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What happens when people don't accept YOUR version of morality just because YOU say it is from God???? These are silly questions because people will always question morality that interferes with their pursuit of happiness in life. There IS no authority over men who don't accept it . . . YOUR views notwithstanding. That is the whole point. Morality is voluntary.You seem to think there is another option . . . but there isn't, Vizio. Everything we have is filtered through the lens of human beings. It is inescapable . . . though YOU seem to want to pretend that it isn't.
Yes, Doc. I recognize that if they don't want to believe in morality they will ignore it. That's actually the point....I want to know how a human being thinks he/she can declare something "moral", or "good" and be able to judge objectively another human being based on their understanding alone.
08-22-2014, 11:08 AM
2K5Gx2km
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio
If it's man-made and is based on the opinions of men....then it has no authority over men who don't accept it.
So now you are a pragmatist and/or consequentialist of some sort. You actually think that the moral system is only valid if the authority can affect men so far as they accept it or enforce it if they don't. Ironic indeed!
Now apply your point to your God morality. Follow your logic and all you will end up with is - might is right. Since so many don't accept your god morality it is obvious it has no authority over them - according to your own logic. So if authority is this then it is just a matter of the might being able to enforce an arbitrary will - whether that will is a collective or individual. And if you happen to look around you might detect that god has abdicated his throne of authority, his own duty, and left it in the hands of men. He surely does not care to undertake his duty, to his own laws, when men, who are duty bound by it, break it.
Look in the mirror Vizio all of your questions apply to you and for the record you are in a worse position, epistemologically, than anyone on here. Of course I dealt with these facades that you constantly raise many times elsewhere. You still can't understand it nor the irony of your attempts to establish God morality with such questions.
So now you are a pragmatist and/or consequentialist of some sort. You actually think that the moral system is only valid if the authority can affect men so far as they accept it or enforce it if they don't. Ironic indeed!
If it's man-made, yes. Because men have no objective authority over other men. Why is one man's opinion more valid than another?
08-22-2014, 11:26 AM
2K5Gx2km
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio
If it's man-made, yes. Because men have no objective authority over other men. Why is one man's opinion more valid than another?
Exactly, so why is your opinion that 'God Morality' is more valid?
Do you admit that one man is incapable of judging another man? That you really have no basis for even declaring Hitler to be wrong?
That's not an answer to the question.
Last edited by DewDropInn; 08-22-2014 at 11:55 AM..
08-22-2014, 11:39 AM
2K5Gx2km
n/a posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio
Do you admit that one man is incapable of judging another man? That you really have no basis for even declaring Hitler to be wrong?
That's not what I asked you. I dealt with this on another thread - in detail. Men judge people all the time on certain basis. The question is how do we judge the basis for which we make such a judgement. Which gets back to my question to you, now answer it.
Do you admit that one man is incapable of judging another man? That you really have no basis for even declaring Hitler to be wrong?
Hitler was wrong because most of the human race agrees that he was wrong.
God certainly didn't care. In fact, it can be argued that God kept Hitler alive despite 42 assassination attempts and being a messenger during WWI - one of the most dangerous jobs a soldier could have.
And why not? God was never shy about committing genocide - even against his own Chosen people. If God can wipe out entire groups of people but Hitler can't, then there can be no objective morality. And that tailspins your whole argument right into the dirt.
If it's man-made, yes. Because men have no objective authority over other men. Why is one man's opinion more valid than another?
It's this way. I can't take seriously a morality based on a book that says that telling your family to hop it, because your cult - members are now your family, is good.
What happens when people don't accept YOUR version of morality just because YOU say it is from God???? These are silly questions because people will always question morality that interferes with their pursuit of happiness in life. There IS no authority over men who don't accept it . . . YOUR views notwithstanding. That is the whole point. Morality is voluntary.You seem to think there is another option . . . but there isn't, Vizio. Everything we have is filtered through the lens of human beings. It is inescapable . . . though YOU seem to want to pretend that it isn't.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio
Yes, Doc. I recognize that if they don't want to believe in morality they will ignore it. That's actually the point....I want to know how a human being thinks he/she can declare something "moral", or "good" and be able to judge objectively another human being based on their understanding alone.
Get real, Vizio. That is all we HAVE . . . our understanding as human beings. I told you that it is ultimately determined by our PURPOSE for existing. If you cannot justify it on that basis it cannot be justified. To be clear . . . GOD said it to some human being is NOT an answer. If you cannot espouse the PURPOSE for our existence and how it is either constructive or destructive to it . . . you cannot call it morality.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio
If it's man-made, yes. Because men have no objective authority over other men. Why is one man's opinion more valid than another?
On what planet do you think we have any authority BUT one man's opinion over another????? It must be reasoned out and justified against our PURPOSE for existing. Sam Harris (an atheist btw) has proposed the use of the scientific method to discern the truth that would optimize human well-being. Do you have a better suggestion????
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