Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 10-04-2012, 07:44 PM
 
63,431 posts, read 39,679,858 times
Reputation: 7785

Advertisements

The parents in this case will have to account for their presumptuousness in assuming the role of God. They will be quite surprised, I imagine. We have no such authority and should never assume it over anyone else.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 10-04-2012, 07:56 PM
 
Location: Earth Wanderer, longing for the stars.
12,406 posts, read 18,905,983 times
Reputation: 8910
It's a crazy world in which our society argues against the torture of prisoners and yet condones it in our ill family members - in the name of a just and compassionate god.

I think this way of thinking is diminishing, but I don't understand it.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-04-2012, 10:37 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,501 posts, read 16,979,040 times
Reputation: 7539
I often wonder if assisted suicide is morally different from artificial prolonging of life. Voth of them are interfering with the live cycle. If one is morally wrong I do not see how the other would not be. Likewise if one is morally right i do not see how the other would not be.

While I oppose suicide for any reason, I hope I acknowledge that is only my view and one I can not impose upon others

I do oppose any extraordinary measures to keep a person alive, unless there is a strong reason to believe the person will make a satisfactory recovery and return to an independent life,
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-05-2012, 06:25 AM
 
7,801 posts, read 6,341,569 times
Reputation: 2988
This is one of the dangers of religion in my view. One user has already espoused the concept that this is somehow the role of god to decide and Li's own views on suicide have historically been more than abhorrent and horrific to me and shameful in the extreme.

Yet clearly as others have pointed out there is a chasm of difference in our views on this matter. While putting a human out of their misery is seen as immoral, prolonging that suffering in the same way in animals could have one convicted of animal cruelty. There is a disparity here which needs to be addressed in our moral and ethical discourse on the matter and I think our species needs to invest more time on resolving this issue around the table.

The issue for me is that this invention of a god with opinions on the matter... a god no one is able to substantiate the existence of in any way much less the users on this thread... that we somehow need to pander to; we cloud and obfuscate discourse on the subject. This heaping of the responsibility onto the "god" placeholder with the view of abdicating our own responsibility is abhorrant and is nothing more than an excuse for inaction where action is required.

We are here. We are now. We need to decide using honest mutual discourse how to deal with cases like this. Labeling this the purview of god and interference as being against gods plan is a cop out at best... and truly damaging at worst. We need discourse on this matter urgently in modern society as our abilities to prolong the suffering of such patients increases annually... and that discourse is not going to be helped by clouding it with fantastical unsubstantiated nonsense claims about the existence of some sky fairy who... even if real.... would likely want us to make the right choices using our own moral intuitions rather than abdicate them behind the excuse of not wanting to interfere with some imagined "plan" or "role" that said god has for us.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-06-2012, 07:34 AM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,579 posts, read 86,604,351 times
Reputation: 36642
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
The parents in this case will have to account for their presumptuousness in assuming the role of God. They will be quite surprised, I imagine. We have no such authority and should never assume it over anyone else.

I assume the role of God all the time. I make value judgments, based on my sense of "the right thing" and they may have a ripple effect on other people's lives. If there turns out to be an afterlife, I will not be afraid to account for myself before an Almighty who knows my heart. I doubt that I would be "quite surprised".
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-06-2012, 07:56 AM
 
13,640 posts, read 24,423,787 times
Reputation: 18580
IMO, no greater love has a parent for an adult child then to allow them to make the decision of prolonged pain and agony to suit the living, or to go gently to "sleep" on a morphine drip surrounded by their loved ones.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-06-2012, 08:29 AM
 
Location: Not.here
2,828 posts, read 4,319,624 times
Reputation: 2377
The update on the story.....

Quote:
It’s now in Grace’s hands.

A state appeals court ruled Friday that Grace Sung Eun Lee’s parents can’t override the terminally ill woman’s right to die.

It wasn’t clear when she would decide to be taken off life support, but her lawyer, David Smith, says the court decision makes it clear that Lee is in control.

Read more: Court rules that Grace Sung Eun Lee
A very difficult time for this family with their suffering exposed to the world and the stage of public opinion.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-06-2012, 11:54 AM
 
63,431 posts, read 39,679,858 times
Reputation: 7785
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88;26400930[B
]I assume the role of God all the time.[/b] I make value judgments, based on my sense of "the right thing" and they may have a ripple effect on other people's lives. If there turns out to be an afterlife, I will not be afraid to account for myself before an Almighty who knows my heart. I doubt that I would be "quite surprised".
And this is the danger and deleterious effect of misguided religious belief . . . those who so profoundly misunderstand God that they think themselves qualified to act as if they are God . . . or act in place of God as if they have the authority to do so. The courts are correct in denying the parents any such authority or control over their daughter's life.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-06-2012, 02:05 PM
 
Location: Northeastern US
19,750 posts, read 13,280,750 times
Reputation: 9734
There is such a thing as rational suicide. Most people haven't even considered that someone can be not at all clinically depressed and yet wish their life to end in a way and under circumstances of their own choosing, rather than in more painful and less dignified ways.

My body and my life are mine to do with as I choose. Ethically speaking, because others love me and/or depend on me, rational suicide is not something to entertain without significant reason, typically, diagnosed certain death and/or open-ended physical and/or mental torment that I don't choose to deal with. However, the ethics are not for others to weigh for me, I have to do it for myself.

Some months ago a beloved pet of mine suffered from intervertebral disc disease, which rendered her paralyzed from the mid-back down and in excruciating pain, with a terrible prognosis for recovery and high likelihood of recurrence. With great sadness, we put her out of her misery. It was the humane and right thing to do, and to do otherwise would have been selfish and cruel. I simply want the same mercy for myself if I reach the clearing at the end of my path in a similar fashion.

The only thing distasteful and disturbing about rational suicide is that you're on your own if that's the way you want to go -- that you don't have the support and comfort of society and loved ones. Even loved ones who want to be present for you are taking great risks even being present for you death, as they may be accused of assisting you. That is shameful and needs to change.

The closest thing we have is Oregon's assisted suicide laws which require you to spend all kinds of time and energy you probably don't have, as a desperately ill person, to get the state's permission to end your own life under a doctor's care. These laws also only apply for people with diagnosed life expectancy of six months or less, and by the time you jump through rings of fire and eat little pieces of glass to get that permission your six months may well be about up anyway.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-06-2012, 04:40 PM
 
9,666 posts, read 9,928,229 times
Reputation: 1910
The right to die is a liberal ideas of hopelessness , and has the spiritual authority of the dark spirit of the false prophet and Christians must not engage in supporting this ideas ....See the world can go and kill itself , but Christians has the Lord Jesus where hope comes ....
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:13 PM.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top