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Yeah, no psychological/mental health organization, including the APA, who maintains the DSM, has a diagnosis of "psychopathy," and the traits people describe in conjunction with this are typically criteria of antisocial personality disorder. There IS a separate, unrelated diagnosis of psychosis/psychotic disorders, but those are grouped with the schizophrenia family of disorders, and marked by things like hallucinations and delusions, depersonalizing, sometimes catatonia, etc. They're not generally what people are referencing when they glibly refer to somebody as "a psycho," colloquially.
"Psychopath" isn't really a term you hear in mental health, either...it's more commonly more colloquially used in criminal justice proceedings and sentencing, but isn't a clinical term. Even my curriculum on disorders, which used to be handled in a sequence of classes entitled "Psychopathology I,II, and III," are now entitled "Abnormal Psychology" and "Diagnosis, Differential Diagnoses and Treatment of Mental Disorders," because the term "psychopathology" isn't really in clinical use.
Many good responses! Thanks everyone for the responses......Ok, I deal with many different types of people in business and in my personal life, and I feel I have overall good judgement and intuition. However, I am no Mental health professional by any means, but can usually spot when something is off and not right with someone.
At the present time, a very good friend of mine which I consider like a brother since we've known each other since childhood is dealing with a roller coaster, passionate, yet very volatile relationship. Over the past several weeks he has opened up to me quite a bit seeking guidance. To make a long story short, I informed him that he may want to get a Mental health professionals advice, but in my opinion, and for his well-being, he needs to break off this relationship (his girlfriend) and either maintain no contact, or very limited contact. Below is a time line of series of events that occurred since they began dating. As one can see, there were many red flags early on:
* SHARING TOO MUCH INFORMATION: Within the 1st week and by the 2nd date, she has already informed him of how many sexual partners she's had, that she has a high sex drive, and other intimate, personal information. By her account, she hasn't had many partners, but he doubts it considering she's in her early 40s, has been divorced for over 5 years, and has a teenage son.
* IDEALIZING HIM FROM THE START: From the very 1st date, she was already telling him the things she liked about him.
* SEX WITHIN A MONTH: She moved very fast, and I believe they were sexually active in the 3rd week only having gone out less than 5 times.
* WITHIN 1 MONTH, I LOVE YOU!: That is correct. In fact, I remember him telling me that himself not too long after she told him. My response, "Boy, slow down". He didn't tell her that he loved her until later, but according to him, she kept telling him, "I know how you feel about me, you're just scared to tell me that you love me".
* ORBITERS. AND LOTS OF THEM WAS DISCOVERED WITHIN THE 2ND MONTH: He found it odd that she had lots of "guy friends" that she kept around, and according to her, some of them have shown interest in her. Here is where he began realizing that she has weak boundaries, when he found out that she would meet up with some of those guys in a group for dinner or Happy Hours; even the ones that according to her have made sexual advances to her. Her response to him, "I am just friends with so and so, and I am not interested in him.
* IN THE 4TH OR 5TH MONTH, WAS THEIR 1ST REAL ARGUMENT: After they were out on a date on a Friday night and he dropped her off at home, he later found out that she later text a few of her girlfriends and orbiter male friends to join her for a late happy hour. He found it odd that after he got home from dropping her off, he would call her, text her and no response when she would be quick to respond.....BIG RED FLAG!
* LYING, LYING AND LOTS OF LYING: She would lie or leave out certain information that would change the reality of the entire story. My friend thinks she has a drinking problem. Early on in their relationship, she would go out drinking at Happy hours 3-4 a week. He uncovered many small lies and she would always tell him that it will not happen again.
* DEMANDS CONSTANT ATTENTION: At times he would tell me that no matter how many times a week he would see her, or rearrange his plans to meet up with her, it was never enough.
There are many more incidents which he told me about, but as one can see, there is a pattern here. They have been going out for about a year now, but he told me that around the 6th or 7th month mark was when he felt too many things were not adding up with her stories.
FYI, He has tried 2x or 3x (Not sure exactly) to break up with her, and each and every time she would not accept it and would promise him that she is making positive changes in her life. This began just a few months ago around or close to the 1 year mark.
Some other observable characteristics according to him:
* Easily bored
* Constant need for human interaction
* Impulsive (Would go out at the moment without planning to) to meet up with other friends for happy hour if they call her
* In debt (She makes good money too)
* Looses track of time and how many drinks consumes when she is out
* Hangs out with other girlfriends that she tells my friend are toxic, but she still hangs out with them.
* According to him, GREAT SEX! AND LOTS OF IT! LOL! Maybe that is one reason he is still hanging around
* A few months ago when he confronted her about her plans to minimize her drinking, her response, "I am, just be patient".
Right now he is on the fence of once again, trying to break up with her. Like he told me last night...."I know walking away from this relationship is the right thing to do, but when she tells me that she will change and begins crying, it is hard".
Apparently, she is also manipulating him. I am not sure what has gotten into him since he is a professional, intelligent, decent looking with great people skills, and in the past, including his previous marriage, he would not tolerate 1/10th of what he is tolerating now.
Thanks again for the comments.
I will share many of the comments written here to him.
OP- if your friend is relating THAT many red flags to you....he knows she has major issues. Time for him to "dodge the bullet".
I notice (which is not the same thing is diagnosing) traits, (which, alone, do not indicate having a personality disorder) fairly early, but I'm also trained to notice such things.
Obviously, it takes legitimate evaluations to truly dx a personality disorder, which can be comorbid with any number of issues. And, obviously, narcissistic traits, histrionic traits, obsessive-compulsive traits, depressive and anxious traits, etc. do not a pathology make.
And even posters who are trained in diagnostics know that you can't diagnose somebody without actual evaluation and assessment.
My guess is after about 6 months you should know what you are getting with a boyfriend or girlfriend. Although you may not get a true impression until you are living with someone. People are not perfect. Almost everyone has some sort of personality disorder. Everyone is a little crazy in their own way. What matters is the degree and how it affects you personally. Interestingly enough, all of Hitler's secretaries said he was a wonderful boss. And he was warm and loving to his dogs and family and friends. But he was also a homicidal madman. Go figure.
My guess is after about 6 months you should know what you are getting with a boyfriend or girlfriend. Although you may not get a true impression until you are living with someone. People are not perfect. Almost everyone has some sort of personality disorder. Everyone is a little crazy in their own way. What matters is the degree and how it affects you personally. Interestingly enough, all of Hitler's secretaries said he was a wonderful boss. And he was warm and loving to his dogs and family and friends. But he was also a homicidal madman. Go figure.
Maybe his being a homicidal madman had something to do with why his staff said he was wonderful. If the executioner asked you if you thought he was a nice guy, how would you respond?
These were interviews done many years after the war with the office girls who were his secretaries. They claimed he was like a father figure to them. You get the same type of reactions from neighbors and friends of some serial killers. They have known the person for years and can't believe it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth
Maybe his being a homicidal madman had something to do with why his staff said he was wonderful. If the executioner asked you if you thought he was a nice guy, how would you respond?
About 6 months to a full year. They have to relax and feel the relationship is solid before they cut back on the pretending about who they are.
With violent physical abusers, they might wait 3-4 years to start battering. They careful manuver their partner to isolate them before they start.
That's so true. The man I fell in love with no longer lives here. I guess he was fiction. There's been some fun in the past 7 years and I COULD overlook some of his ways but as I do, I become a non-entity. It's like he has a shell with some kind of vitreous humor surrounding him. As long as there's no disturbance to the environment he is a happy guy but do not express a thought or disagree or, heaven forbid, criticize him because that shakes his little world. And his feelings don't seem to go much beyond that world. So now that we're splitting, there's no problem. He seems happier - I guess his little world can't be disrupted anymore. I can't play this game anymore.
But he's still seeing her? WHY??!! Does he enjoy drama? Does he enjoy wearing a "KICK ME" sign on his back? You say he's tried to break up with her, but she won't allow it? Seinfeld did an entire show on this scenario.
OP: she doesn't have a choice as to whether to "allow" it or not. He tells her he's breaking up with her, blocks her on everything, and walks away. He can change his phone number if necessary. Breaking up is not a consensual activity (except for when it's mutual). He doesn't ever have to see her again, if he doesn't want to. He can break up by text, then block her. The end.
So, what's his problem? Why is he such a pushover?
P.S. Oh, and yeah--she's a nut job.
It definitely is an interesting phenomena. I spoke to him last night for a long time, and his plan is to "ease" off the relationship. Not sure how effective that will be, but he asked her for a "break" to think things through, but he hopes by doing this that the relationship will gradually drift apart. She wasn't thrilled with the break, but is going along with it. At least for now. I feel it is best to just break it off completely, but I am being as supportive as I can be.
He explained to me that it feels as if he has some type of addiction to her. He knows it is bad for him, but it is hard to break it off. Like someone who is on drugs and knows that the drug is bad for him, but has a hard time giving it up. He did tell her that over the next 2 weeks, that he will not reply to any messages or phone calls from her if she does not respect the "break". Hopefully he can follow through with it if she contacts him.
I did get more specific information as far as the time lines go where he noticed things were off.
Within or about the 4 month period was when he initially began to realize some things were off.
Between the 6 to 8 month period was when most of the red flags came to light and kept getting reconfirmed, and where he knew that there were consistent patterns of deceit, instability, and that she will not keep her words in diminishing her drinking and other impulsive behavior.
So basically with him, at the 4 month period, and specifically between the 6-8 month period is where many of the issues and problems were clearly revealed, confirmed, and reconfirmed . However, it seems that after that period, he was already hooked, and breaking it off became increasingly difficult. Therefore, riding on this wild roller coaster ride for the past few months has been the result of his inability to let go, but I believe he is gradually accepting the fact that he MUST let go.
Narcissism can be easy to spot, depending. People who monopolize the conversation during dates, for example, and always make it all about them. People who forget that the purpose of dates is to get to know the person they're with, lol. There are a lot of those out there.
OMG, so true! There are way too many dates like that! But does that automatically mean they're likely narcissistic? That's an honest question, because I wonder about this often.
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