Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I think it's definitely important to be attracted to your mate. My husband readily admits that he wanted to date me based solely on my looks. I was a very shy, introverted type. I was considered very attractive, but nobody asked me out b/c I was quiet and "brainy". I was not very attracted to my future husband, but we became good friends and I eventually fell in love with him. Nowadays, we are both very attracted to each other but that is just one of the many things that keeps us together for over 20 years.
So good looking guy with no personality=no attraction for me.
Anybody ever consider that a basic concern over one's appearances is really an outward indication of that person's self-esteem?
Before everybody starts standing on their chairs and shouting me down, I don't mean people who hit the genetic lottery with beautiful hair, magnificent pouting tatas, and legs that reach all the way to the ground.
Instead, I mean normal people who take normal care of themselves. After all, if you can't respect yourself by wearing decent clothes and staying in relatively decent shape, then how the heck can you expect someone else to respect you? Here are some helpful pointers:
-- Get a decent haircut periodically. As in more than once or twice a year. Length matters much less than being well-groomed.
-- Don't wear clothes that look as if they were found at a thrift store five years ago. While you shouldn't be a slave to fashion, you look equally ridiculous looking as if you just stepped out of a VH1 90s retrospective.
-- Brush your teeth more than once a day.
-- Have acne or bad skin? Then stop eating greasy foods and chocolate.
-- Speaking of eating, put down the knife and the fork for God's sake. No, you don't have a glandular problem. You just eat too much. Cut it out. If you're 40-50 pounds overweight, you're telling the world that you have no discipline and that you cannot control your craving for food. And if you're over 100 pounds overweight, you really have no idea how disgusting it looks. For the love of Pete, look at yourself in the mirror and stop rationalizing.
-- Be proud of yourself and confident. Learn to look people in the eye. Stop slinking into the room as if you were a dog that just got a haircut.
For someone with the ability to have insight, you're missing some huge points.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpg35223
Anybody ever consider that a basic concern over one's appearances is really an outward indication of that person's self-esteem?
Before everybody starts standing on their chairs and shouting me down, I don't mean people who hit the genetic lottery with beautiful hair, magnificent pouting tatas, and legs that reach all the way to the ground.
What defines all of this? Someone who is "beautiful" to one may be "ugly" to another.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpg35223
Instead, I mean normal people who take normal care of themselves. After all, if you can't respect yourself by wearing decent clothes and staying in relatively decent shape, then how the heck can you expect someone else to respect you? Here are some helpful pointers:
-- Get a decent haircut periodically. As in more than once or twice a year. Length matters much less than being well-groomed.
This depends upon who you are. My wife could never get haircuts and I'd be all the happier for it. She looks incredible with a nice poofy bedhead. (No, I'm not kidding!)
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpg35223
-- Don't wear clothes that look as if they were found at a thrift store five years ago. While you shouldn't be a slave to fashion, you look equally ridiculous looking as if you just stepped out of a VH1 90s retrospective.
Some people can't afford expensive, or new, clothing. On top of that, most of us realize that clothes don't make you who you are... they make you avoid indecent exposure. If you would cross someone off of your list just because they'd go to Wal-Mart wearing paint-stained clothing, you need to re-examine your priorities.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpg35223
-- Brush your teeth more than once a day.
I agree with this.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpg35223
-- Have acne or bad skin? Then stop eating greasy foods and chocolate.
I eat greasy foods and chocolate all the time... and although I get the occasional zit here and there, that has nothing to do with my food intake. When I lived with my parents, my mom made sure to give me a balanced diet... and from like ages 14 through 18, I had awful acne. These days I don't eat as well... and my acne isn't that bad at all. Besides, what's wrong with a few zits? I always liked it when a girl had zits because then she wouldn't be so inclined to **** and moan about mine. Low-maintenance girls are the best.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpg35223
-- Speaking of eating, put down the knife and the fork for God's sake. No, you don't have a glandular problem. You just eat too much. Cut it out. If you're 40-50 pounds overweight, you're telling the world that you have no discipline and that you cannot control your craving for food. And if you're over 100 pounds overweight, you really have no idea how disgusting it looks. For the love of Pete, look at yourself in the mirror and stop rationalizing.
If you're "overweight", perhaps you're telling the world that you LIKE being "overweight". I'm 6'2" and I weigh somewhere in the upper 210s... which, by all accepted medical charts, is "overweight". I'm totally cool with that and I wouldn't want to weigh what those charts would call "a healthy weight". People start asking me if I'm eating well enough when I drop below 215, for heaven's sakes. I can't imagine what they'd say if I was the 165 pounds the chart says I should be. I have plenty of discipline and I can control my craving for food. I just choose to stay this size. It kept me out of the hospital once and it'll do so again. By the way, I'm a weightlifter, biker, and runner... and despite the pudge I carry around my gut, I can outrun and outlast most people around me. By the way, being 100 pounds overweight isn't bad at all in the eyes of some people. The charts would say that my wife is 100 pounds overweight... and she's the most gorgeous woman I've ever seen. Don't presume that everyone feels the way you do.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpg35223
-- Be proud of yourself and confident. Learn to look people in the eye. Stop slinking into the room as if you were a dog that just got a haircut.
I agree with this... but everyone, overweight or zit-faced or short or tall or whatever, should do this. You never know who would be attracted to you just as you are.
It all depends upon your definition of "vanity". Saying that you are good-looking and a great catch doesn't make you vain.
Someone who knows he is a good catch is not necessarily arrogant. Knowing the facts about yourself and having a good helping of self-confidence doesn't make you arrogant, nor a bad person.
You make a good point: a healthy sense of self-confidence includes knowing and valuing our skills and achievements, and having standards that hold ourself and others in high regard. But pointing out to others how great you are, or even bragging to yourself how great you are, IS vanity and arrogance, which to me are the opposite of humbleness.
To me, vanity is preening, and there has been a fair amount of preening in posts on this thread. Vanity to me is a self-absorption like narcissus (as in narcissitic) perpetually admiring himself in the pool of water. Vanity to me is a shallowness and superficiality of values, again that's been showing up in this thread.
Another distinction is the difference between me telling others how great I am (that's vanity); versus letting my actions and who i am speak for itself.
Vanity and arrogance tends to focus on the superficial and the external, and dismiss anything else as a waste of time and energy. Vanity is bragging and boasting, versus the quiet poise of self-confidence.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NWPAguy
As far as saying you're a great catch, one can determine how good of a "catch" he/she is by comparing him/herself to the rest of humanity. Compared to all men in my age category, I have always been in the very top category. That isn't vanity... it is factual.
You're dead wrong on that one NWguy! Comparison against others is all about judgment and competition and one-upmanship, seeing everyone else as either "better" or "worse" either "above" you or "below" you, which is a lose-lose attitude for all. (It's not vain or arrogant, you're right, but it has a harsh edge to it nonetheless.)
The alternative is a "flat" structure where I judge no one, including myself, everyone is on a level playing field. Becuase the truth of who I am has nothing to do with any of those things listed: money, looks, fitness, health, good teeth, earning power, job, carrer, income. Practice saying "I am not my body" "I am not my job" "I am not my bank account" "I am not my marriage" "I am not my car and house" "I am not my stock portfolio" Those are not who a person is, so they can't define a person's worth or value.
True self-acceptance and self-love (which are prerequisite for accepting others, for loving others) are gained only in an ABSENCE of comparison to others, an ABSENCE of competition. It is what comes beyond, when we move on and away from the comparison, judgment, and competition that you describe.
Anybody ever consider that a basic concern over one's appearances is really an outward indication of that person's self-esteem?
Nice try, it ain't gonna fly. Bottom line is whatever bothers you about someone else, or has an emotional charge for you, is about YOU, it is never about them. Cleanliness? Haircuts? Clothes? Teeth (puhleeez)? Whatever it is if you've got a problem with it.....it's YOUR PROBLEM! Not theirs!
Nice try, it ain't gonna fly. Bottom line is whatever bothers you about someone else, or has an emotional charge for you, is about YOU, it is never about them. Cleanliness? Haircuts? Clothes? Teeth (puhleeez)? Whatever it is if you've got a problem with it.....it's YOUR PROBLEM! Not theirs!
Totally disagree. You cannot whine about people not being interested in you and, yet, refuse to do anything about it, instead blaming the world and its shallowness. First impressions count in every sphere of life, whether it's business or dating. Again, I'm not talking about getting one's nails done once a week or looking as if you stepped out of the pages of Women's Wear Daily. I'm talking about the normal amount of time people spend taking normal care of themselves and their appearances. If you're not taking care of yourself from a physical or grooming standpoint, then you might as well tell the world, "I just don't give a rip about myself." And if you don't care, why should anybody else?
It's kind of like buying a house, if you forgive the analogy. If the yard is overgrown with brambles, the shutters are falling off, the paint is peeling, and the roof is in a state of disrepair, then prospective buyers are going to drive right past without even touching the brakes, no matter how charming and comfortable the interior is. Because the prospective shopper, who has fifteen homes on his or her list to tour that afternoon, assumes that if the exterior is not taken care of, the interior is bound to be a shambles, too. Don't take my word for it. Ask any realtor.
What's more, it's not that hard to do. Nor is it expensive. You don't have to spend a bundle on clothes. You don't have to work out two hours every day. You don't have live off cottage cheese splattered on a bed of Belgian endive. You just have to not look like a total slob. Why is this such a hard concept for people to grasp?
By the way, I've met and dated very attractive women who, measured by their physical attributes, were very plain. But they took pride in the way they dressed and the way they presented themselves. That pride comes through in how they interacted with everybody.
I am starting this thread as I believe looks are very important in choosing who you are with on a romantic level. Many say looks don't matter so much which reminds me of one of my favorite quotes ever from Liar, Liar the movie.
"But Dad, my teacher says that everyone is beautiful on the inside.
Son, that is just what ugly people tell themselves to make themselves feel better."
Sad, but very telling of our society.
I don't choose my friends based upon their looks but personality and common interests. My friends could be hideous looking and I wouldn't care so long as I enjoy being around them.
I do use looks to determine who I date. There has to be some sort of physical connection for me to go out with someone, though obviously a great personality certainly can make up for shortfalls physically to some extent.
Still, I have to be physially attracted to someone to date them. Otherwise, they are just my friend, which is fine too.
To those that say looks don't matter when dating I am not buying it. Looks do matter, though they should not be the only factor we are looking at when choosing who to date.
I don't really look at people regardless. My girlfriend also says that I don't hear people...or something like that, I wasn't really paying that much attention.
Comparison against others is all about judgment and competition and one-upmanship, seeing everyone else as either "better" or "worse" either "above" you or "below" you, which is a lose-lose attitude for all. (It's not vain or arrogant, you're right, but it has a harsh edge to it nonetheless.)
Sure... and ultimately, the impetus to better oneself is often found in comparing oneself to others. How many times have we asked "what have they got that I ain't got?".... I'm sure everyone has asked that at least once in their lives. The most famous asker of that question was the Cowardly Lion from "The Wizard Of Oz"... and the answer was "COURAGE"! Sometimes that's all there is. A courageous person can seem like he/she brings more to the table than someone who isn't courageous.
Comparing myself to other people doesn't mean that I saw them as "worse" than myself. Whenever I thought I was doing better than someone else in any category, I always felt that the people I was beating could be doing as well as I do if they only tried. I've had a lot of handicaps and obstacles in my life... I've seen people who've gone through a small fraction of the crap I went through, turning to self-destructive behaviors or suicide as a result. I overcame it all... because I wanted to. I'm a human just like anyone else, and I'm not Superman. Almost all the time, someone who isn't in the top tier of humanity is only not there due to his/her own laziness and/or lack of desire to be there.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DimSumRaja
The alternative is a "flat" structure where I judge no one, including myself, everyone is on a level playing field. Becuase the truth of who I am has nothing to do with any of those things listed: money, looks, fitness, health, good teeth, earning power, job, carrer, income.
I agree that everyone is on a level playing field. This is why I am not a racist. Here in America at least, we all have (or should have) equal opportunity for everything. What one makes of oneself determines one's position and path in life. I agree that the list of things you mentioned does not determine who a person is, or how good of a person they are. It's all about whether or not you are using what you've got, to the best of your ability. Saying that I've always been in the top tier of humanity has nothing to do with any of that stuff. I still think I'm pretty darn good as a person, and I'm just a step above dirt-poor right now. Being broke is temporary. Being a loser is also temporary. I quoted, as an example of my view of myself, the fact that I don't smoke, drink, nor do drugs. Someone who isn't especially intelligent and may only ever work in fast-food can still be comparatively good as a person in that category, if they don't smoke, drink, nor do drugs. How good of a person someone is is always defined by that person's behavior.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DimSumRaja
Practice saying "I am not my body" "I am not my job" "I am not my bank account" "I am not my marriage" "I am not my car and house" "I am not my stock portfolio" Those are not who a person is, so they can't define a person's worth or value.
None of this stuff is behavior-related... except MAYBE the marriage thing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DimSumRaja
True self-acceptance and self-love (which are prerequisite for accepting others, for loving others) are gained only in an ABSENCE of comparison to others, an ABSENCE of competition. It is what comes beyond, when we move on and away from the comparison, judgment, and competition that you describe.
That all depends upon what you're comparing. True self-acceptance is gained in the absence of comparison along the lines of material things such as your car and your job and the size of your bank account. However, I think that it helps to compare your behaviors, and how you live your life, to others. It isn't necessary if you're religious and you follow the rules to a "T"... then all you have to do is compare yourself to how THE BOOK says you should be... but for those who aren't religious, certain comparisons do help. Heaven knows, it's comparisons which bring people's self-esteem down to begin with... why can't comparisons lift it up?
Skinny women seem like they'd break if you handled them a little too roughly. I'm not interested in a china doll...too fragile.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
