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Location: In the cold, dark wasteland of eternity...
926 posts, read 673,709 times
Reputation: 1525
Quote:
Originally Posted by Metaphysique
The writing is terrible. Just... no. I had the misfortune of reading some pages when it was passed around for laughs in various groups and forums for lively discussion. It's not representative of bdsm as a whole, since kink comes in all varieties and forms.
You say this movie is NOT representative of BDSM "as a whole" since "kink" comes in "ALL varieties AND forms".
If "kink" comes in ALL FORMS *and* VARIETIES, why would you say with all certainty that it does NOT represent at least SOME form (if not a lot of) BDSM or D/s? How do you know that for a fact?
There are SO many people in this world who engage in all sorts of (weird) sexual practices in all of it's variances, forms and intensities...for you to say that this movie is ONLY "fantasy" and that it doesn't happen in real life...no one has ANY way of knowing that for certain. I do realize that this is only your opinion and I thank you for participating in my thread! I love reading about other peoples' viewpoints even if I don't understand them lol
However, people who say that this movie does NOT represent the "true" BDSM or the D/s "lifestyle" aren't present in other peoples' bedrooms....so, how would they know whether there are people who DO (or don't) live the lifestyle that's portrayed in this film?
This movie never claimed to be the poster child of the BDSM or D/s Lifestyle...it's just a movie about a screwed up guy who was abused when he was a child and grew up to think that this kind of violent sex was normal...and then he meets a normal and emotionally healthy woman who KNEW right off the bat that this guy was f****** WHACKED. But, she fell in love with him...and gave him multiple chances to fly right...and, he couldn't. Who's to say that this type of scenario couldn't (and doesn't) happen IRL?
Sure, this scenario can and does play out in the real world, just like a variety of scenarios. A Prince Charming type that woos and wows, but is a sociopath? Or American Psycho, or suave, dapper, well-to-do suitor, from a wholesome family, is actually an abusive and manipulative douchebag.
Some people lie and do bad things behind closed doors when others aren't looking. That's always been the case, and always will be.
But we're talking about bdsm as a concept based on ethical and mutual consent and pleasure for all parties. As a concept, manipulation, control, gaslighting, subtle forms of abuse, unhealthy behaviors that cross boundaries, falls outside mutual and consensual play.
Just like with any other arrangement/union/encounter. There are boundaries and limitations. One can apply a similar logic to marriage. "True" marriage can look and function one way to some people, but whose to say those individuals don't practice it another way? What if either party is abusive, or crosses the marital boundaries, what if...
So, like with anything, in concept or theory, it should function a specific way, based on what the parties agree to, but in practice, well, it varies.
Location: In the cold, dark wasteland of eternity...
926 posts, read 673,709 times
Reputation: 1525
Quote:
Originally Posted by Metaphysique
Sure, this scenario can and does play out in the real world, just like a variety of scenarios. A Prince Charming type that woos and wows, but is a sociopath? Or American Psycho, or suave, dapper, well-to-do suitor, from a wholesome family, is actually an abusive and manipulative douchebag.
Some people lie and do bad things behind closed doors when others aren't looking. That's always been the case, and always will be.
But we're talking about bdsm as a concept based on ethical and mutual consent and pleasure for all parties. As a concept, manipulation, control, gaslighting, subtle forms of abuse, unhealthy behaviors that cross boundaries, falls outside mutual and consensual play.
Just like with any other arrangement/union/encounter. There are boundaries and limitations. One can apply a similar logic to marriage. "True" marriage can look and function one way to some people, but whose to say those individuals don't practice it another way? What if either party is abusive, or crosses the marital boundaries, what if...
So, like with anything, in concept or theory, it should function a specific way, based on what the parties agree to, but in practice, well, it varies.
The part of your post highlighted in bold makes sense to me. I realize that this is what the basis is to this type of "lifestyle" or "role play", as was explained to me eloquently in a recent PM I received. I was just saying that just because this movie falls OUT OF those respected and agreed boundaries, doesn't mean that scenes from this movie couldn't be taking place in other peoples' lives as we speak and it doesn't mean that this film isn't representative of what a lot of other people experience in this different type of "lifestyle".
You say this movie is NOT representative of BDSM "as a whole" since "kink" comes in "ALL varieties AND forms".
If "kink" comes in ALL FORMS *and* VARIETIES, why would you say with all certainty that it does NOT represent at least SOME form (if not a lot of) BDSM or D/s? How do you know that for a fact?
Because I'm referring to the character Christian Grey's unhealthy behaviors, manipulation, control, etc., etc. Kink comes in a variety of forms, but manipulating power imbalances, taking advantage of one's naivety and inexperience, isolation, control, pushing boundaries, etc., is just good ol' fashioned manipulation, control, abuse, etc.
Quote:
There are SO many people in this world who engage in all sorts of (weird) sexual practices in all of it's variances, forms and intensities...for you to say that this movie is ONLY "fantasy" and that it doesn't happen in real life...no one has ANY way of knowing that for certain. I do realize that this is only your opinion and I thank you for participating in my thread! I love reading about other peoples' viewpoints even if I don't understand them lol
You still don't get it. Billionaire Bruce Wayne-esque playboy who fancies a meek, bookish, early-20s virgin...
that is the stuff of fantasy. Just like modern day princess movies are fantasy. This fantasy, as a narrative device, works really well to sell this spicy violent sex between two mismatched people-story. It is very much "Sweet regular girl-next-door meets a super angsty, brooding, mysterious, rich man who shows her his naughty room..."
That is a romance novel, a spicy novel, and it is fantasy.
Note: I was responding to a post that addresses these very elements as fantasy.
The part of your post highlighted in bold makes sense to me. I realize that this is what the basis is to this type of "lifestyle" or "role play", as was explained to me eloquently in a recent PM I received. I was just saying that just because this movie falls OUT OF those respected and agreed boundaries, doesn't mean that scenes from this movie couldn't be taking place in other peoples' lives as we speak and it doesn't mean that this film isn't representative of what a lot of other people experience in this different type of "lifestyle".
Sure, just like people in seemingly happy relationships could be living, suffering, in really crappy and/or abusive relationships.
Just because relationships are billed, or seen, as one way (often positive), doesn't really mean they are that way for everyone.
OP: No matter how demeaning you think it isn't, in reality it still is.
If that sort of thing is what you want then it is what you want
but, is it really necessary to announce it to the entire www?
In my opinion the book/movie is nothing more than a
look at what I did and I doubt her children are less than
mortified when asked about the book their Mother wrote.
Location: In the cold, dark wasteland of eternity...
926 posts, read 673,709 times
Reputation: 1525
Quote:
Originally Posted by Metaphysique
Sure, just like people in seemingly happy relationships could be living, suffering, in really crappy and/or abusive relationships.
Just because relationships are billed, or seen, as one way (often positive), doesn't really mean they are that way for everyone.
They're not.
I never said that these types of relationships are that way for everyone, just that they are for some (or a lot of) people. But, I see what you're saying. Thanks for your input! You've really made some interesting and valid points. You seem to know a lot about this lifestyle.
Do you participate in it? And if you do, is it as weird, negative and dehumanizing as this movie (and the media) portrays it to be?
However, people who say that this movie does NOT represent the "true" BDSM or the D/s "lifestyle" aren't present in other peoples' bedrooms....so, how would they know whether there are people who DO (or don't) live the lifestyle that's portrayed in this film?
This movie never claimed to be the poster child of the BDSM or D/s Lifestyle...it's just a movie about a screwed up guy who was abused when he was a child and grew up to think that this kind of violent sex was normal...and then he meets a normal and emotionally healthy woman who KNEW right off the bat that this guy was f****** WHACKED. But, she fell in love with him...and gave him multiple chances to fly right...and, he couldn't. Who's to say that this type of scenario couldn't (and doesn't) happen IRL?
I'm sure it does but my understanding is that people in the BDSM community don't want everyone to think this is how it's supposed to be. He abuses her. Now you have people out there copy-catting this.
I didn't read the book - I have no use for any portrayal of BDSM (except The Secretary, that was hilarious) but I was bored when the movie came on cable so I watched.
I remember her saying WHY do you WANT to hurt me? That is what I would say. And then flee. Forever! Because I don't want anything to do with a man who WANTS to HURT me.
Now, if the lifestyle became intriguing to her, it might be different. But it isn't. She participates for fear of losing him, which is abuse. Coercion.
I just could not bring myself to watch this movie or read the book.
I equate it to desperate boring people that are not creative enough to have good sex lusting after someone else's fantasy.
Also the BDSM stuff does not interest me at all. Pull my hair my accident you get a pass. Pull my hair or do anything to me that intently inflicts pain on me and I am going to claw out your eyes and possibly make you cry blood.
Sex and violence don't mix in my books.
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How do you know that for a fact? 
and I thank you for participating in my thread! I love reading about other peoples' viewpoints even if I don't understand them lol
