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Old 09-27-2011, 01:26 PM
Location: S. Wales.
48,702 posts, read 14,633,818 times
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"Before the birth of Marduk, (Bel -Marduk) there were two primeval gods: Apsu, god of the sweet waters; and his wife, Tiamat, goddess of the salt waters. This pair produced children, who in turn gave birth to Marduk and other deities. In time, a great conflict arose between the young gods and the primeval gods. Tiamat created an army of demons to attack and destroy the young gods. After giving her son Kingu the tablets of destiny, which allowed him to command the gods in her service, Tiamat placed him in charge of the army. The young gods chose Marduk as their champion to do battle with Tiamat. He accepted on the condition that he be named the leader of all the gods.
Armed with a net, a bow, a mace, and the four winds, Marduk went out to face Tiamat. She appeared in the form of a dragon. Marduk caught Tiamat in his net, but she opened her mouth to swallow him. At that point, Marduk drove fierce winds into her mouth, causing her body to blow up like a balloon. He then shot an arrow at Tiamat's heart and killed her. After splitting her body into two pieces, he set one piece in the sky to create the heavens and the other at his feet to form the earth."

Read more: Marduk - Myth Encyclopedia - god, names, world, creation, children Marduk - Myth Encyclopedia - god, names, world, creation, children

That's from Babylonian writings. Perhaps you have a different translation?

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Old 09-27-2011, 02:55 PM
Location: toledo
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Smile The babylonian legend of the the gate of Ishtarr

Well the gates of babylon are actually very well known this modern day known as "the Ishtarr gate" Well Babylonian king Belshazzar demanded the building of this gate yet legend goes he had a dream a teriffying dream. In the dream he saw Ishtarr the Sun godess and the god of fertility & war whom told him if you do not stop the rise of Israel then your empire will be a failure Ishtarr saw and predicted his own death saying Israel and their god is becoming a nuisence to the true God "marduk". As the story lingers on he told his slaves whom where of these three tribes of isreal: Juda, Ephraim, & Issachar to build Ishtarr gate to show his dominance during the time. Soon the greatest monument to Babylonia is this great gate. Even modern day muslims including most famously Sadaam Hussein try to rebuild the Babylonian empire even archaeology has proven that the ishtaar gate exists!
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Old 09-27-2011, 09:03 PM
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Originally Posted by moloch123 View Post
I think it was because the stories where to hard to believe to be put in the biblical canon. In fact not all the apocrypha where considered heretical only a small amount mainly the "nag hammadi library" which contained gnostic books including "gospel of judas", "gospel of mary" & the gospel of light which taught that Jesus was just a man not divine but the gnostics basically came from what is now Alexandria Egypt!!!
It's a little more complex than that. The Nag Hammadi library consists of mainly Gnostic writings that arose many hundreds of years after the Greek additions to Daniel - which are not Gnostic in any way. You're starting to confuse two different canons, and two different religions.
I've already listed one of the reasons many works did not make it into the Jewish canon - their distrust of anything written in Greek once Hellenism had taken hold (that's an oversimplification, but it must be for now). The most bizarre instance of this is the exclusion of the various stories of the Maccebees (stories that are crucial to Judaism's history, not to mention the holiday of Hannukah) from the Jewish canon.

The history of post-biblical Judaism and early Christianity is fascinating, and overlooked by many people - especially many protestants who see this strange 400 year gap of silence between the "Old Testament" and the "New Testament", but have no actual knowledge of what transpired and how important it was.
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Old 09-28-2011, 03:59 AM
Location: S. Wales.
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Good post. I see where this revised Marduk story came from. Incidentally, that explains the representations of dragons on the walls of Babylon. They relate to this legend, not to surviving dinosaurs.

In fact I see much of the Bible as relating to the few centuries BC. For Example Jeremiah's 'Tyre' prophecy dates it to the decades after the Alexander attack on the city and probably relates to the Seleucid domination of Judea. Daniel specifically dates to just before the Maccabean revolt and Isaiah's Babylon 'prophecy' dates to the fall of the city to the Persians but obviously not long after as it supposes that the city would be destroyed and abandoned, which never happened of course. I think examination of the OT would date it to a lot later than is generally held to be the case.
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Old 01-22-2013, 03:58 PM
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Daniel was written around 536 b.c. and the reason that Bel and the Dragon was not included was there is reference to God and it did not fit into any of the context of the overall book. I have found that most people have not read the book and also studied the placement of the book in the history of the nation of Israel.
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