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Old 10-25-2007, 11:35 AM
 
Location: Florida
5,493 posts, read 7,312,385 times
Reputation: 1506

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Quote:
Originally Posted by satanoid View Post
First of all, how was it a sacrifice when jesus was only subjected to a few days of pain, and then immediately zipped back up to heaven to be with god? He 'gave his only begotten son'... oh really? It seems he sent him off for a short while, and what is that time to a being who is supposedly eternal?

What kind of sacrifice was that? God knew exactly what would happen, and knew that jesus would be right back. He didn't send jesus to hell for eternity, he reserves that 'sacrifice' for us humans, his less favored children.

Secondly, god could make a billion christs, and sacrifice them all, so what makes jesus so special?

Lastly, god makes the rules, so why is it some big sacrifice that he sends his 'son' to earth for a few decades, has him killed, and promptly brought back to heaven? He could have just said 'eh, ok you're all forgiven.' Who would argue with him?

The hours jesus spent (or who knows, maybe didn't spend) on the cross are a mere SHADOW of the pain going on all over the earth. A burn victim, a machete amputee, a molested child - may suffer a lifetime of anguish, and yet we're supposed to be impressed by a few days of torture?

The ideology behind this really confuses me... it assumes all sorts of ideas, all of which seems to be fallacious.

so are we now to debate the merits and degrees of suffering?
let's see, would an amputee rather get the arm back, then hop on the cross?
or would a victim of child abuse prefer to having loving parents while awaiting execution in treblinka?

seems ridiculous

Last edited by Oakback; 10-25-2007 at 11:38 AM.. Reason: spelling again!!!
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Old 10-25-2007, 11:36 AM
 
Location: ARK-KIN-SAW
3,434 posts, read 9,731,417 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nvxplorer View Post
Yet, here you are, a man, telling me that God doesn't have to conform to man's laws. You are using a book, written by men, as a reference.
written by men..yes..with divine help
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Old 10-25-2007, 11:40 AM
 
9,763 posts, read 10,510,765 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arguy1973 View Post
written by men..yes..with divine help
Again, spoken by a man. According to you, I should not trust the words of men.
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Old 10-25-2007, 11:42 AM
 
9,763 posts, read 10,510,765 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oakback View Post
so are we now to debate the merits and degrees of suffering?
let's see, would an amputee rather get the arm back, then hop on the cross?
or would a victim of child abuse prefer to having loving parents while awaiting execution in treblinka?

seems ridiculous
We're not talking about human suffering. We're talking about a god. The notion of an omnipotent being suffering is indeed ridiculous.
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Old 10-25-2007, 11:43 AM
 
3,695 posts, read 11,354,539 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nvxplorer View Post
I see. So, since what you are saying involves words, and only words, what exactly should I be relying on to gain an understanding of...uh...your words?
Experience. Emotion.

Do you really think the universe is so small that it can be adequately and completely described verbally?
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Old 10-25-2007, 11:49 AM
 
9,763 posts, read 10,510,765 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sean98125 View Post
Experience. Emotion.
Good. As soon as we develop a means for me to tap directly into your mind (Vulcan mind meld?), then I can understand what you mean. Until then, all we have are words, and the language you have been using is virtually incomprehensible.

Quote:
Do you really think the universe is so small that it can be adequately and completely described verbally?
We can adequately, but not yet completely, describe the universe using mathematics. I thought we were discussing God, Jesus, omnipotence and sacrifice, not the universe.
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Old 10-25-2007, 11:52 AM
 
Location: Florida
5,493 posts, read 7,312,385 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nvxplorer View Post
We're not talking about human suffering. We're talking about a god. The notion of an omnipotent being suffering is indeed ridiculous.

so you believe that a being with unlimited universal power is incapable of suffering?
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Old 10-25-2007, 11:59 AM
 
9,763 posts, read 10,510,765 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oakback View Post
so you believe that a being with unlimited universal power is incapable of suffering?
Yes.

Suffering is a human survival instinct. Pain, hunger, thirst, etc., serve to alert our minds and bodies to possible harm or death. Since a god cannot die nor be harmed, he cannot therefore suffer.
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Old 10-25-2007, 12:02 PM
 
Location: Wherabouts Unknown!
7,841 posts, read 18,965,453 times
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arguy1973 wrote:
One person goes to the moon..sees it for himself..camps out in a space ship..has a great time..a friend ask about it..but has never been there..so therefore cant grasp everything or the experience because he has never been there..he didnt climb the hills, go thru the valleys..sleep under the stars..so he cant understand it all.
Since most Christians don't believe in reincarnation, it's probably safe to say that you were NOT there to personally hear the teachings of Christ, or to witness the crucifixion. If you truly believe what you wrote above, I wonder, how can you possibly know what Christ truly taught, what he experienced hanging on that cross? Your arguments seem to boil down to reliance on the Bible, which was written after the fact by human beings who had no choice but to write their personal interpretation of what they remembered of Christ teachings. It seems like a big leap of faith to me to place so much credibility in the bible. Not that there is anything wrong with faith per se, but to place so much faith on a book leaves me scratching my head. IMO, Christianity is a misnomer. Rather than Christianity, a more apt title would be Biblianity. I'm not saying this as a put down, so I hope you don't interpret it as such. I'm suggesting Biblianity as a more accurrate description of Christainity as I perceive it to be. Just my truth as I see it. I claim no monopoly on the truth. There are many other truths equally as true as my truth.

blessings.....Franco
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Old 10-25-2007, 12:04 PM
 
Location: Florida
5,493 posts, read 7,312,385 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nvxplorer View Post
Yes.

Suffering is a human survival instinct. Pain, hunger, thirst, etc., serve to alert our minds and bodies to possible harm or death. Since a god cannot die nor be harmed, he cannot therefore suffer.

You seem to know alot about God
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