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I'm sorry that this happened. Abjectly boorish maneuver on the fellow's part! My personal impression is that such "upgrades" don't work, even in a narrowly selfish sense. The clerical-worker will work her charms for a while, and will then file for divorce. There is a relentless symmetry to such things....
Eh, other than the unfortunate wasted time spent with him, it was no big loss, really (and it also appeared to be far from an upgrade, for many reasons). In this particular person's case, he's got a pretty poor track record in regard to making choices that lead to happiness, and I can't imagine his choices in that particular situation are any different. If anything, the timing of actually directly led to my meeting my now-husband, and that's a very, very good thing.
Also, my info is 5 years out of date, but at least at that time, there was not much point in a PhD in computer science, if one already had a master's (or two). The same jobs and salaries were available to both -- what mattered was what you could do, not the degree.
The exception was a university professorship, maybe, but those are extremely rare. One out of several thousand graduates. And they do not pay as well as industry.
I am very aware that we are hearing all this thirdhand. But, OP, if you are concerned, it might be useful to talk to the bf directly, and then bring his answers back here. After so many years, there is nothing wrong with asking questions about his career plans.
Is this bf odd, at all? The business with the multiple degrees gives the impression that he is the sort of guy every department has -- a perpetual student with a screw loose, who will never succeed in academia or in the real world, but who does not quite flunk out, either. That would explain why they do not give him a stipend. Although it doesn't really jive with the transfer to another school.
I am very aware that we are hearing all this thirdhand. But, OP, if you are concerned, it might be useful to talk to the bf directly, and then bring his answers back here. After so many years, there is nothing wrong with asking questions about his career plans.
Is this bf odd, at all? The business with the multiple degrees gives the impression that he is the sort of guy every department has -- a perpetual student with a screw loose, who will never succeed in academia or in the real world, but who does not quite flunk out, either. That would explain why they do not give him a stipend. Although it doesn't really jive with the transfer to another school.
This crossed my mind as well. When I read that he decided on going for a 2nd MA, that raised a small red flag in my mind. A 2nd MA, apparently on the gf's dime, more or less. And then, a PhD, also on her dime? Would he have made those choices if he didn't have a meal ticket to charge it to? If he'd had to earn those degrees by getting teaching assistantships, financial aid, a slot on a work-study program, and other support?
It would help to have more info. The earlier point re: why aren't the two of them visiting her family (and his family) together was also a good one. Unless visits on her part are more frequent than once or twice/year. Then it would be reasonable for him to pass on some of the visits. Or unless it's too expensive for them both to visit.
I'm almost same age as your daughter. I am college educated and have a good career. My boyfriend is going through residency. He is living on student loans and very little money. I have asked many times if he needs me to cover some of his board examination costs (they can really add up). every time he thanked me, and refused to accept.
I think there is a difference between a wife and a girl friend. A wife and husband should share their money, however much that is. Girl friend boy friend don't share their finances. I feel strongly about this.
he is right and smart to decline your generosity in this instance
Our 30 year old college educated daughter has been living with her SO for 4 years and they dated 2 years before that. They met in college. He is maybe 2 years younger. We like him and he is welcome in our home anytime but we don’t see him as much as we do our daughter. They live 2 states away.
When they moved in together he had a job and was working on a Masters in Computer Science. Shortly thereafter he stopped working to get another masters- this one in Artificial Intelligence and our daughter is supporting them both. They live in an efficiency apartment and share one car. She has a good job she loves but she isn't rolling in money.
Now he has applied to several PhD programs around the country and she is expected to support them through this. I don’t know if he has student loans (probably does) but I know he hasn't had income for several years. She has told me they see no reason to marry and she doesn't want children. I’m OK with that but I’m having a problem with the fact she is going to leave a wonderful job to move god knows where and he is expecting her to support him for at least 3 or 4 more years if not longer.
Is this unusual? When I was in college in the 60s I came home and told my father my boyfriend wanted us to get married and for me to support us and put him through dental school. My father had a hissy fit and declared “No self respecting man would let a woman support him”. Now I know that is an old fashioned attitude but since these two aren’t even considering marriage my fear is that she will spend the best earning years of her life supporting this guy, he gets his education, they separate and she is left with nothing.
I’m not planning on saying anything to her. Obviously it is none of my business but I’m trying to understand if my reaction to this is out of line with the times. She is not very strong on self preservation skills and had some relationships where she felt she was easily manipulated. I worry about her.
Is the guy afraid to get out in the real world? Have you asked your daughter when he thinks enough is enough? I mean so long as she is happy/content with this situation I'd leave it alone but if she calls and subtly complains about tight budgets and petty arguments I'd tell her to grow a backbone and tell her partner to start contributing!
My Sister was in a similar situation, she wasn't thrilled about it.
Our 30 year old college educated daughter has been living with her SO for 4 years and they dated 2 years before that. They met in college. He is maybe 2 years younger. We like him and he is welcome in our home anytime but we don’t see him as much as we do our daughter. They live 2 states away.
When they moved in together he had a job and was working on a Masters in Computer Science. Shortly thereafter he stopped working to get another masters- this one in Artificial Intelligence and our daughter is supporting them both. They live in an efficiency apartment and share one car. She has a good job she loves but she isn't rolling in money.
Now he has applied to several PhD programs around the country and she is expected to support them through this. I don’t know if he has student loans (probably does) but I know he hasn't had income for several years. She has told me they see no reason to marry and she doesn't want children. I’m OK with that but I’m having a problem with the fact she is going to leave a wonderful job to move god knows where and he is expecting her to support him for at least 3 or 4 more years if not longer.
Is this unusual? When I was in college in the 60s I came home and told my father my boyfriend wanted us to get married and for me to support us and put him through dental school. My father had a hissy fit and declared “No self respecting man would let a woman support him”. Now I know that is an old fashioned attitude but since these two aren’t even considering marriage my fear is that she will spend the best earning years of her life supporting this guy, he gets his education, they separate and she is left with nothing.
I’m not planning on saying anything to her. Obviously it is none of my business but I’m trying to understand if my reaction to this is out of line with the times. She is not very strong on self preservation skills and had some relationships where she felt she was easily manipulated. I worry about her.
I know you don't want to meddle into her life, but as a daughter of a mother who's VERY laissez faire, I kinda wish I had a mother who actually talks and gives me advice instead of being a big sister and not really being involved.
I don't think it would hurt her to tell her your concerns. Just say it once and leave it be and let her decide.
But, do express to her in a calm and objective manner.
If he really loves her, he'd also find a job to mutually provide on the side at least a part-time job or freelance work or something. Anything.
Our 30 year old college educated daughter has been living with her SO for 4 years and they dated 2 years before that. They met in college. He is maybe 2 years younger. We like him and he is welcome in our home anytime but we don’t see him as much as we do our daughter. They live 2 states away.
When they moved in together he had a job and was working on a Masters in Computer Science. Shortly thereafter he stopped working to get another masters- this one in Artificial Intelligence and our daughter is supporting them both. They live in an efficiency apartment and share one car. She has a good job she loves but she isn't rolling in money.
Now he has applied to several PhD programs around the country and she is expected to support them through this. I don’t know if he has student loans (probably does) but I know he hasn't had income for several years. She has told me they see no reason to marry and she doesn't want children. I’m OK with that but I’m having a problem with the fact she is going to leave a wonderful job to move god knows where and he is expecting her to support him for at least 3 or 4 more years if not longer.
Is this unusual? When I was in college in the 60s I came home and told my father my boyfriend wanted us to get married and for me to support us and put him through dental school. My father had a hissy fit and declared “No self respecting man would let a woman support him”. Now I know that is an old fashioned attitude but since these two aren’t even considering marriage my fear is that she will spend the best earning years of her life supporting this guy, he gets his education, they separate and she is left with nothing.
I’m not planning on saying anything to her. Obviously it is none of my business but I’m trying to understand if my reaction to this is out of line with the times. She is not very strong on self preservation skills and had some relationships where she felt she was easily manipulated. I worry about her.
This could turn out to be a very bad investment for your daughter. What she is doing is high stakes gambling that it will pay off.
I got burned big time in a similar situation except the moving part and that we were married. So the married or not doesn't matter here. People still break up.
It's very possible he could just be using her until he gets that Ph.D.
I do not think much of this guy for doing so, especially the "expecting" part. He needs to figure out how to carry his part of the load while getting his degree. The risk is too high that your daughter could be making a big mistake.
Disclaimer - My view may be different if this was long term marriage with children involved. That way it may not be such a bad investment, i.e., break up and she will be able to get her investment back.
I think there is a difference between a wife and a girl friend. A wife and husband should share their money, however much that is. Girl friend boy friend don't share their finances. I feel strongly about this.
i agree with this
and i think it is reasonable for the OP to express something like that to her daughter.
not to mention, starting out on the PhD track these days is a pretty difficult way to make money.
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