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Old 04-25-2011, 02:04 PM
 
Location: Finland, Lappeenranta
15 posts, read 16,742 times
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Good day to everybody!

Sometimes I raise this question up. Only seldom it is answered.

"If a man goes to Hell, has he failed or has God failed."
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Old 04-25-2011, 02:27 PM
 
Location: Blankity-blank!
11,449 posts, read 14,984,715 times
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Most christians are incapable of distinguishing a choice from an ultimatum. So the 'free will' theory goes down the drain.
God (if such exists) can only threaten, not persuade. Be wary of anyone that must resort to threats to get his way.
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Old 04-25-2011, 02:38 PM
 
Location: Sierra Nevada Land, CA
9,308 posts, read 10,438,868 times
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This thread is in the wrong section. My guess is that you are not interested in the opinions of atheists, but instead want a serious discussion

With that said God has made it easy to avoid hell. When offered, don't reject God's plan as found in John chapter 3.

John 3:36 says-Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God’s wrath remains on them.

Those who reject the offer. (Not talking about those who have never heard the offer. The Bible does not address those folk, so whatever is said is only speculation.) So the problem lies with the individual, not God.
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Old 04-25-2011, 02:49 PM
 
Location: Colorado
10,010 posts, read 17,547,929 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TimeMachine View Post
Moderator cut: Orphaned
This God, did it on purpose. He created us, with flaws and all, knowing we would sin, and still punishes us for it ( oh and claims we have free will, alot of BS there). Seems somewhat masochistic to me.

Last edited by june 7th; 04-27-2011 at 08:08 AM..
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Old 04-25-2011, 03:00 PM
 
5,187 posts, read 6,123,764 times
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It is man's fault , if one did not want to be a part of the Kingdom of Heaven or we will say he wanted to be apart from God, than man got his wish and went to the alternative.
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Old 04-25-2011, 08:51 PM
 
Location: Brooklyn
40,051 posts, read 31,878,693 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Simeon11 View Post
"If a man goes to Hell, has he failed or has God failed."
First it has to be determined if there is even such a place as Hell...or if it is an imaginary construct. (That could conceivably have something to do with why the question is never answered, as you say).
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Old 04-25-2011, 09:02 PM
 
Location: Golden, CO
2,108 posts, read 2,636,276 times
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I wrote this on the subject a long time ago:

God supposedly is entirely responsible for creating us; he gave us ever attribute we were born with. Now, some say that he did not give us our fallen natures, that we inherited that as a result of the Fall of Adam and Eve. But, he set up the Fall, and he created Adam and Eve with the capacity to be beguiled, surely god knew when he gave them the capacity to be beguiled that Satan would beguile them and they would eat. It is bad thinking to think they had a choice. They ate the fruit because they were tricked; they were tricked because god did not sufficiently equip them so that they would not be tricked by Satan. It is god's fault that they were tricked, since he could have prepared them but did not. And it is god's fault that we have fallen natures and weaknesses. If we don't ask god to help us overcome our weaknesses, it is because we did not have enough faith or we are mistrustful or we have a rebellious spirit. God could have given us enough faith but did not, he could have made us more trusting or given us the experiences to make us more trusting but did not, he could have given us a less rebellious spirit, but did not. We do what we do because of what we are, and we are what we are because god made us that way. Sometimes, we are what we are due to how our parents raised us or due to what others have done to us. Those people are the way they are because of what came before them and on and on until one gets back to the creation of Adam and Eve, which is all god's fault. At each moment of decision, when we could go this way or that, there is a reason why we go the way we go. Whether it is because we were more tempted or inclined to go that way or for some other reason, god could have made the way less tempting, just enough for us to choose the other way, god could have made us more inclined to go the other way, but he didn't. So, how is it right for him to judge us for what we do when we do what we do because of the inclinations, strengths, weaknesses, etc, he gave us. If he wanted a different result, he could have made us stronger and our lives would have played out differently.


We did not choose to be made or to go through this earth-test, why can't god be merciful and wipe us out of existence when we die if we were bound for hell? Non-existence is preferable to eternal torment. Why bring us into existence to live for 75 years and then torture us forever if we did not do what god wanted in those first 75 years? And even if we do exactly what god wants, our reward is to praise god forever. Doesn't this seem narcissistic to you? It is as if I created a bunch of robots to eternally worship me and tell me how great I am. If the robots worship me for the first 75 minutes of their lives, I reward them by allowing them to worship me forever, if not, then I send them to robot hell to be tortured forever. Moderator cut: edit

Last edited by june 7th; 04-27-2011 at 08:10 AM..
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Old 04-25-2011, 09:06 PM
 
Location: Sierra Nevada Land, CA
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I find it amusing that atheists are speculating about the behavior of an entity they believe does not exist.
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Old 04-25-2011, 09:12 PM
 
Location: earth?
7,288 posts, read 11,687,114 times
Reputation: 8956
What about a woman?
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Old 04-25-2011, 09:27 PM
 
Location: Golden, CO
2,108 posts, read 2,636,276 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post
I find it amusing that atheists are speculating about the behavior of an entity they believe does not exist.
Hey, smart people are good at thinking about the hypothetical and reasoning through it to its logical conclusion.
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