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The crisis in contemporary Catholicism is profound. It is of a scale unprecedented in the previous history of the institution. The sell-out of the ideals discerned by the majority of Bishops at the Second Vatican Council and the handing over of the institution to a small Taliban of liturgical and doctrinal fundamentalists has to end.
The crisis in contemporary Catholicism is profound. It is of a scale unprecedented in the previous history of the institution. The sell-out of the ideals discerned by the majority of Bishops at the Second Vatican Council and the handing over of the institution to a small Taliban of liturgical and doctrinal fundamentalists has to end.
So what are you looking for exactly? A pre-Vactian II version of the church - or are you looking for a Vatican III type church that will address and resolve all issues in that article? Sorry, I'm not clear.
Fulfillment of the Vatican II Church, for the past 35 years the Church has been dismantling the reforms of Vatican II.
Instead of going forward the Church has been going back in time to a medieval time period, this does not represent the early Church.
I don't know Ted, I guess I am very blessed in that I attend a lovely church where I feel like part of the community and where my opinions and presence are valued. I have no problem when reciting the Nicene Creed and mean every word. If you would ask was I appalled at the recent years scandal in the church, yes, I was. Very much so. Was I disappointed in the way it was handled? Yes again. But while it lessened my respect for the senior members of the church body, it in no way lessened my belief in my faith. I say, with all sincerity, that I hope one day you will find the same peace I have found in my chosen religion.
You might want to try the Old Catholic Church that broke away over Vatican I. They might be hard to find in your area though and I believe they did have a sex scandal. Their social views might be closer to yours though.
If you want a Church that will reflect the more progressive ideas of "The Spirit of Vatican II" you could try something like Spiritus Christi, but they're only in New York. It's most likely not going to ever happen in the actual RCC because the demographics is just not there to support it. The majority of the world's Catholics are in socially conservative nations. There might be support for married priests and contraception, but that's about as far as it would get. However allowing those two things is almost impossible to justify within Catholicism. The closest to plausible is the Orthodox position of "We have no position on contraception and as for married men they may become priests, but single men who become priests may not become married men."
The biggest crisis in Catholicism is over the self-indulgent scumbags that chose a horrific expression of their bodily needs above all else, and their elders that permitted it to happen. One needs only to look at the plummeted attendance and closed churches in the Archdiocese of Boston since 2001 for confirmation.
My BFF made her first confession and took her first communion in a church the Archdiocese sold. It's now a real-estate office. How's that for values and traditions, eh?
Which makes more sense? Micromanaging one another's paths of faith? Or making sure our house is clean?
I don't know Ted, I guess I am very blessed in that I attend a lovely church where I feel like part of the community and where my opinions and presence are valued. I have no problem when reciting the Nicene Creed and mean every word. If you would ask was I appalled at the recent years scandal in the church, yes, I was. Very much so. Was I disappointed in the way it was handled? Yes again. But while it lessened my respect for the senior members of the church body, it in no way lessened my belief in my faith. I say, with all sincerity, that I hope one day you will find the same peace I have found in my chosen religion.
I also belong to a wonderful gospel centered all inclusive parish, but I do have to travel a good thirty minutes to reach it while driving past at least a dozen or so other churches.
Many people do not even have such a parish within an hour's drive and there are those that have restrictions that do not allow them to travel great distances.
We should be concerned about what happens outside our local parish after all are we not one body in Christ?
And what exactly is your point of you making your statement on the Nicene Creed?
The Catholic Church does good, but as long as it is a rich, political organization, it will remain corrupt. What happened to humilty? Hard to be humble when surrounded by all of that gold and art.
You might want to try the Old Catholic Church that broke away over Vatican I. They might be hard to find in your area though and I believe they did have a sex scandal. Their social views might be closer to yours though.
If you want a Church that will reflect the more progressive ideas of "The Spirit of Vatican II" you could try something like Spiritus Christi, but they're only in New York. It's most likely not going to ever happen in the actual RCC because the demographics is just not there to support it. The majority of the world's Catholics are in socially conservative nations. There might be support for married priests and contraception, but that's about as far as it would get. However allowing those two things is almost impossible to justify within Catholicism. The closest to plausible is the Orthodox position of "We have no position on contraception and as for married men they may become priests, but single men who become priests may not become married men."
Thanks but no thanks for the invite to leave my Church, who do you think you are? who died and left you in charge? Really!
Majority of Catholics live in conservative countries? What countries might they be? And can you give a source that says what those Catholics think?
"married priests and contraception, but that's about as far as it would get. However allowing those two things is almost impossible to justify within Catholicism." How are those two things almost imposible to justify in Catholicism? Especially since the tradition of the Catholic Church was to have married priest.
Also somewhere between 85 and 90% of the body of Christ rejects the teaching imposed on birth control by the hierarchy which itself does not adhere to celibacy rules.
Even the pope's special commission during Vatican II overwhelming favored lessening the restrictions on birth control.
I also belong to a wonderful gospel centered all inclusive parish, but I do have to travel a good thirty minutes to reach it while driving past at least a dozen or so other churches.
Many people do not even have such a parish within an hour's drive and there are those that have restrictions that do not allow them to travel great distances.
We should be concerned about what happens outside our local parish after all are we not one body in Christ?
And what exactly is your point of you making your statement on the Nicene Creed?
I mean that the creed is a collection of the beliefs of my faith in one place. I guess in a way I am over-simplfying it since it does leave many of the individual aspects of our faith out. But it is a high-level summary.
I think discussing religion means you have to tread carefully so as not to offend the party you are speaking to and that is what I am trying to do here. Someone in a post above made a very good point that basically "where there is man there is corruption". You and I know that is a problem with our faith - to your point - there is corruption of the terms laid out in Vatican II by the more conservative members of the Church who have the power to set policy.
Ted, I believe in the United States of America and the laws and the core values we hold dear - but many times I see these core values ignored, stepped on with no apology, etc. I still believe in the USA - the core values are still there. It's the same with the church. With all her weaknessess, I love her still, but yes, it has shifted a great deal from the church the early apostles set out to create. Did I make ANY sense in this?
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