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If you were a good and decent person and tried your best to be Christ-like, why not?
Why should someone be kept out of paradise simply because he/she didn't sit around all day mewling out praises to a deity that should already know how great he is - any being that needs constant reminding by such inferior beings as we must have a MASSIVE inferiority complex.
The Bible says no one is good. In our natural state, none of us seek after God. (Romans 3:10-12)
If you can lead a God-honoring life, knock yourself out. But you can't. None of us can.
Do tell everyone how that applies to the 8-year old girl who was raised by observant Jewish parents in the Warsaw Ghetto. When, exactly, did this "chance" occur?
The Bible says no one is good. In our natural state, none of us seek after God. (Romans 3:10-12)
If you can lead a God-honoring life, knock yourself out. But you can't. None of us can.
Heh, the Bible says no one is good as part of the brilliance of dismantling the psyche before irrational devotion to a cult can take place - and Christianity was little more than a messianic cult during the time of the Romans. If Constantine hadn't converted, pictures of Zeus might be in our courthouse instead of Moses.
The authors of the Bible seem to have understood such concepts as the Stockholm Syndrome and the horrible social dynamic between an abusive husband and a battered wife.
The same concepts are used in Christianity to get people to follow a brand new god unconditionally and without question. First you tear down the person, then insert your god as the answer to rebuilding yourself (and rebuilding yourself in the way the clergy wants you to).
At any rate, even if we can never be perfectly good, you're missing my point. If someone TRIES to be good and decent, that's what matters. Not whether they succeeded 100% of the time. But Christianity is all about appeasing a god you, yourself, said was wrathful.
I still can't quite wrap my brain around the concept. For thousands of years, humans have invented gods to be afraid of, thus our collective civilizations have wasted monumental amounts of resources, time, money, and lives tryng to placate our own imaginations, to stave off the boogyman under the bed, the monster in the closet. Christians like to think that they bring something new to the table - but they don't. Not really.
Christianity still introduces us to a mean-spirited, perpetually angry god that requires non-stop praise and accolades lest we find ourselves on the wrong end of a divine punishment. Christianity tries to trick us into thinking it is all about morality, but at the end of the day, none of that matters. It's all about worship, providing the love that god demands of us, and putting him first. Yeah ... demands. The only other type of person I know who actually demands love is a young child.
The long and short of it is that the Christian god is just the same old god we've been running scared from for the last 10,000 years. At least the Romans only gave grudging respect to the gods they believed controlled them ... but the Christian god has his followers totally bent and blind, just like one would expect with cult membership. Only Jesus seems to have broken from that mold, but few people care what Jesus said because he contradicts things like greed, materialism, capitalism, social Darwinism, and class privilege.
There is no way that "Jesus is God" because the two are virtually diametrically opposed to each other in terms of ideology, philosophy, and temperment.
Heh, the Bible says no one is good as part of the brilliance of dismantling the psyche before irrational devotion to a cult can take place - and Christianity was little more than a messianic cult during the time of the Romans. If Constantine hadn't converted, pictures of Zeus might be in our courthouse instead of Moses.
Do you NEVER grow tired of your constant attacking of the Bible? I mean...seriously? Why do you hate God and the Bible so much?
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At any rate, even if we can never be perfectly good, you're missing my point. If someone TRIES to be good and decent, that's what matters. Not whether they succeeded 100% of the time. But Christianity is all about appeasing a god you, yourself, said was wrathful.
But no one does try to be good. No...not one.
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I still can't quite wrap my brain around the concept. For thousands of years, humans have invented gods to be afraid of, thus our collective civilizations have wasted monumental amounts of resources, time, money, and lives tryng to placate our own imaginations, to stave off the boogyman under the bed, the monster in the closet. Christians like to think that they bring something new to the table - but they don't. Not really.
Christianity still introduces us to a mean-spirited, perpetually angry god that requires non-stop praise and accolades lest we find ourselves on the wrong end of a divine punishment. Christianity tries to trick us into thinking it is all about morality, but at the end of the day, none of that matters. It's all about worship, providing the love that god demands of us, and putting him first. Yeah ... demands. The only other type of person I know who actually demands love is a young child.
The long and short of it is that the Christian god is just the same old god we've been running scared from for the last 10,000 years. At least the Romans only gave grudging respect to the gods they believed controlled them ... but the Christian god has his followers totally bent and blind, just like one would expect with cult membership. Only Jesus seems to have broken from that mold, but few people care what Jesus said because he contradicts things like greed, materialism, capitalism, social Darwinism, and class privilege.
There is no way that "Jesus is God" because the two are virtually diametrically opposed to each other in terms of ideology, philosophy, and temperment.
The difference between Christianity and the other religions is that in Christianity God did take it totally upon himself to justify us -- meaning that we do not have to work to please him. He made provision for us to be righteous.
Makes me even more thankful for all the atheists doing good deeds, giving to charity, helping little old ladies get something off the top shelf at Target.
Do you NEVER grow tired of your constant attacking of the Bible? I mean...seriously? Why do you hate God and the Bible so much?
Do you ever get tired of preaching it? Therein lies the answer to your question.
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Originally Posted by Vizio
But no one does try to be good. No...not one.
If no one tried to be good, then we would all be living in some post-apocalyptic Mad Max world where might makes right and life is cheaper than a box of dirt. There would only be anarchy as law and order would be impossible without the will to be civil and moral (at least the morality that actually counts for something and not nonsense morality like that involving contraception.)
I can at least cautiously understand why it is said that none of us are completely good - because none of us are. Of course the world makes us that way in many respects. During a job interview, I would just love to be honest and say, "I really don't give a damn about your company or what it does. I just need a paycheck." But instead I have to lie if I want any hope of getting the job. Everything in this world is such a fight, such a struggle ... and all it takes is a single failure to ruin your life, thus people will do almost anything to avoid personal responsibility. And why not? The consquences for even small failures are almost stupidly disproportional. So we have to lie, sometimes cheat, sometimes steal - not to get something more, but to simply break even. I've learned almost from the get-go that honesty is a handicap, not a virtue.
But most of us do TRY to be good in a world where goodness and morality is so often a burden. We don't always succeed, but that is where the beauty of human morality lies. If we always succeeded, then being a good and decent person would be too easy, wouldn't it, so there would be no reason to praise it, no reason to look up to it, to strive for loftier ideals than to simply make money at whatever cost to our souls.
No matter what your religion teaches you, the mere fact that I'm sitting here right now in the security of my own home; the fact that I don't have to go out and fight a rival gang for my dinner; the fact that people are still arrested and punished for crimes ... proves to me without doubt that people try to be good.
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Originally Posted by Vizio
The difference between Christianity and the other religions is that in Christianity God did take it totally upon himself to justify us -- meaning that we do not have to work to please him. He made provision for us to be righteous.
But what does that word even mean - to be "righteous?"
Where was God - and why was He not angry - when Columbus arrived in this hemisphere, enslave the Natives, afflicted them with smallpox, forced them to mine their gold which he plundered for the Spanish crown?
Why was God not angry when these Conquistadores came to this hemisphere and falsely proclaimed they came "in the name of God" to Christianize the so-called unholy? Why was God not angry when seeing these men use His name for the purpose of their bloodthirsty greed?
Where was God's wrath then?
It seems to have been hidden then, as much as it appears to be hidden now.
He's still angry and willing to pour out his wrath on sinners.
Let me get this straight. God knew before a single human walked the planet every single thing that every human would do. And he is angry at how humans act? Sounds like a lunatic.
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