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Old 12-23-2012, 06:54 PM
 
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I really really want to belive in life after death...my heart believes, but my brain fights it.

my question is...what do folks think of NDE? also, I've been knocked out for procedures and do not have any recollection of the experience which makes me worry that if I cant remember being knocked out for an endoscopy then I really will be toast during the big KO.

Is being KO'd for a procedure any indication to what will happen during death???

hope not!!
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Old 12-23-2012, 07:32 PM
 
Location: Northeastern US
14,309 posts, read 9,916,772 times
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Being unconscious is not the same thing as a near death experience -- experience being the operative word; you have to be conscious to some degree to have an experience.

Personally I think that NDEs are a form of lucid dreaming; there are people who swear up and down that it's something more. The experiences can be transformative for some people. Some effort has been made to scientifically investigate the phenomenon, but to date, I haven't seen anything definitive come out of those efforts. That is essentially all that can be said with certainty about the matter.

Recognizing, as you do, that you really WANT to believe in life after death, you are forewarned that you'll have a tendency to seize upon any indication of the "reality" of NDEs and thus will be prone to confirmation bias.

The more interesting question to me, is why DO you really WANT to believe in life after death? Why does anyone? And define what you mean by "life after death". I think it's instructive to ask yourself: why is "life after death" nearly always thought of as a highly idealized form of life on earth? Life on earth minus its suffering, pain, disappointments, boredoms and annoyances. Why wouldn't people bother to envision life after death as just a simple continuation of life on earth, or as even inferior to life on earth? Well, it's because we are displacing the resolution of all our insoluble problems to a safe distance away so we won't be so disheartened by them.

We yearn for life after death because we've been condition to do so. It's like being in love with the idea of being in love. Once you let go of such illusory things, these concerns fade away and seem strangely irrelevant. You're then free to focus on life itself, to make the most of it. You're also less self-absorbed, because really, having an afterlife that's all about you and what you want is just an elaboration of thinking that life is all about you and what you want.
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Old 12-23-2012, 07:33 PM
 
Location: Sierra Nevada Land, CA
9,301 posts, read 10,387,567 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carrot View Post
I really really want to belive in life after death...my heart believes, but my brain fights it.

my question is...what do folks think of NDE? also, I've been knocked out for procedures and do not have any recollection of the experience which makes me worry that if I cant remember being knocked out for an endoscopy then I really will be toast during the big KO.

Is being KO'd for a procedure any indication to what will happen during death???

hope not!!
Anti-theists don't like NDEs. They work really hard to explain NDE away. Scary for them. Look into the NDE with an open mind.
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Old 12-23-2012, 07:46 PM
 
7,379 posts, read 7,067,095 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carrot View Post
I really really want to belive in life after death...my heart believes, but my brain fights it.

my question is...what do folks think of NDE? also, I've been knocked out for procedures and do not have any recollection of the experience which makes me worry that if I cant remember being knocked out for an endoscopy then I really will be toast during the big KO.

Is being KO'd for a procedure any indication to what will happen during death???

hope not!!
I agree with Mr5150, investigate it with an open mind. But, make sure you look for real evidence. Those who have a propensity to blindly believe what they have been told, have a tendency to believe in NDE's.
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Old 12-23-2012, 08:05 PM
 
Location: Southern California
1,893 posts, read 1,895,531 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carrot View Post
I really really want to belive in life after death...my heart believes, but my brain fights it.

my question is...what do folks think of NDE? also, I've been knocked out for procedures and do not have any recollection of the experience which makes me worry that if I cant remember being knocked out for an endoscopy then I really will be toast during the big KO.

Is being KO'd for a procedure any indication to what will happen during death???

hope not!!
I totally believe in NDE. I spoke with someone last week who said that her mother had one before her ultimate passing and she reported that there's "something out there," which I believe in, too.

Being KO'd isn't the same as death. If you're interested in reading a spirit message, here's one from a woman who described what happened. Prior to her passing, she had a fear of death and when it came, she had no fear at all and she was as alive as she had been on earth; however, in a new body - a spirit body.

"When I realized that the time had come for me to go, I did not fear to do so, but calmly waited, and thought that all my sufferings would soon end. And when my spirit left the body, I commenced to feel as if I was rising out of it, and that I was going upward to the place that I had so often heard my father speak about...."

Helen Padgett
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Old 12-23-2012, 08:10 PM
 
Location: Yuma, Az
344 posts, read 358,548 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carrot View Post
I really really want to belive in life after death...my heart believes, but my brain fights it.

my question is...what do folks think of NDE? also, I've been knocked out for procedures and do not have any recollection of the experience which makes me worry that if I cant remember being knocked out for an endoscopy then I really will be toast during the big KO.

Is being KO'd for a procedure any indication to what will happen during death???

hope not!!
I'm with you; I'm scared of death. It ranks higher than either my fear of rodents, or my fear of spiders. I think it is really difficult to image nothing, which is what I figure death is like. "Nothing" is not the same as empty dark silence. Empty dark silence is something and a person would be aware of it. Death is zero. Personally, I can't figure out how to wrap my mind around it.

A near death experience is in all likelihood not a glimpse into an afterlife. It is the brain starved of the necessities to function and consequently it is manufacturing odd images and apparitions. I will say that for us folks longing for an afterlife, it offers some hope. It is like being thirsty and in the desert without any water, and about to pass overhead is a tiny little cloud. It probably won't provide any rain, but one can always hope.
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Old 12-23-2012, 08:36 PM
 
Location: Toronto, Canada
1,572 posts, read 1,363,807 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post
Anti-theists don't like NDEs. They work really hard to explain NDE away. Scary for them. Look into the NDE with an open mind.

Contrary to popular belief, research suggests that there is nothing paranormal about these experiences. Instead, near-death experiences are the manifestation of normal brain function gone awry, during a traumatic, and sometimes harmless, event.

Trends in Cognitive Sciences - There is nothing paranormal about near-death experiences: how neuroscience can explain seeing bright lights, meeting the dead, or being convinced you are one of them


The Out-of-Body Experience: Disturbed Self-Processing at the Temporo-Parietal Junction


The Out-of-Body Experience: Disturbed Self-Processing at the Temporo-Parietal Junction
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Old 12-23-2012, 11:02 PM
Status: "Celebrating." (set 9 days ago)
 
Location: Ontario, Canada
30,044 posts, read 15,794,443 times
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I nearly died as a 10-year-old. I would not call it a classic NDE. There was no tunnel or white light.

What there was, was a sense of panic, fighting, acceptance and peace -like dominoes tumbling one into the other - all within a couple of moments of not being able to breathe.

Then there was being pulled out of the water and being dragged on shore. Upon opening my eyes at that point is when realization and truth rushed in to illuminate every pore of my still-panting being: I was the same as the sand and the grass on the beach where I laid. The same - yet unique - as each grain of sand and each blade of grass was unique unto itself.

The next five decades have largely been spent trying to fully understand the experience. Can't say I have, yet. But since that day, death has lost much of its sting. I don't sweat the small stuff. And I understand that most of what consumes us is small stuff.

I also learned that life is to be appreciated. I am grateful for every day.
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Old 12-24-2012, 01:04 AM
 
476 posts, read 424,970 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCalAngel2009 View Post
I totally believe in NDE. I spoke with someone last week who said that her mother had one before her ultimate passing and she reported that there's "something out there," which I believe in, too.

Being KO'd isn't the same as death. If you're interested in reading a spirit message, here's one from a woman who described what happened. Prior to her passing, she had a fear of death and when it came, she had no fear at all and she was as alive as she had been on earth; however, in a new body - a spirit body.

"When I realized that the time had come for me to go, I did not fear to do so, but calmly waited, and thought that all my sufferings would soon end. And when my spirit left the body, I commenced to feel as if I was rising out of it, and that I was going upward to the place that I had so often heard my father speak about...."

Helen Padgett

I certainly don't buy the explanation that NDE are a form of dreaming. I dream every night, and wake up forgetting them instantly. People with NDE remember the experience in great detail even years after the event.
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Old 12-24-2012, 07:45 AM
 
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
24,682 posts, read 49,084,410 times
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I'm in a similar position to you carrot. I think your fears that consciousness is entirely generated by the brain are understandable. It does seem that when you're knocked out or in a coma your brain is just 'switched off' and all consciousness drains away...or when someone has Alzheimer's and their consciousness/awareness seems to drip out of them like water from container. If it makes you feel better, I don't think conscious is as reliant on the brain as it seems, although I still think the brain plays a major role. We still don't know just how consciousness is generated and what role the brain plays. I have my theories. Perhaps it picks up signals like a radio receiver or is a container that 'holds' consciousness like water. Either way, it's possible we were around before birth, maybe as some sort of incorporeal spiritual essence created by or part of God. It would make sense. Many people around the world believe in re-incarnation. Of course, there's the equally scary possibility of a negative afterlife, but I can't conceive of a Universe where most people end up in some place of torments forever. I'd say don't give up hope just yet...don't put ALL your faith in NDE's less they disappoint you. Try and read what different religions teach on the afterlife.etc, pray to God, even if your faith is weakened.
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