Ladies and online dating - a little advice for you. (wife, man)
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Of all the responses I got, about 5% actually made it apparent that they had read and understood what I wrote in my profile and used the clues I gave to try to get to know more about me. About 90% were one liners or offers to hook up that night.
I had to delete the photos from my profile because I was just fed up with the type of guys who were using their shotgun approach on me. I just don't think the odds are in favor of women that they will find a decent man on a dating site.
I respectfully disagree. You have said it yourself that you just have to be prepared to wade through the crap shotgunners and other losers.
I've said it before and will once again...if you have it going on...CONTACT some of the guys that have great profiles and get their attention.
Send a picture, explain that you prefer to contact since you get innundated with a lot of bad contacts etc. This will help you cut right to the front of the line and gauge what thier response is.
Look at it from my point of view...I was only interested in about 10% of the women that contacted me on-line while I was interested in 100% of the women that I contacted. Heck, I would *HATE* sitting back waiting to be contacted knowing that some of the best catches out there had enough attention that they wouldn't generally bother to contact guys and maybe wouldn't pick me out of the pile.
Believe it or not, writing skills are not enough to write a winning ad. I didn't mean to imply you aren't good at writing. It's been a lesson in marketing for me; there's what you want, how to present it, how to express what you don't want without having to say it (you don't want to be negative and nit-picky), your target audience, discouraging those who aren't in it.....it sounds complicated, but it takes a while to really get it down to where it flows and you start seeing results almost immediately.
I know the frustrations, but I also know the rewards. I'm a huge advocate for online dating, however, it took time to get it right. I know some don't have that kind of time or even the patience for it. It's not for everyone, surely.
I agree. Very few people are good at self-marketing. That's also why most people have lousy resumes. It's not because they'd make lousy employees. It's just because they don't know how to effectively highlight their strengths and value to a potential employer. By the same token, most people can't write decent dating profiles. It really does take a LOT of trial and error. Like your resume, you need people to proofread it and give you constructive criticism. But few people have the patience. PassTheChocolate, maybe the next time I write a profile, I'll send you mine.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DontH8Me
I had to delete the photos from my profile because I was just fed up with the type of guys who were using their shotgun approach on me. I just don't think the odds are in favor of women that they will find a decent man on a dating site.
And how is that any different than real life? Most guys in real life take a shotgun approach. They see a cute girl, they know nothing about her, and then go up and hit on her. I don't think the issue is online vs. offline. Mathguy said it best. Women need to take more initiative instead of complaining about the type of men who contact them.
I respectfully disagree. You have said it yourself that you just have to be prepared to wade through the crap shotgunners and other losers.
I've said it before and will once again...if you have it going on...CONTACT some of the guys that have great profiles and get their attention.
Send a picture, explain that you prefer to contact since you get innundated with a lot of bad contacts etc. This will help you cut right to the front of the line and gauge what thier response is.
Look at it from my point of view...I was only interested in about 10% of the women that contacted me on-line while I was interested in 100% of the women that I contacted. Heck, I would *HATE* sitting back waiting to be contacted knowing that some of the best catches out there had enough attention that they wouldn't generally bother to contact guys and maybe wouldn't pick me out of the pile.
Call me old fashioned, but I won't make the first move. But I like your point, and I've always enjoyed your posts - I hope things work out with your new flame!
i disagree, I was simply responding to the fact that the other posters recommend being honest, so to be honest, I list that I would like to get married and have kids. It doesn't mean I ask this on the first date or ask questions during the relationship, etc. It's just a fact. If I don't list this, I wil get responses from men who do not want a serious relationship, they are only looking to hook up with no intentions of meeting Miss Right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rubber_factory
That would be a red flag to me. I understand that it will be asked early, because it is very important to most women, but the timing is important.
Most guys don't like to be in the situation where they're constantly asked questions about the daily/weekly/monthly status of the relationship, i.e., "Can we move in together? Where is this relationship going?" I would probably perceive your question to be an early indication of this.
I understand your hesitations, but don't categorize all women based on your negative dealings in the past. I'm not a woman who pressures people, I simply do not want to waste time and happiness with someone who is not interested.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rubber_factory
I understand this perspective.
The devil is in the details, I guess. I've had dates that felt like an interrogation, or a psychological exam. I've had relationships that took a sudden turn into babyland - so maybe I'm a little gunshy.
I think you did the right thing. As a male, I appreciate such honesty. No one wants to waste time on someone who's looking for something different. If I'm just looking for someone to hang out with and you're looking for something that could lead to marriage, at least I know you're not right for me. That's better than meeting, spending weeks or months dating, and then discovering we're looking for different things.
I disagree. All she said is that she wants to meet someone who wants marriage and children. There's nothing demanding or desperate in being up front about what you want. If anything, that shows respect because you're letting a potential partner know what your long-term goals are.
You don't have to list everything, but sticking to just the basics won't get you anywhere. Your profile won't stand out among so many similar ones and people won't want to contact you because it'll look like you didn't put much effort into writing anything. I know it's hard to write about yourself and it feels weird to sell yourself to an audience, but that's no different than what you do with a resume.
See I wouldn't perceive it that way at all. She's simply being upfront about what her goals are. It's no different than if said, "I already have kids and don't wish to have any more." I'm just saving the reader from having to ask. So if a woman says she's looking for someone who's interested in someday getting married and having a family, that doesn't mean she's looking to get married tomorrow. It just means she doesn't want to be contacted by people who are just looking for something short-term.
That would be a red flag to me. I understand that it will be asked early, because it is very important to most women, but the timing is important.
Most guys don't like to be in the situation where they're constantly asked questions about the daily/weekly/monthly status of the relationship, i.e., "Can we move in together? Where is this relationship going?" I would probably perceive your question to be an early indication of this.
Can't stand women like that that need constant reassurance. Way too needy.
I understand your hesitations, but don't categorize all women based on your negative dealings in the past. I'm not a woman who pressures people, I simply do not want to waste time and happiness with someone who is not interested.
Exactly - which is why I believe that everyone should be straightforward with what it is they intend to develop. If someone wants to find a long term relationship, then obviously they don't want to go out on dates with the guy who wants to remain a bachelor for his whole life. The people who are looking for superficial connections should steer clear of those who are looking for a meaningful, monogamous, long term relationship. If all you want to do is "hang out" then just say so. It makes it so much easier for those who are looking for a deeper connection to steer clear. For instance, just because you plan to get married and have a family, doesn't mean you want to do that with them on the first date.
If someone is intimidated by someone being straightforward about what they are looking for then maybe that person needs to stop and think about what it is they want themselves. I'd rather know up front what the person's goals are than go through the introductory phase with someone who has different goals than I do only to discover that after several weeks or months.
I think you did the right thing. As a male, I appreciate such honesty. No one wants to waste time on someone who's looking for something different. If I'm just looking for someone to hang out with and you're looking for something that could lead to marriage, at least I know you're not right for me. That's better than meeting, spending weeks or months dating, and then discovering we're looking for different things.
I disagree. All she said is that she wants to meet someone who wants marriage and children. There's nothing demanding or desperate in being up front about what you want. If anything, that shows respect because you're letting a potential partner know what your long-term goals are.
Sometimes it's not what you say but how you say it. Having long term goals is good, but I find things don't always fall into place so nicely in real life.
I don't see nothing wrong with someone desiring marriage and children, however if the approach is full on attack about it, what it tells me is someone that is lacking inside and is trying to find happyness in having children or getting married. They'll always be seeking these other things "to make them happy" all the while lacking good self esteem. Demanding kids and marriage and all these other expectations before you even know someone is putting the cart before the horse.
Really what I want and look for is a good woman and a good partner and someone I that can add to my life in a positive way. Having found that I think most everything else will fall into place naturally.
I think as Americans we are business oriented people and "we get things done" compared to a lot of cultures around the world. However sometimes I think we take it too far and especially it leaks over into relationships. Unless you are dealing with a really weak minded person, I've never seen the "hard sell" with high pressure tactics really work in relationships with family, friends or romantic partners.
Of all the responses I got, about 5% actually made it apparent that they had read and understood what I wrote in my profile and used the clues I gave to try to get to know more about me. About 90% were one liners or offers to hook up that night.
I had to delete the photos from my profile because I was just fed up with the type of guys who were using their shotgun approach on me. I just don't think the odds are in favor of women that they will find a decent man on a dating site.
You say 90% were one liners or offers to hook up that night. That leaves a big question open, as to how many of them were one liners, and how many where offers to hook up that night. This is important because perhaps you are mis-judging the actions of the guys sending the one-liners. As a guy, it is very frustrating to compose an interesting email to a profile which includes "comments and questions about her and her interests" because 90% of the profiles out there will not get a response -- the girl created it on a whim & never checks it, or the girl created it & got so many emails she got bored, or the girl created it & happily got matched up so is no longer interested, or some other case where the profile seems active but is not. So rather than compose some honest/heart-felt short reply (maybe that takes 10 minutes, maybe 20, or longer), the simpler thing to do is send a quick one liner to see if the profile is "alive" or "dead". Although I realize that 99% of guys on the sites can probably not compose a good one-liner to save their lives and likely default to "hi you're cute email me back ok thanks cya". The idea is that the girl will respond with a simple "thanks, what's up?" and then the conversation can begin.
I'm not calling it right or wrong I'm pointing out that you may be mis-interpreting the one liners.
IF YOU DELETE YOUR PHOTOS, you won't even show up in search results on most sites, unless some obscure button is checked. So of course you won't get a deludge of replies anymore. Posting photos is the only way to have a good profile that will get good exposure to the guys. Many guys have simple "rules" like: No photos, not interested; this covers a broad range of guys, so you are missing good guys too.
The best thing for any woman to do, is to create a fake profile on a free dating site (or pay site if you really want), posing as a man, and try to message some women. By experiencing this "opposite perspective", the difficulties of online dating become pretty clear. See if any of your messages even get replies; whether they are honest, curious messages about a woman's profile, or one-liners hoping she is going to reply at all. At most, maybe 2 out of 10 profiles will lead to any reply, it depends on the site and the search criteria. If the sites themselves made their statistics open, then everyone would see what a ridiculous house of cards it really is.
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Heck, I would *HATE* sitting back waiting to be contacted knowing that some of the best catches out there had enough attention that they wouldn't generally bother to contact guys and maybe wouldn't pick me out of the pile.
