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Atheists believes there is no God. Babies don't have an active belief there is no God. Hence they cannot be atheist.
I do not believe there is no God. I do not believe that there IS a God. I am completely neutral on a belief aspect--hence I am also agnostic.
You say atheists believes (actively) there is no God. I say Atheists have no belief in a god. Can you see the finite difference? I know it is word mincing, but can you see that you and I are arguing definitions here?
According to my definition, babies are atheist.
As sit here typing I'm not actively disbelieving in anything. I just don't have a belief in a God.
Last edited by TimeMachine; 04-04-2011 at 02:18 PM..
You say atheists believes (actively) there is no God. I say Atheists have no belief in a god. Can you see the finite difference? I know it is word mincing, but can you see that you and I are arguing definitions here?
According to my definition, babies are atheist.
I agree that we disagree on definition. I agree that you will not change my viewpoint, and that I will not change yours.
Here is a question on that point. Do you WANT to change my viewpoint? I have no desire to change yours, but I will hold to mine and maintain it. We will never agree.
Whatever! I'm not prepared to bang my head against the wall any longer.
You said that last time.
Simply accept that not everyone agrees with YOUR definition. I'm willing to see that you see things differently, but I do not have to agree with you to admit that you have the right to your own viewpoint.
I agree that we disagree on definition. I agree that you will not change my viewpoint, and that I will not change yours.
Here is a question on that point. Do you WANT to change my viewpoint? I have no desire to change yours, but I will hold to mine and maintain it. We will never agree.
Yes, I agree we probably won't ever agree on this thing, not trying to change you at all, just interested in your definition of things, debates like these reveal so many different ways of cutting the pie.
That is why I wish the term nontheist would become more widespread. Then, if we wanted to refer to someone who did not have a belief in a god, we could reserve the term nontheist for them. And we would reserve the term atheist for those who believe there is no god or gods or declare there is no god.
My dad grew up with evangelical parents, my mom grew up Catholic. They both had no real interest in it though, and didn't keep it up as a hobby after they were adults and moved out on their own.
I'd go to church with my grandparents and did the summer bible school when I was younger. When I reached 10 or 11 years of age I finally told my parents who I tried to pay attention and learn everything, but in the end it all just seemed so silly. My parents said if I didn't want to go I didn't have to - it was obviously my choice.
I'm not anti-religious, I just don't really have any interests in the subject. I view it more as a hobby like studying history, old cars, sewing. Anyone and everyone is welcome to become involved in it as much as they want, but I have a real problem when some try to force it on society at large. Organized religion is a personal choice, it's not something to base laws around or to be some definite answer to real world issues. I think this is where our society has really tripped up. So many silly problems around the world are related to people who get the lines of religion and real life mixed up.
Born atheist[SIZE=4]. [/SIZE][SIZE=4] On one level, it is a literal statement. Atheism means a lack of belief in deities. All children are born without a belief in deities, therefore they are born atheist.
But religionists can point to alternative dictionary definitions that say atheism means a belief there are no gods. That definition requires cognition, beyond the scope of most newborns. But back and forth arguments about the definition of "atheist" ignore the broader implications of the term "born atheist."
Just as Nietzsche did not mean "god is dead," to be taken literally–that a deity existed, he was mortal and he died; so too, the term "born atheist" has meaning beyond its literal definition.
First, "born atheist" is a statement of atheist pride. People who use it are out, loud and proud atheists.
Further, "born atheist" implies that atheism is a natural state. If everyone is born atheist, then religion is learned and can be unlearned. People who use the term "born atheist" will likely be amused to hear religion described as a social virus.[/SIZE][SIZE=4]
Additionally, the phrase "born atheist" tends to be used by people who have [/SIZE][SIZE=4]never[/SIZE][SIZE=4] adopted a religion. They were born atheist and never changed.
[/SIZE][SIZE=4]
Finally, people who use the term "born atheist" are willing to stand up to the religious majority. Believing that atheism is a natural state and religion is a social virus, born atheists actively challenge the assumptions of the religious majority.
[/SIZE]
I am agnostic. I was raised in a household where the beliefs were the following:
Sister who's religion is "love"
Mother who has believed in a kind of Christian afterlife but cannot believe in Hell.
Father who won't talk about own religious beliefs, but thinks organized religion is not a positive thing, and that the big bang theory doesn't make any sense because something had to start the bang.
I'm agnostic largely because I was raised in an environment with little religious influence. Being raised in a certain environment does not necessitate that one will follow in their family's footsteps, but it does make it considerably more likely. I am also agnostic because no beliefs relating to the afterlife are likely to be true, so I think it most beneficial to everyone if the question was avoided entirely. To the atheists I say, do you honestly believe no religions have been true? that almost all of the world has been wrong for the past several millenia? To everyone else I say, it's fine to believe in a religion. It may even be good, but I become irritated when a single person tries repeatedly to convert me, because the odds are that they are wrong, being one of and endless number of religions, most of which state that they are the one true religion.
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