It feels like such a betrayal on her part of my trust. She wants to keep the relationship and would like to get married to me.
Yet at the same time I can't stand the thought of not raising my child - instead I would be a weekend father if she allows it, which makes me feel like some deadbeat person that is running away from being a parent.
You are, at least for now, on track to becoming a father. Despite what your critics are saying, your issue is not that you hate your future child, are trying to hurt your girlfriend, or are trying to get some tips on how to strong-arm her into an abortion. Anyone who would say that has not read a single thing you've written. Nor is it that you're "deadbeat dad" material, or a selfish troglodyte, or [insert insult here]. You feel betrayed because, until now, your relationship and future with this woman was based upon the fact that you mutually agreed that you do not want kids. This is a MAJOR life decision, and you shouldn't feel abnormal or guilty for not wanting to completely change the course of your life since your girlfriend's change of heart.
I'll be frank: The fact that she wants to rush into marriage so soon after finding out she's pregnant is a red flag to me. It's not just her age, either. I spent my adolescence in a Southern town where women angle to get pregnant by 19 and married by 20. The so-called "clock" starts ticking reeeeeal early down there. I know too many young women (and older ones, 30 and up) who will claim they don't want kids, claim they're in "no rush" to commit, to get their guys to stay with them. Of course, the moment there's a pregnancy scare, the tune changes to "You'd better marry me and support me." My neighbor growing up put holes in her boyfriend's condoms once she realized he was adamantly not into fatherhood. I tipped him off, fortunately BEFORE anything happened.
A consistent theme keeps popping up in many of your critics' posts. They firmly believe that you are being pig-headed because you refuse to submit to the romantic fairytale narrative that many people have been taught. In that narrative, a woman reacts to an unplanned pregnancy with an outpouring of love and joy, and her reluctant partner comes around to agree to be a dad. Then, they get married, have the kid, and ride off into the sunset, happily ever after. Hogwash.
My wife became pregnant when we were trying out the Pill. It didn't work because it made her throw up; thus, it wasn't offering the required protection. (Incidentally, we've never had an "oops" with the rhythm method, although we did use condoms during the "bad" days until I got a vasectomy last year, so no, rhythm method =/= "parents" if you use it correctly, which your girlfriend it seems did not.) Her reaction was much closer to "Oh [bleep], I have to make an appointment with Planned P right away." Although she safely induced miscarriage at home in the end (since she preferred to avoid the pain and expense of the clinic if possible), the end result and sentiment were the same. Lest you think she's an anomaly, I have a half-dozen female friends and a couple more family members and in-laws who got into the same situation and took the same action. Maybe your girlfriend did experience a change of heart simply by virtue of being pregnant. But how could you have known? Many other women say they don't want kids, and their actions match their words.
Don't be suckered by someone else's idea of how you should react to this. Don't submit to the narrative that as a man, you're wrong and your girlfriend is the innocent victim. You have every right to feel angry and betrayed. And, you have every right to end the relationship if you feel it's beyond repair. Let me tell you something: Had my wife changed her mind 3 years in, when we were still dating but not engaged? It would seriously damage the foundation of trust we'd built the relationship on, and I'd probably not be married to her today. Your girlfriend obviously has no respect for your choices, or your plans for the future. Others are saying you have to "man up" and support her in every way, but did she give you that same consideration? Do you want to stay with someone who has essentially forced you into a life you don't want?
I can't tell you what to do. But I can support you and agree that you have every right to EVERYTHING you feel right now. But no matter what you decide, keep an eye on her behavior. It's very possible she's as deceitful and manipulative as she comes across to me. My mother was like that too. It damages a child. Don't let her guilt-trip you into ruining your life more than she already has.
Not necessarily. If they agree that he is to relinquish his parental rights, there would be no child support payments involved. I had a friend who just went through that with her ex-husband. She'd had enough of his no-show b.s. and the constant heartbreak he was putting their daughter through, so she pursued that avenue.
Some states will not allow this unless the parent has an adoptive parent to fill in and step up (Michigan, for example). Depends greatly on the state law presiding. The only work around is to not name him on the BC, but then she'll be in a hard spot if she needs to file for assistance (Because the state has to have someone's wage to garnish for reimbursement).
HOWEVER - The OP stated he could not imagine another man raising his child. So, is he in or is he out??
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yellow Jacket
The state won't force her to file it either. She has to go to them. Plus there are many outs as in never filing or as you said not listing any name on the certificate. She can't file for government assistance but she may not need it.
No, state won't force her to file as long as she doesn't need assistance.
Who says he has to marry her, or even be in her life, to share custody of this child?
He didn't say he was opposed to paying child support. In fact, he didn't even mention it. He simply said he felt betrayed and is thinking long and hard about marrying her. And he is thinking of ending the relationship.
Some are trying to insult him in saying "I hope she dumps you, she's too good for you," blah blah blah. He said she is afraid of losing him. Not the other way around. Especially if he doesn't mind paying support, and is open to fatherhood, she has more to lose by him walking away than he does. She's going to be a single mother, at least in the short-term, if he walks.
By the way, he has a right to see his child whether he marries this woman or not. Refusing marriage under duress of entrapment =/= deadbeat dad. If he wants weekend custody, he should research the law in his state and go get it. He is legally entitled to joint custody, and both the equality feminists and the men's rights activists have fought and are fighting to change the law so he can get it. And especially if he gets joint custody instead of weekends only, he may not necessarily owe child support. For all we know, her income is the higher of the two.
You are, at least for now, on track to becoming a father. Despite what your critics are saying, your issue is not that you hate your future child, are trying to hurt your girlfriend, or are trying to get some tips on how to strong-arm her into an abortion. Anyone who would say that has not read a single thing you've written. Nor is it that you're "deadbeat dad" material, or a selfish troglodyte, or [insert insult here]. You feel betrayed because, until now, your relationship and future with this woman was based upon the fact that you mutually agreed that you do not want kids. This is a MAJOR life decision, and you shouldn't feel abnormal or guilty for not wanting to completely change the course of your life since your girlfriend's change of heart.
I'll be frank: The fact that she wants to rush into marriage so soon after finding out she's pregnant is a red flag to me. It's not just her age, either. I spent my adolescence in a Southern town where women angle to get pregnant by 19 and married by 20. The so-called "clock" starts ticking reeeeeal early down there. I know too many young women (and older ones, 30 and up) who will claim they don't want kids, claim they're in "no rush" to commit, to get their guys to stay with them. Of course, the moment there's a pregnancy scare, the tune changes to "You'd better marry me and support me." My neighbor growing up put holes in her boyfriend's condoms once she realized he was adamantly not into fatherhood. I tipped him off, fortunately BEFORE anything happened.
A consistent theme keeps popping up in many of your critics' posts. They firmly believe that you are being pig-headed because you refuse to submit to the romantic fairytale narrative that many people have been taught. In that narrative, a woman reacts to an unplanned pregnancy with an outpouring of love and joy, and her reluctant partner comes around to agree to be a dad. Then, they get married, have the kid, and ride off into the sunset, happily ever after. Hogwash.
My wife became pregnant when we were trying out the Pill. It didn't work because it made her throw up; thus, it wasn't offering the required protection. (Incidentally, we've never had an "oops" with the rhythm method, although we did use condoms during the "bad" days until I got a vasectomy last year, so no, rhythm method =/= "parents" if you use it correctly, which your girlfriend it seems did not.) Her reaction was much closer to "Oh [bleep], I have to make an appointment with Planned P right away." Although she safely induced miscarriage at home in the end (since she preferred to avoid the pain and expense of the clinic if possible), the end result and sentiment were the same. Lest you think she's an anomaly, I have a half-dozen female friends and a couple more family members and in-laws who got into the same situation and took the same action. Maybe your girlfriend did experience a change of heart simply by virtue of being pregnant. But how could you have known? Many other women say they don't want kids, and their actions match their words.
Don't be suckered by someone else's idea of how you should react to this. Don't submit to the narrative that as a man, you're wrong and your girlfriend is the innocent victim. You have every right to feel angry and betrayed. And, you have every right to end the relationship if you feel it's beyond repair. Let me tell you something: Had my wife changed her mind 3 years in, when we were still dating but not engaged? It would seriously damage the foundation of trust we'd built the relationship on, and I'd probably not be married to her today. Your girlfriend obviously has no respect for your choices, or your plans for the future. Others are saying you have to "man up" and support her in every way, but did she give you that same consideration? Do you want to stay with someone who has essentially forced you into a life you don't want?
I can't tell you what to do. But I can support you and agree that you have every right to EVERYTHING you feel right now. But no matter what you decide, keep an eye on her behavior. It's very possible she's as deceitful and manipulative as she comes across to me. My mother was like that too. It damages a child. Don't let her guilt-trip you into ruining your life more than she already has.
I agree with a lot of what this person has to say. As a woman who doesn't want kids (for philosophical and intellectual reasons as well as emotional and physical), if I entered into a relationship with a man with the understanding that child making was not an option, in your girlfriend's situation I would either, 1. Have the abortion or at the very least, talk it over with you, and absolve you of all fatherhood duties if you so desired. A friend of mine got pregnant accidentally, and I remember telling her that if she decides to keep the kid she will have to do it herself and not expect help from the father.
See, it's all well and good to say "It takes two to tango" etc... but the fact of the matter is, if you limit your sexual pool to only those who have no uterus, or for the child-free ladies, those men who have had vasectomies - you narrow your chances at finding sexual gratification dramatically, and love and compatibility even more so! There is always the risk, even on various forms of birth control. It is my belief that in a relationship where both agree to no children, when a woman gets pregnant and changes her mind, the father should not be culpable for her decision to raise a child. It doesn't seem fair to me at all. But monks and nuns most of us are not, and the idea of celibacy just for the sake of avoiding accidental breeding is not practical. What if the situation was reversed, ladies, and the man was having a child you did not want?
I feel for you in the situation, OP. But ultimately, it will be your decision. I would not marry her just yet, as the timing seems rushed and awkward and rather like entrapment. I hope she gives you financial and emotional freedom from your progeny if that is what you wish. If you choose to be a dad and not just an accidental sperm donor...I wish you the best in that regard as well.
But I would not trust a woman who would say "Whoops, it didn't work. I am pregnant and you are now going to be a dad because my hormones and mental state won't allow me to keep my promises. Give me your money and time and your last name." That just makes me uncomfortable.
This may have been said, but have you spoken to her about your feelings of betrayal? Have you asked her why she chose to break your agreement? If you love her then you should try and talk about it. You can ask all of us what we think but in the end none of that matters.
It is my belief that in a relationship where both agree to no children, when a woman gets pregnant and changes her mind, the father should not be culpable for her decision to raise a child.
I agree, but the state as of yet usually does not. Who knows, this could change, since women are catching up to men in earnings. My wife is the breadwinner around here. And living in New York, I know there are couples where the wife pays alimony or child support since she earns more.
Quote:
But monks and nuns most of us are not, and the idea of celibacy just for the sake of avoiding accidental breeding is not practical.
There are people who prefer to limit sex to procreative purposes and that's their right to do so. But it's equally our right to have sex strictly for the pleasure of it.
Quote:
But I would not trust a woman who would say "Whoops, it didn't work. I am pregnant and you are now going to be a dad because my hormones and mental state won't allow me to keep my promises. Give me your money and time and your last name." That just makes me uncomfortable.
This is what I was thinking. I danced around it a bit more. I'd rather that women explain how they see his girlfriend's perspective since I can't get pregnant or make any decisions related to it. But this is how I see it exactly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobalobabingbong
This may have been said, but have you spoken to her about your feelings of betrayal? Have you asked her why she chose to break your agreement? If you love her then you should try and talk about it. You can ask all of us what we think but in the end none of that matters.
</end thread> Just kidding. But this is a very important point.
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