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"Saved" certainly doesn't mean that you were a careful shopper and spent less than the guy in the next aisle! It means that you adopted a particular set of religious beliefs, and now you can go around with a smug look on your face, believing that you've found a truth that other, allegedly "un-saved" people haven't. (And now you must push that in their faces, because you are obligated to convert them to your newfound viewpoint).
Thank you Katzpur for your response. Is this Mormon doctrine?
Good guess, ditchlights. Yes, it is. Mormonism does not preach strict universalism, but we definitely believe in the biggest Heaven and the littlest Hell of any Christian denomination. We just don't believe that Heaven is a one-size-fits-all kind of place.
Wow... There's nothing like a post by a Mormon to bring a thread to a grinding halt. And here I was looking forward to seeing what everybody else had to say.
Wow... There's nothing like a post by a Mormon to bring a thread to a grinding halt. And here I was looking forward to seeing what everybody else had to say.
I did not expect this thread to be too much of a hit. I was right. It is not a subject most people like to talk about, especially since this forum is populated by roughly 60% atheist. I don't even think that most of the people even read my thread in its entirety, judging by the limited and narrow aspect of most of the responses. Oh well........
I don't even think that most of the people even read my thread in its entirety, judging by the limited and narrow aspect of most of the responses. Oh well........
What you're really saying is that you don't appreciate people disagreeing with the conclusion you drew when you started this thread in the first place. (As it happens, I'm not one of the atheists posting here. But I'm most definitely not a Christian, either. And I have a problem being told that I'm not "saved"--or being labeled a "nonbeliever"--simply because I prefer my religious affiliation to someone else's.)
You know, Allen, I wish you could come to my house for a bit. You could sit outside on our balcony and look out at the beautiful lake and the beautiful trees. The trees around my house are enormous and lovely. You could play with my dog and she'd cuddle with you and lick your face. I'd cook dinner and invite you to meet my friends - who would all welcome you with open arms. We'd laugh, eat, and have a merry old time.
There is so much in this world. There is so much love, laughter and joy to be had. And - for a Christian - wouldn't that be a gift from God?
As for being saved - I think most fundies believe I'm damned any way you look at it! I guess by any standards, I'm not saved. Oh well.
Sounds like a life well lived. One with lessons and practices that are with good Karma.
There is accountability but when one treats others well things will be fine. For those fundies that think they can treat people like crap and say I and "saved" will have a rude awakening. ... but don't fear hell, but rather another lesson to be learned. watch your words, actions thoughts character, and heart that is the way to a life well lived and you will be fine, even if you arent a Christian. There are religions with much longer histories and understanding.
What does the term "saved" mean to you? For a born again Christian, it means spending eternity in heaven. I am well aware of this. But for others, what is your interpretation of the word? Is "saved" the opposite of "damned"? Is there any middle ground? For those that believe that there is no hell, does that mean everybody goes to heaven, or do you just cease to exist, as it was before birth?
The reason I ask is because I have always had mixed feelings on the subject. I know what the Bible says about it, so please do not quote scripture on this thread. In a way, I tend to believe that a loving god would not damn 98% of his creation to hell. On the other hand, as opposed to Universalist beliefs, I do not believe everyone under the sun, regardless of how they lived their life, will go to heaven. That would eliminate any form of accountability.
My personal position is "I don't care if I make it to heaven, I just don't want to suffer in eternal hell". There has to be some form of middle ground. If a loving god would actually damn virtually his entire creation to hell, is being in heaven with a god of this vengeance something I want? There are way too many faiths in the world to where there is only one right one and everybody else is damned to eternal torment.
And as for people that say America is predominantly Christian, this does not mean they ARE Christians. Roughly 80% of Americans profess Christianity, yet only about 20% of those individuals are truly right with Christ, as the Bible states one must be to enter the kingdom of heaven.
It depends on the way in which it is used....
Saved can mean, to put away in its entirerty,and kept till another time...(I "saved" the file to hard drive, and cd formats)
Or
to direct away from danger....(I "saved" his life twice.)
As the opposite of most things seem to exist in some bent and odd matrix or form...
To be saved by the Word of Truth is by the most part what the CHristian faith is all about.
If we neighter toil nor sow, till, spin nor act, or help harvest, in accordance to the truth of God, and follow his word and will and laws....then damned we are!
But if we try, and do, and act accordingly to the will and word of God under his laws precepts and instruction...and it is fulfilled sinlessly through us...as God had originally designed / planned....then we are saved...Eden becomes Edens...the multiple of the first.
I cannot save you, if you want to pollute that Ideal...(woe to them who harm the Earth)
But I can speak the truth to you..and from that, you can make your own pathway to the salvation God is offering all who listen and do or act accordingly!!!...(save yourself)...Do no more sin, and be forgiven...till sow and grow, is the answer and or solution to God...and to do it sinlessly...and no prohibition, nothing omitted, nothing removed...Acts 3:21 means to put back what was taken in disobediance....do the opposite should undo what was done...and be mindful of what God made and gave to us...which is listed in the Genesis!
So if it was taken in disobediance...Put it back sinlessly.
And it takes how many, and how long?, for humans to make paradise with God?..or with out god?
Still not in peace, nor health, nor happiness as a whole?
ALL kinds of corruption, chaos, and woes and wrath upon us?
Funny How that is...foretold....eh?...could it be something is not being done right by the masses?.....could be!
"Saved" means exactly this..... The soul is not “immortal” by itself. Immortality is part of the gospel (2 Tim 1:10) The soul of the unsaved will be “destroyed” as Jesus states (Matthew 10:28).
Do a web search for Conditional Immortality or look at “www.jewishnotgreek.com” and you will find EXCELLENT information on the “Conditional Immortality” biblical truth.
If you like "Life" then Jesus is for you for only He gives life.
If you wish to only live for this world (70 years on avg...) then you will get your wish and your soul will pay for it's sins first (Justice) then be extinguished.
The gospel is simply Life or death. Jesus is the way, the truth and the life.....
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And here I was looking forward to seeing what everybody else had to say.
