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Old 12-20-2013, 06:35 PM
pdw pdw started this thread
 
Location: Ontario, Canada
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This isn't specifically about recent events, but a general trend I am seeing which I find disgusting. People don't seem concerned with protecting the rights of religious minorities, simply because the majority of people are not effected by the removal of these rights. Reading articles on these subjects, I am unfortunately not seeing criticism of these bans but rather support from readers! Protecting the rights of minorities is a fundamental part of democracy, and it concerns me how people think it's OK to ban certain practises of minority groups. These are fundamental aspects of people's religion we are talking about. You can't take that away from people! What are your thoughts?
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Old 12-20-2013, 06:38 PM
 
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Being religious does not give you the right to harm other people or animals. Morals are above any religion.
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Old 12-20-2013, 06:48 PM
 
12,973 posts, read 15,724,146 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pdw View Post
This isn't specifically about recent events, but a general trend I am seeing which I find disgusting. People don't seem concerned with protecting the rights of religious minorities, simply because the majority of people are not effected by the removal of these rights. Reading articles on these subjects, I am unfortunately not seeing criticism of these bans but rather support from readers! Protecting the rights of minorities is a fundamental part of democracy, and it concerns me how people think it's OK to ban certain practises of minority groups. These are fundamental aspects of people's religion we are talking about. You can't take that away from people! What are your thoughts?
The society has some general rights to ban actions which are cruel or contrary to the health of an individual.

Mere religious belief does not justify an exception to such laws. There are varying religious groups that believe virtually anything. The state pursues a relatively uniform code or it has to decide which beliefs are worthy of an exception.

You might have a point on Hijab or ceremonial daggers if done in a way that has no functional effect. Banning symbols rather than actual acts is a different thing. Which one are you protesting?

I see little objection to a hijab that is simply a symbol...but lots to one that hides the full face or limits vision.
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Old 12-20-2013, 07:02 PM
pdw pdw started this thread
 
Location: Ontario, Canada
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I wouldn't ban the niqab. I believe a woman should be allowed to wear whatever she chooses. I sense a misogynistic undertone to the double standards with regards to male and female religious garments.
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Old 12-20-2013, 07:51 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Wild Colonial Girl View Post
Being religious does not give you the right to harm other people or animals. Morals are above any religion.
Being non-religious does not give the permission to be fascist, either. The Constitution is above fascism.
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Old 12-20-2013, 07:53 PM
 
12,973 posts, read 15,724,146 times
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Originally Posted by pdw View Post
I wouldn't ban the niqab. I believe a woman should be allowed to wear whatever she chooses. I sense a misogynistic undertone to the double standards with regards to male and female religious garments.
Does society have a right to see your face? Established law pretty much says it does. One cannot go around masked in public in at least some jurisdictions.

And can one wear a device that restricts vision? Certainly not if one is operating a vehicle and I might argue as well if one wishes to travel on streets and sidewalks. We make exceptions for the disabled but also for the able?
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Old 12-20-2013, 08:05 PM
 
19,942 posts, read 17,087,446 times
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Originally Posted by lvoc View Post
Does society have a right to see your face? Established law pretty much says it does. One cannot go around masked in public in at least some jurisdictions.

And can one wear a device that restricts vision? Certainly not if one is operating a vehicle and I might argue as well if one wishes to travel on streets and sidewalks. We make exceptions for the disabled but also for the able?
I do agree there.....if you want an ID, the police have a right to expect to be able to see your face.
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Old 12-20-2013, 08:32 PM
 
Location: Ontario
723 posts, read 863,802 times
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Why the hell should stupidity be tolerated? It doesn't matter if a "minority" gets upset. Something being justifiable because it's "tradition" or it's someone's "religion" is a silly notion that society as a whole needs to grow out of.
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Old 12-20-2013, 08:41 PM
 
Location: Sinking in the Great Salt Lake
13,139 posts, read 22,715,399 times
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I guess there really is nothing new under the sun.

This is not a religious tolerance issue, it's just a symptom of culture clash and it happens whenever a new group of people start to feel threatening (rightly or wrongly) to the majority of another culture. Curious or seemingly impractical religious practices are simply easy targets to attack.

Europe is feeling this dynamic particularly hard with the Arabs and USA with Latino immigrants.

The cure is mutual understanding and hefty amounts of cross-communication to cool those usually irrational and flat-out wrong fears and stereotypes about the "foreigners".

Get to know them... you'll find out they are people too and that while change is inevitable, you aren't in imminent danger just because they are living next door.
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Old 12-20-2013, 09:33 PM
 
Location: S. Wales.
50,079 posts, read 20,488,259 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pdw View Post
I wouldn't ban the niqab. I believe a woman should be allowed to wear whatever she chooses. I sense a misogynistic undertone to the double standards with regards to male and female religious garments.
Nor would I. I see no harm in wearing it. I would ban being obliged to wear it if a woman didn't really want to.

I also thing legal requirements transcend religious sensibilities. religious law is not above human law. We had this discussion about Amish buggies having to have warning lights or some such. Inside Amish territory, you could give them some leeway on their religious sensibilities, but if they ventured out onto the other roads outside their area, they should observe the laws of the roads.
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