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Not being a catholic, I can still sympathize with your plight. Protestents have their problems as well. Homosexuals being ministers???? Good lord help us. I can just see a homosexual minister preaching Sunday morning on morality, then after church marching naked at a gay pride parade in the afternoon. It happens here in Seattle and I know what goes on in a gay pride parade, they have them right here in our neighborhood.
Haha. I see your location: Capital Hill in Seattle. That's the "bull's eye." I was an East Sider, living where the Californians live, but you could certainly see what happens at the parade on the evening news.
Wow, this thread has taken on an interesting spin. First, I will say that pedophilia and homosexuality aren't always one in the same.
I started this thread because, in my experiences, I have run into priests who I felt were called to this "helping profession." They actually reneged on marriage to devote their time to serve a larger group of benefactors. While there are stresses that go with being single, I have heard that being a minister's wife is not an easy job. On the other hand, I went to high school with people who were absolute jerks, who were jerks in college, who exhibited nothing in the way of Christian values (the most simple one of which was "treat others the way you want to be treated") and you ask what they were doing now. They're priests. I see. Enter Facebook. You now see that a few of them have left the priesthood, either to become activists of some kind, in a few cases for the gay community, or to enjoy the silver spoon lifestyle of their family of origin. So, a person scratches their head and asks "why did they want to become a priest in the first place???"
However, cpg is right. Catholic parishes are understaffed. The number of people entering the priesthood is in decline, though the economy (great reason...NOT) has pushed that up a bit. They have to deal with baptizing, marrying, confessing, burying, going to the hospital to watch people on their death beds, the emotional drama of their flock, counseling, squelching parish gossip, and trying to keep the coffers of their churches in check.
Funny story: I was actually KICKED OUT of the altar boys. I was once assisting in Communion, holding the plate for the priest. Instead of the line-up, the people, mostly women, were lined up horizontally at the altar rail, so we were moving horizontally. I spotted one of my Mom's friends up ahead. As the priest was giving this one lady Communion, I moved on and passed up some 3 ladies and held the plate in front of my Mom's friend! Oh well, I then had more time to play with my neighborhood friends. My parents thought it was funny and didn't make a big deal about it.
and yet some are intent on babbling on about homosexuality, peodophilia and priests.
Regarding men who joined the priesthood, and then left... well its probably better than staying just because. I'm not that suprised that some will join, and realise its not a life for them. Or they meet someone, and because the RCC refuses to move with time, priests have to leave.
You are off the wall. I was merely noting where the poster lives, with respect to their comment.
I'm trying to understand what you want in this sharing of opinions, other then to nail RCC to the wall on married priests in order to try and figure out how to get an application in, or some other objective. Everything you post is anti RCC, the very subject of the thread....so whats the deal?
I'm trying to understand what you want in this sharing of opinions, other then to nail RCC to the wall on married priests in order to try and figure out how to get an application in, or some other objective. Everything you post is anti RCC, the very subject of the thread....so whats the deal?
What's the deal? Some of the biggest maladjusted jerks I knew in Catholic school became priests, suddenly became "pious," enjoyed their throne of respectability and mucky-muck positions FOR A WHILE, and then left to do an odd assortment of things. I guess the free room and board + benefits worked for a while. That's all. Yes, I can honestly say that a large percentage of the clergy shouldn't be in that job and are not deserving of the respect that goes with it, making it hard to take when the transformation of bread and wine occurs during the Eucharistic prayer.
You know it would seem that you have this thing about homosexuality and yet it has nothing to do with what is happening within the roman catholic church. Homosexuality has nothing to do with pedophiles, those are two entirely different subjects and yet you seem to want to put the two together as one, makes one wonder about yourself peter-1....hmmm.
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Oh really....explain this then....society wants to call this pedophilia, the victim is bigger then his dad, has a full beard and is slightly handicapped mentally....This is the subject we are discussing. and you want to say homosexual-crime has nothing to do with it? What is your interest here exactly, protect the criminal?
Nope, homosexuality has absolutely nothing to do with pedophilia. If a pedophile even has an adult orientation, they are overwhelmingly heterosexual, married, and religious.
Other researchers have taken different approaches, but have similarly failed to find a connection between homosexuality and child molestation. Dr. Carole Jenny and her colleagues reviewed 352 medical charts, representing all of the sexually abused children seen in the emergency room or child abuse clinic of a Denver children's hospital during a one-year period (from July 1, 1991 to June 30, 1992). The molester was a gay or lesbian adult in fewer than 1% in which an adult molester could be identified – only 2 of the 269 cases (Jenny et al., 1994).
The research to date all points to there being no significant relationship between a homosexual lifestyle and child molestation. There appears to be practically no reportage of sexual molestation of girls by lesbian adults, and the adult male who sexually molests young boys is not likely to be homosexual (Groth & Gary, 1982, p. 147).
Nope, homosexuality has absolutely nothing to do with pedophilia. If a pedophile even has an adult orientation, they are overwhelmingly heterosexual, married, and religious.
True -from what I've read and heard experts say, homosexuality and pedophilia are, most of the time, mutually exclusive. The former is about parameters of attraction. The latter is about exercising power and overcompensation, and those not empowered are their victims.
But taking this back to priests, I think that the ones with a homosexual orientation generally don't make good priests, for a variety of reasons: they are in it for the wrong reasons, they are haughty, they love the glad handing, and they do "tea with the ladies" real well. There are exceptions. Such an exception would be the Franciscan priest in NYC who perished during 9/11 while trying to help people get out of the towers.
Sure, there are some curmudgeon heterosexual priests. They are just as bad, but in different ways.
The religion is at a real crossroads right now, complete with scandals in the hierarchy at the Vatican. I do not care for the current Pope. I think a more liberal, middle-aged Pope hailing from South America would be a wise move. Many Catholics who stop practicing cite the "disconnect" with the clergy as being a reason for doing so.
This belongs here, on the general Religion thread, thus allowing all to view it and comment on it, rather than have to drill down.
The Roman Catholic church has its share of black eyes. The most recent, and long-lasting one, is the sexual abuse scandals that have rocked numerous dioceses and have disappointed many adherents to the faith...and the "sweep it under the rug" factor that has gone with it. The RC hierarchy can be pretty smug.
Here's a topic that Catholic scholars address from "within" the church - the prevalence of homosexuality in the clergy. Their "internal" estimates go from low to high.
Since I'm fairly analytical and observant, and have gone through Catholic school the whole way through, I would probably slice up the pie chart this way:
- 40 % of those in the clergy are in it because they are altruistic and were truly called to this helping profession
- 30 % of those in it didn't know what else to do - they tried different jobs, it's a family expectation, it's cultural, etc.
- 30 % of those in it choose it because it "legitimizes" their sexual preference and makes them a respected person
I would probably say that I only like about 40% of the RC clergy, and it's probably the first segment I describe. They seem sincere and truly interested in bettering the spiritual lives of their flock. The next 30% comes off as kind of indifferent and some of these crusty old priests are insufferable and need to retire. Lastly, the other 30% sort of come across as a joke - they can be haughty, elitist and pi$$y. There are so many people in this group who leave the profession to become...surprise...activists for gay groups and causes.
If the last 30% would actually fall into the first 40% I wouldn't care, but they generally don't. What's your opinion of this? Do you feel that there people in the RC clergy for the wrong reasons?
I understand these are your observations but these numbers are complete horse droppings. When you post numbers like these, you better back it up with something other than observation of your tiny sliver of the Catholic world in America. It's just counter productive. There's enough anti-Catholics already without feeding them this pile of manure.
I understand these are your observations but these numbers are complete horse droppings. When you post numbers like these, you better back it up with something other than observation of your tiny sliver of the Catholic world in America. It's just counter productive. There's enough anti-Catholics already without feeding them this pile of manure.
Tiny sliver? I've been Catholic wherever I've lived and went through the Catholic school system at various schools. I've been around the block...and the world. I'd say these are good ballpark figures.
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