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Old 04-29-2012, 04:09 PM
 
238 posts, read 269,355 times
Reputation: 50

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Quote:
Originally Posted by whoppers View Post
... the point of the OP's extremely bigoted statements concerning why the Jews "deserved" to endure the Holocaust.
Do YOU think millions of Jews deserved to die, Lucknow?
Are you one of those antique bigots who have excluded yourself from modern Theology
in favor of an older, out-dated view?
So, what do you think of the Bible verses, which I used to prove my point in the OP?

And does your modern theology not agree with these verses?

 
Old 04-29-2012, 04:11 PM
 
1,553 posts, read 1,830,247 times
Reputation: 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by evangelist-77 View Post
”There is absolutely no rationalistic explanation for the Holocaust except for the fact
that it was a Divine decree … why it happened is above human comprehension –
but it is definitely not because of punishment for sin.”
From: Texts & Writings - Jewish Books - Learning & Values (a Jewish website)
This is the prevailing Jewish attitude, due to either total ignorance or denial of the simple truth.

The truth of the situation is explained from Old Testament Scriptures below ...
There are some points here worth of explanation:
  • The chosen people of God:
God bestowed on them guidance to know Him: One God without associate or equal: they are His people whom He choses as long as they observe the Ten Commandments and in particular the most important of all the Commandments: [The First Commandment]
Once they fall in the idolatry: they are no longer His people.
He sends them His apostles: to tell them the First Commandments: God is One without associate or son or equal, and God is the only Patron; so when they disobey and deny the apostles: they are no longer His people.

So it is conditional: they serve God alone --> they are His people; but they serve the calf, Astaroth and the star Sirius --> He refuses them, and they are no longer His chosen people.
Israel Is Divorced

At the time of Moses: those who worshipped God alone and observed the Ten Commandments and obeyed Moses, the messenger of God --> they were His people whom He chose: because they worship Him and He guided them.

At the time of Jesus: those who refused Jesus (he told them the most important commandment is the First Commandment) --> they were not the chosen people of God.

Those who obeyed Jesus and devoted themselves to God alone --> they were the chosen people of God.

Those who obeyed Mohammed that God is One without associate --> they are the chosen people of God: He guided them to devote themselves to Him alone without associate.
Muslims who believe in God alone without associate and believe in all the apostles of God --> they are the people chosen by God, as long as they devote themselves to God alone, without enthusiasm about the imams and sheikhs.
 
Old 04-29-2012, 04:37 PM
 
238 posts, read 269,355 times
Reputation: 50
Eanaseer and others,

NOT even taking into account the leading, guidance, confirmations,
and spiritual experiences of Christians provided by God Almighty ...

ONLY taking into account God's Holy Scriptures
(because Muslims are interested ONLY in black letters on white paper) ...

We see another of God's WARNINGS written in 1 John 4:1-3.

It provides a spiritual TEST for people to use when confronted by someone.
It warns people to beware of those who are controlled by spirits
who will NOT affirm that Jesus Christ (i.e. God) came in the flesh.

Everyone knows that Jesus Christ came in the flesh, but what these verses are talking about is that ...
God came in the flesh (i.e. was born on the earth).

Bottom line ...

The Bible warned everyone (e.g. people like Mohammed) to TEST spirits who come to them.

IF Mohammed had tested this "angel" "Gabriel", would he have passed this test?

NO ... because the message this "Gabriel" came with is ANOTHER GOSPEL,
which does NOT affirm that God was born on the earth, etc.

Satan >>> Gabriel >>> Mohammed >>> Qur'an >>> Islam
 
Old 04-29-2012, 04:52 PM
 
1,553 posts, read 1,830,247 times
Reputation: 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by evangelist-77 View Post
”There is absolutely no rationalistic explanation for the Holocaust except for the fact
that it was a Divine decree … why it happened is above human comprehension –
but it is definitely not because of punishment for sin.”
From: Texts & Writings - Jewish Books - Learning & Values (a Jewish website)
This is the prevailing Jewish attitude, due to either total ignorance or denial of the simple truth.

The truth of the situation is explained from Old Testament Scriptures
I surprise didn't anyone read the Book of Levites, chapter 26 ?
"14 'But if you will not listen to me, and will not do all these commandments;
15 and if you shall reject my statutes, and if your soul abhors my ordinances, so that you will not do all my commandments, but break my covenant;
16 I also will do this to you: I will appoint terror over you, even consumption and fever, that shall consume the eyes, and make the soul to pine away; and you will sow your seed in vain, for your enemies will eat it. I will set my face against you, and you will be struck before your enemies. Those who hate you will rule over you; and you will flee when no one pursues you.
18 'If you in spite of these things will not listen to me, then I will chastise you seven times more for your sins.
19 I will break the pride of your power, and I will make your sky like iron, and your soil like brass;
20 and your strength will be spent in vain; for your land won't yield its increase, neither will the trees of the land yield their fruit.
21 'If you walk contrary to me, and won't listen to me, then I will bring seven times more plagues on you according to your sins.
22 I will send the wild animals among you, which will rob you of your children, destroy your cattle, and make you few in number; and your roads will become desolate.
23 'If by these things you won't be reformed to me, but will walk contrary to me;
24 then I will also walk contrary to you; and I will strike you, even I, seven times for your sins.
25 I will bring a sword upon you, that will execute the vengeance of the covenant; and you will be gathered together within your cities: and I will send the pestilence among you; and you will be delivered into the hand of the enemy.
26 When I break your staff of bread, ten women shall bake your bread in one oven, and they shall deliver your bread again by weight: and you shall eat, and not be satisfied.
27 'If you in spite of this won't listen to me, but walk contrary to me;
28 then I will walk contrary to you in wrath; and I also will chastise you seven times for your sins.
29 You will eat the flesh of your sons, and you will eat the flesh of your daughters.
30 I will destroy your high places, and cut down your incense altars, and cast your dead bodies upon the bodies of your idols; and my soul will abhor you.
31 I will lay your cities waste, and will bring your sanctuaries to desolation, and I will not take delight in the sweet fragrence of your offerings.
32 I will bring the land into desolation; and your enemies that dwell therein will be astonished at it.
33 I will scatter you among the nations, and I will draw out the sword after you: and your land will be a desolation, and your cities shall be a waste. "

Therefore, here it is explained fully that when they disobey the Commandments of God, He will take revenge of them and punish them utterly.

And it is not only the Holocost as they claim: Ashor, Nabuchodonosor, Titus the Byzantite leader and at many other periods of history when they disobeyed God regarding the First Commandment and they fell in the idolatry, and disobeyed the apostles whom God sent in His name to glorify Him alone --> they were severely punished; but their pride and haughtiness prevent them from admitting the truth.

This also is applicable to all people, not only to Jews, Christians or Muslims.

They Worshiped the Idols

Last edited by eanassir; 04-29-2012 at 05:06 PM..
 
Old 04-29-2012, 04:59 PM
 
1,553 posts, read 1,830,247 times
Reputation: 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by evangelist-77 View Post
Eanaseer and others,

NOT even taking into account the leading, guidance, confirmations,
and spiritual experiences of Christians provided by God Almighty ...

ONLY taking into account God's Holy Scriptures
(because Muslims are interested ONLY in black letters on white paper) ...

We see another of God's WARNINGS written in 1 John 4:1-3.

It provides a spiritual TEST for people to use when confronted by someone.
It warns people to beware of those who are controlled by spirits
who will NOT affirm that Jesus Christ (i.e. God) came in the flesh.

Everyone knows that Jesus Christ came in the flesh, but what these verses are talking about is that ...
God came in the flesh (i.e. was born on the earth).

Bottom line ...

The Bible warned everyone (e.g. people like Mohammed) to TEST spirits who come to them.

IF Mohammed had tested this "angel" "Gabriel", would he have passed this test?

NO ... because the message this "Gabriel" came with is ANOTHER GOSPEL,
which does NOT affirm that God was born on the earth, etc.

Satan >>> Gabriel >>> Mohammed >>> Qur'an >>> Islam
Wrong, your argument is weak.
Nothing of this told by God Almighty.
You know Who is God: the Creator of the galaxies: the earth (with all its Jesus and others) is only like a dust particle in a desert or like a drop of water in an ocean.
God is incomparable to any creature; He killed Jesus and Mohammed and all generations.
 
Old 04-29-2012, 05:22 PM
 
Location: Toronto, Canada
1,948 posts, read 1,903,743 times
Reputation: 899
Quote:
Originally Posted by evangelist-77 View Post
I know it's offensive to you ... because God's Holy Scriptures are offensive to you!
News Flash ... The Bible is offensive to many people for many different reasons.
Problem is, sweet cheeks, the Bible is true ... and you're just out to lunch.
My advice to you is ... get with God's program.

the bible is offensive to many people because it advocate psychopathic behaviors. people with human decency would not want to be part of of a plan of your god who is a psychopathic monster who cannot handle rejection
 
Old 04-29-2012, 05:36 PM
 
31,387 posts, read 36,919,204 times
Reputation: 15038
Quote:
Originally Posted by evangelist-77 View Post
So, what do you think of the Bible verses, which I used to prove my point in the OP?
You mean that you used to justify your argument, you are long ways from "proving" any point.

Now if one of your 1st century Bible verses has in it something that states along the lines of:

"God in his terrible furry, made Adolf son of Hitler, rise up in the kingdom of Germany to bring terrible retribution of God's chosen people for having forsaking his only begotten son... "so on and so fourth....

You might have an argument. Otherwise, all you have is a patch work of 1st century C.E. stories passed along from some 1st century BCE sheep herders and fishermen, which just isn't enough to explain, justify or excuse the Shoah in any thing approaching a reasonable or sane manner.
 
Old 04-29-2012, 05:37 PM
 
496 posts, read 481,872 times
Reputation: 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by Meester-Chung View Post
the bible is offensive to many people because it advocate psychopathic behaviors. people with human decency would not want to be part of of a plan of your god who is a psychopathic monster who cannot handle rejection

a person would need to be pretty gullible not to realize that most of the bible is story and parable and even understood that way in ancient times...

one day people will prob see chatting about soap operas and say...hey those people were crazy. Parables stories and theatrics are part of life because people need examples to learn things. So taking everything at face value, and not recognizing the exposure and thus perpetual recourse to violence in ancient times in parables is a shallow kick at the cat for any kind of summary.

Even when I was a toddler and hearing the OT and someNT I knew it was all parable style stuff to teach the idea of not being disobedient and the concepts
in fact....the garden of eden is a parable also...we are always in the garden with a suggested apple in supposed recourse to staying on the straight and narrow. I donno what the big finding is all about when this is true. Its like saying Othello should have been shot and those people were crazy...did I get that right? well thats the point anyway. Looking for a villain or villainizing something suggests that a villain should exist, hmmm
 
Old 04-29-2012, 05:46 PM
 
31,387 posts, read 36,919,204 times
Reputation: 15038
Quote:
Originally Posted by eanassir View Post
There are some points here worth of explanation:
Sounds to me like you are all involved in some perverted sibling rivalry. Hope your gods damn you all.
 
Old 04-29-2012, 08:51 PM
 
7,991 posts, read 12,222,290 times
Reputation: 4348
Thread closed pending moderator consideration.
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